Speed Limits

[WiseOwl182 10]

1 minute ago, Longcol said:

See the first page or so of the Bochum Parkway megathread.

 

https://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/topic/466164-bochum-parkway-speed-limit/

 

Or just tell me? Irrelevant anyway since I've covered solutions to either scenario above.

Just now, GleadlessLad said:

The crossing's about 3/4 of the way along that stretch, when heading towards Norton.

 

A proper crossing with lights would be a good idea, in fact I'd say that's needed now because currently with the existing  40mph limit it can be quite difficult to cross the road safely.

 

I do see other folk using the crossing - I use the crossing about 5 times a week & I regularly see other folk using it too, when I'm out walking & also when I'm driving on that piece of road.

There you go then, a crossing with lights to make pedestrians safe and happy, and facilitating a 50mph limit to make motorists happy. Everyone's a winner.

[GleadlessLad 12]

13 minutes ago, WiseOwl182 said:

There you go then, a crossing with lights to make pedestrians safe and happy, and facilitating a 50mph limit to make motorists happy. Everyone's a winner.

Agreed - although as I've said above, there's the issue of cost.

 

You're right in posting earlier that this is a discussion about speed limits not costs, however due to the necessary safety modifications which would be required to Bochum Parkway - crash barriers plus the installation of a pelican crossing at the existing crossing point in addition to the existing "Warning - Pedestrians Crossing" signs - cost would be an inevitable factor in any decision to increase the speed limit.

 

As Sheffield Council's budget for 2019/20 has been set at a level whereby outgoings will exceed income - with the shortfall being met from reserves - I think it's unlikely that any non-essential schemes will be implemented any time soon?

Edited March 21, 2019 by GleadlessLad

[WiseOwl182 10]

36 minutes ago, GleadlessLad said:

Agreed - although as I've said above, there's the issue of cost.

 

You're right in posting earlier that this is a discussion about speed limits not costs, however due to the necessary safety modifications which would be required to Bochum Parkway - crash barriers plus the installation of a pelican crossing at the existing crossing point in addition to the existing "Warning - Pedestrians Crossing" signs - cost would be an inevitable factor in any decision to increase the speed limit.

 

As Sheffield Council's budget for 2019/20 has been set at a level whereby outgoings will exceed income - with the shortfall being met from reserves - I think it's unlikely that any non-essential schemes will be implemented any time soon?

We can live in hope.

[Foot 10]

13 hours ago, WiseOwl182 said:

We can live in hope.

You can but don't hold your breath......it'll never happen. The high cost just couldn't be justified.

[DT Ralge 10]

On 21/03/2019 at 21:47, WiseOwl182 said:

Indeed there are lots of drivers like that. There are also ones who drive so frustratingly and dangerously slow that they clearly lack confidence in their own competence to be on the road.

And there are a lot of drivers out there who over-estimate their abilities and see speed in a one-dimensional way (and don’t see driving risk in all its layers) - speed, in itself, is not harmful and does not kill (whatever the advert from the Think campaign says).

 

Look up the Swiss Cheese model of Accident Causation, understand it and see the setting of speed limits in a multi-dimensional and multi-factoral context instead. 

Ask yourself what latent and active risks are there in your or others’ day-to-day driving before claiming that it would be “perfectly safe” for you or anyone else to drive down this or that road at a higher speed than you are allowed to currently. 

 

Edited March 23, 2019 by DT Ralge

[WiseOwl182 10]

2 hours ago, DT Ralge said:

And there are a lot of drivers out there who over-estimate their abilities and see speed in a one-dimensional way (and don’t see driving risk in all its layers) - speed, in itself, is not harmful and does not kill (whatever the advert from the Think campaign says).

 

Look up the Swiss Cheese model of Accident Causation, understand it and see the setting of speed limits in a multi-dimensional and multi-factoral context instead. 

Ask yourself what latent and active risks are there in your or others’ day-to-day driving before claiming that it would be “perfectly safe” for you or anyone else to drive down this or that road at a higher speed than you are allowed to currently. 

 

Obviously conditions are taken into account too, that goes without saying. The roads I've listed previously all have suitable conditions for higher speeds, albeit Bochum Parkway would need a barrier first to make it "officially" suitable for 50 or 60mph (which most people already travel at on that road anyway, apart from anyone that posts on this forum, naturally).

 

Note that I don't condone speeding, far from it. I do condone speed limits being open to review in both directions though.

