Is gender inequality in sentencing ok?

[Guest makapaka]

1 hour ago, Cyclone said:

Nor did it say that they shouldn't get custodial sentences, but you got there somehow...

 

Anyway, don't disagree is as good as it gets, so the majority of us think that circumstances should be taken into account.  So far nobody has given any reason why women specifically should be given lesser sentences.

Neither did - I said reduced sentences - or lesser sentences as you describe.

[Cyclone 10]

True, you did.  And yes, we're arguing that sentences take into account circumstances.

[OhhEnnEmm 10]

I recall reading this article when it was first published. I was disgusted, but not shocked. I'm too familiar with this messed up state of affairs. It's just that people generally turn a blind eye when males or white people are discriminated against, probably this false belief that "Young white males can't be discriminated against."

[Cyclone 10]

The idea that white people suffer discrimination from our white biased judicial system is a long way from accurate.  Young black men are far more likely to get custodial sentences and longer ones than young white men.  In fact, drop the young and the men, black people are typically given more harsh sentences than white people.

[OhhEnnEmm 10]

7 minutes ago, Cyclone said:

The idea that white people suffer discrimination from our white biased judicial system is a long way from accurate.  Young black men are far more likely to get custodial sentences and longer ones than young white men.  In fact, drop the young and the men, black people are typically given more harsh sentences than white people.

No doubt that black males have it worse. However, that doesn't mean that the idea of white people facing discrimination is far from accurate at all. It's accurate.

 

Multiple groups can be discriminated against, even simultaneously. 

 

If another group is discriminated against even more so, it doesn't change the facts that the initial group is still facing discrimination, even if it is to a lesser extent.  But you have proved my point perfectly.

 

Because black people are discriminated against more than white people in courtrooms, you're explicitly saying that "The idea that white people suffer discrimination from our white biased judicial system is a long way from accurate."

 

You justify this comment by talking about black males in the courtroom. This should be irrelevant to whether or not white males are discriminated against. They either are, or they aren't, regardless of any other group's situation within society.

 

My point is that there is discrimination against males, whether black or white. Generally, it tends to be when opposing a female. However, when a young white male complains of inequality, it is shrugged off and often scoffed at "How can a young white male complain of inequality?" 

 

It's a dangerous mindset, one that has allowed many white males to lose their children to far less capable mothers, etc.  Shrugging it off deprives people of justice. Is it fair to deprive anyone of justice just because they fit into a group that isn't as discriminated against as others? That alone is just an extra layer of discrimination.

 

If Bob next door has AIDS, it doesn't make Trevor's HIV any less of a problem to Trevor.

 

Would you tell Trevor to stop moaning because Bob has it worse?

 

I feel far stronger about discrimination against black people, yes, because it's more severe. However, I don't let my feelings regarding that issue affect my feelings regarding others, since they're irrelevant to each other.

[Cyclone 10]

If white people face discrimination in the courts, and black people face worse discrimination in the courts, who exactly isn't discriminated against?

 

I'm fairly sure that if an organisation "discriminates" against all groups, well, that's not discrimination.  Perhaps you mean they're treat harshly, but then they're courts, they're not supposed to be a soft play area.

 

Perhaps you're alluding specifically to family courts though, which is a small subsection and typically not even part of the criminal justice area that this thread is about.  When people are being sentenced there doesn't tend to be a versus, unless you're talking about offender verses victim.  And in the case of rape, I think it would be very difficult to show that men are discriminated against in favour women in terms of offender versus victim, rape reports for example have a conviction rate of about 1.3% or somethin ludicrously low.

 

All that said, women DO tend to get lighter sentences than men, and it's not simply because circumstances are being taken into account, that is effectively discrimination against men and that is exactly what this topic is about.  Colour though, particularly being white, isn't a disadvantage, and that's why you're the first person to specifically mention white men, and not just men.

 

Unless you can explain what skin colour gets comparatively better treatment (and evidence it) I'm not going to accept that being white provokes discrimination from the UK justice system.

[WiseOwl182 10]

13 hours ago, Cyclone said:

If white people face discrimination in the courts, and black people face worse discrimination in the courts, who exactly isn't discriminated against?

 

I'm fairly sure that if an organisation "discriminates" against all groups, well, that's not discrimination.  

There's huge discrimination against criminals by the courts.

[Halibut 12]

7 hours ago, WiseOwl182 said:

There's huge discrimination against criminals by the courts.

Whoosh...that one went straight over your head didn't it?

[Cyclone 10]

I think he was making a joke H.  It wasn't unfunny.

[WiseOwl182 10]

12 hours ago, Halibut said:

Whoosh...that one went straight over your head didn't it?

Said the pot to the kettle.

[Halibut 12]

13 hours ago, Cyclone said:

I think he was making a joke H.  It wasn't unfunny.

Debateable.

[WiseOwl182 10]

17 minutes ago, Halibut said:

Debateable.

*Debatable.

 

3/10. Must try harder.

 

Such criticism from you is like a dagger to my heart.

Edited June 27, 2019 by WiseOwl182