Consequences of Brexit [part 7] Read first post before posting

[Top Cats Hat 10]

29 minutes ago, apelike said:

Quite true and that's one of the reason we have SATS. But who are the ones responsible for deciding what our children learn and how that is done.

(your response is missing a question mark! 😉)

 

Poor standards of learning and understanding are more to do with our current society than the curriculum and teaching methods.

 

As pointed out by another poster, anti-intellectualism seems to be a growing trend in UK society most dangerously among our young (particularly boys) who either don't want to been seen as 'clever' by their peers or think education is not needed as long as they have the latest Playstation and a dream of winning the lottery or becoming a celebrity.

 

To bring this post back on topic, although it is unreasonable to claim that most leave voters were stupid, it is a matter of record that the vast majority of uneducated or poorly educated citizens voted to leave. Despite blue passports and bendy bananas, the EU debate is largely one of economics yet most leave voters I know didn't, and still don't, have even a basic understanding of economics or what the EU is or how it works. I still meet people who think that freedom of movement is allowing non-white immigrants into the country, basically neither knowing nor caring that the EU and the Commonwealth are two seperate things.

 

Poor education does no one any favours except the most privileged. The response to lack of education is to seek education not wear your ignorance as a badge of honour. Your ignorance is not the equivalent of my knowledge and never will be.

[Lockjaw 11]

2 hours ago, apelike said:

 

 

Quite true and that's one of the reason we have SATS. 

Please don't tell us you believe success in SATs is an indication of an adequate education.  

 

[apelike 10]

2 hours ago, Top Cats Hat said:

(your response is missing a question mark! 😉)

No it was rhetorical so no question mark needed.

[ez8004 10]

3 hours ago, apelike said:

You may question that as you class yourself as elite and above others, you have also changed your stance from calling people uneducated now to inadequately educated which is different. Unfortunately for you five GCSEs are the standard in terms of secondary education in the UK whether you like it or not.

Employers do not think it is sufficient in professional positions. 

 

So ask yourself this, a person with only five GCSEs is going to be able to achieve what exactly?

 

I do not consider myself elite, I am a realist. I appreciate the fact that higher education is needed if you want to make a decent living. 

[apelike 10]

1 hour ago, Lockjaw said:

Please don't tell us you believe success in SATs is an indication of an adequate education.  

 

I didn't say it was only that is what we have at the moment. The fact is that the OECD (Pisa) report on international school rankings has the UK education system at 15 year olds is 15th place overall which is equal to Germany and the Netherlands and higher than most  all the other EU countries.

 

I will give the link later as I'm on the tablet and can't see how to do links.

 

 

BTW I just wonder how many on here would be prepared to pay extra taxes to ensure the education standard is upped to what people here want.

Edited May 20, 2019 by apelike

[apelike 10]

21 minutes ago, ez8004 said:

Employers do not think it is sufficient in professional positions. 

Not everybody wants or gets a professional position though. One of the reasons we have a high rate of grads who are in menial jobs.

 

Quote

So ask yourself this, a person with only five GCSEs is going to be able to achieve what exactly?

Plenty as attested by those without much in the way of qualifications that have also done well and and are now we'll off.

 

Quote

I do not consider myself elite, I am a realist. I appreciate the fact that higher education is needed if you want to make a decent living. 

Tell that to an electrician, plumber or bricklayer who is earning over 50 grand a year while some grads are serving food in McDonalds. Yes higher education is a good thing but who pays for it?See above 

 

Edited May 20, 2019 by apelike

[ez8004 10]

1 hour ago, apelike said:

Not everybody wants or gets a professional position though. One of the reasons we have a high rate of grads who are in menial jobs.

 

Plenty as attested by those without much in the way of qualifications that have also done well and and are now we'll off.

 

Tell that to an electrician, plumber or bricklayer who is earning over 50 grand a year while some grads are serving food in McDonalds. Yes higher education is a good thing but who pays for it?See above 

 

The vast majority of people who fill menial jobs are people with a significantly lower attainment of education. To say otherwise is just an outright lie. 

 

Why on Earth would I want to earn £50k/year fitting toilets when I can earn far more being a chartered engineer? 

[Top Cats Hat 10]

2 hours ago, apelike said:

BTW I just wonder how many on here would be prepared to pay extra taxes to ensure the education standard is upped to what people here want.

I would, for one.

 

A dumb population costs us much more than money.

[Car Boot 10]

3 hours ago, ez8004 said:

Employers do not think it is sufficient in professional positions. 

 

So ask yourself this, a person with only five GCSEs is going to be able to achieve what exactly?

 

I do not consider myself elite, I am a realist. I appreciate the fact that higher education is needed if you want to make a decent living. 

A person with 5 GCSE's (or less) can revolt against the ruling class and the wealthy elite by voting to Leave the EU and bringing their pampered, privileged lifestyles crashing down around them.

[tinfoilhat 11]

2 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

A person with 5 GCSE's (or less) can revolt against the ruling class and the wealthy elite by voting to Leave the EU and bringing their pampered, privileged lifestyles crashing down around them.

Yeah, make everyone poor(er)!!!

[ez8004 10]

3 hours ago, Car Boot said:

A person with 5 GCSE's (or less) can revolt against the ruling class and the wealthy elite by voting to Leave the EU and bringing their pampered, privileged lifestyles crashing down around them.

So an educated person being able to earn more, such as doctors, engineers and scientists need to be revolted against?

 

Really?  So you don't believe in an educated society and all the advantages that come with it?

[ez8004 10]

6 hours ago, apelike said:

I didn't say it was only that is what we have at the moment. The fact is that the OECD (Pisa) report on international school rankings has the UK education system at 15 year olds is 15th place overall which is equal to Germany and the Netherlands and higher than most  all the other EU countries.

 

I will give the link later as I'm on the tablet and can't see how to do links.

 

 

BTW I just wonder how many on here would be prepared to pay extra taxes to ensure the education standard is upped to what people here want.

I am already creating a nest egg so that I can send both my children to university.  By the time that happens, I think it will be around £60k a piece.  That is how much I think a good education is worth.   I don't want my kids to start adulthood with any form of financial inconvenience overhanging their heads.  Having said that, I need to see what the student loan structure is going to be then in order to determine what benefits there maybe to taking out a loan versus paying it off straight away.

 

Parents’ need to play a far more active role in their children’s education.  I can help by virtue of my engineering degree.  I have been though the system and know what it takes to succeed in it.

 

We are an absolute disappointment in the PISA ranking.  We are 23rd!  Why on Earth is that even acceptable when we have world class universities?  The Scandinavian countries knock us out the park and the far east Asian countries are ridiculous.  Why is it the Chinese Gaokao, which is their version of our A-Levels considered far more highly.  I am not even saying a bit, but massively.  A grade A* in A-Levels is worth 56pts.  The Gaokao equivalent is 64pts!

 

http://factsmaps.com/pisa-worldwide-ranking-average-score-of-math-science-reading/

 

Edited May 20, 2019 by ez8004