Edited March 23, 2019 by WiseOwl182

[bazjea 10]

On 21/03/2019 at 08:32, Cyclone said:

The A57 heading out of Sheffield to the ladybower could have a 60 limit.

The report commissioned by the SCC concluded and quite clearly said that there were no reasons or grounds to reduce the limit.  So the council reduced it anyway.

It's not an accident prone stretch of road, it never was, the only possible grounds I can see for reduction would be pollution, but it doesn't suffer from poor air quality.

The most modern of cars (last 5 years perhaps) have pedestrian safety features though don't they.  Pop up bonnets which in effect DO offer a crumple zone to pedestrians.  Bumper designs aimed to direct pedestrians up, rather than under, etc...

 It certainly is an acccident prone area .There  were serious accidents in 2006 2009  2017 They are  just the ones that  i can remember I don't know where you get  " Its  not an accident prone stretch of road"          just have a word with anyone who lives on that stretch road . They will be able to tell you of many more accidents some of them fatal

 

 

Edited March 23, 2019 by bazjea

[DT Ralge 10]

6 hours ago, WiseOwl182 said:

Obviously conditions are taken into account too, that goes without saying. The roads I've listed previously all have suitable conditions for higher speeds, albeit Bochum Parkway would need a barrier first to make it "officially" suitable for 50 or 60mph (which most people already travel at on that road anyway, apart from anyone that posts on this forum, naturally).

 

Note that I don't condone speeding, far from it. I do condone speed limits being open to review in both directions though.

Conditions are important ... drivers aren’t robots, though.  Physical skills or lack of them do not cause too many crashes.  It’s the stuff going on in the head or gut that gets in the way.

it’s beliefs and attitudes that drive behaviour.

So there’s other stuff going on that impacts on road safety and driver outcomes:

- driver understanding of the impact of and higher interaction with the time of day/year, weather and road conditions 

- driver understanding and proficiency in the use of any of the vehicle’s in-built technologies i.e. everything from tyres to drl’s and ABS/ESP. 

- driver attitude to vehicle checks and road-worthiness,

- driver mood and state of mind (bored, angry, anxious, upset)

- driver agenda and motivators (late, lost ..)

- driver experience/confidence levels and self-image (im not going to get stuck behind this van ...)

- driver focus and interaction with other road users (collaborative or competitive)

and so on.

[Weredoomed 10]

It would be better if Sheffield Parkway was widened to three lanes from Handsworth to Park Square in both directions. It was originally built with sufficiently wide verges and bridge abutments set back far enough for this to occur. SCC's anti-car attitude will never permit that of course. 

[Planner1 428]

1 hour ago, Weredoomed said:

It would be better if Sheffield Parkway was widened to three lanes from Handsworth to Park Square in both directions. It was originally built with sufficiently wide verges and bridge abutments set back far enough for this to occur. SCC's anti-car attitude will never permit that of course. 

What exactly do you think that would achieve? Peak time queues on the Parkway are caused by the  capacity of the junctions at the ends of it. Rotherham already have a scheme in progress to improve capacity at the J33 end.

[Cyclone 10]

4 hours ago, bazjea said:

 It certainly is an acccident prone area .There  were serious accidents in 2006 2009  2017 They are  just the ones that  i can remember I don't know where you get  " Its  not an accident prone stretch of road"          just have a word with anyone who lives on that stretch road . They will be able to tell you of many more accidents some of them fatal

 

 

It's not accident prone.  That's the analysis that was done for the council.  The number of accidents per mile for that type of road are lower than the national average.

 

You can remember 3 in what 13 years or probably more like 19 years assuming your memory goes back a bit further.

[ads36 214]

4 hours ago, Weredoomed said:

It would be better if Sheffield Parkway was widened to three lanes from Handsworth to Park Square in both directions. It was originally built with sufficiently wide verges and bridge abutments set back far enough for this to occur. SCC's anti-car attitude will never permit that of course. 

The Parkway backs up, because there's a limit to the number of cars that can get onto / through parksquare r'bout.

 

Something like 500 cars per hour, per lane, through these lights, (maybe less). 

 

Make the parkway 10 lanes wide if you want, it won't increase the flow of traffic. The queues may be shorter, but they'll be moving slower (you're still only going to get ~2000 cars per hour onto the roundabout, an amount that's easily 'delivered' by the current 2 lane approach)

 

adding an extra lane won't achieve anything, but it will cost at least £50million... It'll be hugely expensive, and totally pointless. So it's definitely going to happen, sadly...