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Consequences of Brexit [part 7] Read first post before posting

mort

 Let me make this perfectly clear - any personal attacks will get you a suspension. The moderating team is not going to continually issue warnings. If you cannot remain civil and post within forum rules then do not bother to contribute. 

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Yet another Tory Brexiteer Andrew Bridgend on Politics Live, trying to claim that a poll shows that the majority of the population now prefer leaving with no deal.

 

Good to see the rest of the panel calling him out on it.

 

 

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4 hours ago, ads36 said:

£350million a week for the NHS, 

 

Turkey is joining the EU

 

we hold all the cards

 

no-one is talking about leaving the  single market

 

easiest trade deal in history

 

etc.

 

it's all lies,  it's all impossible, they're not even pretending it'll be a success anymore.

And yet despite the above claims the recent data shows that there is very little in terms of any percentage change either way, and that is the problem as remain are not guaranteed to win a further referendum. 

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19 minutes ago, apelike said:

And yet despite the above claims the recent data shows that there is very little in terms of any percentage change either way, and that is the problem as remain are not guaranteed to win a further referendum. 

You can't expect to lift substantially the IQ, objectivity and socio-geo-political awareness of circa. 17m people within a couple years, though, can you? Still less when the main political parties and mass media have been ramping up the populist rethoric the entire time.

Edited by L00b

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15 minutes ago, L00b said:

You can't expect to lift substantially the IQ, objectivity and socio-geo-political awareness of circa. 17m people within a couple years, though, can you? Still less when the main political parties and mass media have been ramping up the populist rethoric the entire time.

Despite that though, the shift has been roughly in the order of 52:48 reversed to 46:54

 

A six point shift is significant and is certainly a bigger gap than i n the days immediately prior to the referendum in 2016.

 

Yes terminally naive leave supporters will always be terminally naive leave supporters but those who realise that they were lied to, those who have realised that what was promised was not achievable and those who have seen the damage caused over the past three years have all changed their minds.

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26 minutes ago, L00b said:

You can't expect to lift substantially the IQ, objectivity and socio-geo-political awareness of circa. 17m people within a couple years, though, can you? Still less when the main political parties and mass media have been ramping up the populist rethoric the entire time.

This, some people need to learn the hard way, and even then the penny might not drop.

 

Can't or won't realise they were led down the garden path.

Edited by geared

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50 minutes ago, apelike said:

And yet despite the above claims the recent data shows that there is very little in terms of any percentage change either way, and that is the problem as remain are not guaranteed to win a further referendum. 

You`re wrong. Whilst there is surprisingly little change in the way people who voted last time would vote again, the age profiles of Leave and Remain voters mean any majority for Leave probably disappeared mid to late January this year.

To put it in basic terms, the Grim Reaper is restoring sanity.

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49 minutes ago, L00b said:

You can't expect to lift substantially the IQ, objectivity and socio-geo-political awareness of circa. 17m people within a couple years, though, can you? Still less when the main political parties and mass media have been ramping up the populist rethoric the entire time.

So again low IQ is used in the arguement . Pathetic

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56 minutes ago, hackey lad said:

So again low IQ is used in the arguement . Pathetic

There's no argument. 

 

The inclusion  of 'IQ' is based on the cognitive capacity of Brexiters as perceived, here and elsewhere (take your pick: comments section on BBC and newspapers websites, vox pop interviews for TV news, twitter, facebook and much more).

 

It doesn't mean all Leave voters are thick.

 

It doesn't mean you in particular are thick.

 

It just means that the vast majority of the 46 to 52% of voters who still believe in Leaving after the last 3 years, are manifestly incapable of understanding complex socio-economic  facts and inter-relationships, and so of connecting dots - even relatively simple ones.

 

Once you accept that a significant chunk of the electorate has been, and still is being, manipulated into supporting Brexit through their incapacity to consider facts with any rationality, and that they appear incapable of doing so notwithstanding their leaders' own admissions over time, you can only come to the same conclusion.

 

The solution, or well, at least a beginning of a solution, is the same as with every other instance of obscurantism over the ages: better education for more of the people.

 

Taking (false?) offence and shouting 'pathetic' is just more of the same problem, doing nothing towards solving it.

Edited by L00b

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51 minutes ago, hackey lad said:

So again low IQ is used in the arguement . Pathetic

No. It's entirely pragmatic and based on facts. After discussions with a lot of people - and enough to be statistically significant, there are three main features that generally tend to be found with brexit voters (or at least those declared as such).

They are age - older are more likley to vote leave

Lower IQ - which generally means lack of higher education - and as such less exposure early on in life to challenging ideas from other cultures.

Lack of affluence - which is the other side of the coin to lower IQ and also feeds into lack of education. 

 

This is not just my opinion - there are numerous scholarly and popular articles that point to the same thing. 

 

If you think it's pathetic fine. But you are rather I feel proving the point being made.

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1 hour ago, L00b said:

You can't expect to lift substantially the IQ, objectivity and socio-geo-political awareness of circa. 17m people within a couple years, though, can you? Still less when the main political parties and mass media have been ramping up the populist rethoric the entire time.

The contempt of the ruling class for the majority is on display for all to see.

 

Yet still they wonder why they lost. The out of touch, arrogant and remote high IQ  Remainers.

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1 hour ago, Justin Smith said:

You`re wrong. Whilst there is surprisingly little change in the way people who voted last time would vote again, the age profiles of Leave and Remain voters mean any majority for Leave probably disappeared mid to late January this year.

To put it in basic terms, the Grim Reaper is restoring sanity.

Although there is growing resentment towards the Government, which could see people vote to punish the government, taking the opposite side to whatever they back simply out of spite.

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47 minutes ago, Obelix said:

No. It's entirely pragmatic and based on facts. After discussions with a lot of people - and enough to be statistically significant, there are three main features that generally tend to be found with brexit voters (or at least those declared as such).

They are age - older are more likley to vote leave

Lower IQ - which generally means lack of higher education - and as such less exposure early on in life to challenging ideas from other cultures.

Lack of affluence - which is the other side of the coin to lower IQ and also feeds into lack of education. 

 

This is not just my opinion - there are numerous scholarly and popular articles that point to the same thing. 

 

If you think it's pathetic fine. But you are rather I feel proving the point being made.

Working class people have been the victims of grinding and relentless attacks by political, business and financial elites since the referendum result, while affluent middle class Remain supporters (who never concerned themselves about income inequality before June 2016) attack the poor for not voting how their establishment overlords instructed.

 

The bosses magazine 'The Economist' was quite correct when it stated:

 

“The vote for Brexit looks like—and to some extent is—a cry of fury by those who have borne the burden of European integration without benefiting proportionally from its advantages”.

 

2 hours ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Despite that though, the shift has been roughly in the order of 52:48 reversed to 46:54

 

A six point shift is significant and is certainly a bigger gap than i n the days immediately prior to the referendum in 2016.

 

Yes terminally naive leave supporters will always be terminally naive leave supporters but those who realise that they were lied to, those who have realised that what was promised was not achievable and those who have seen the damage caused over the past three years have all changed their minds.

In the days before the referendum the Remain side was 10 points ahead of Leave. A Populus poll, the last conducted before voting began, gave Remain a 10-point lead, 55 to 45.

 

I wonder how that turned out?

Edited by Car Boot

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