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Consequences of Brexit [part 7] Read first post before posting

mort

 Let me make this perfectly clear - any personal attacks will get you a suspension. The moderating team is not going to continually issue warnings. If you cannot remain civil and post within forum rules then do not bother to contribute. 

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24 minutes ago, I1L2T3 said:

I remember a time when life was a lot more simple in a lot of ways, and people made the best of what they had.

 

But it was tough. I also remember a time of limited choices in life where society was more stratified, I remember industries being decimated by Far East competition, I remember my dad telling me about failure after failure of big national projects, of substandard British products nobody wanted to buy. The days when simple thing like a car, a holiday, a washing machine or a colour TV were luxuries. A time where houses didn’t have central heating or double glazing. A time of power cuts, people being laid off, industrial strife.

 

The list goes on and on and on.

 

Do you really want to try and sell that to our youngsters? Really?

 

Good luck

 

22 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Largely due to our history as an empire. At the time we joined Europe in the 70s, we were in serious economic and financial trouble.

 

Whether you care to admit it or not, our 40 year membership of the EEC and then the EU has benefited our economy enormously. Have you ever stopped to think that our struggle to negotiate a deal with the EU may not be because of an intransigent Barnier & Co but because as soon as we triggered Article 50 we shot ourselves in the head and lost any bargaining power.

 

As I’ve often said, if you crash your car on the way to a dealership to part exchange it, you can’t expect the dealer to offer you the same money that you’d get if the car wasn’t damaged.

Great posts: Facts, evidence and rational thinking.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Top Cats Hat said:

At the time we joined Europe in the 70s, we were in serious economic and financial trouble.

No we weren't. Between 1970-73 we had the Barber boom which was accompanied by rapid economic growth. From 1973 (the year we joined the EEC) we entered a period of rapid inflation with a major surge in oil prices and to counter that Heath tried to cap wages, which caused unrest. Then in 1974 we entered into a recession and later in 1976 we asked the IMF for a bailout of £2.6Billion which came with strict conditions. A lot of the negative economics and financial trouble happened after we had joined.

 

22 minutes ago, Mister Gee said:

Great posts: Facts, evidence and rational thinking.

But unfortunately one is wrong... 

Edited by apelike

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3 minutes ago, apelike said:

No we weren't. Between 1970-73 we had the Barber boom which was accompanied by rapid economic growth. From 1973 (the year we joined the EEC) we entered a period of rapid inflation with a major a surge in oil prices and to counter that Heath tried to cap wages, which caused unrest. Then in 1974 we entered into a recession and later in 1976 we asked the IMF for a bailout of £2.6Billion which came with strict conditions. A lot of the negative economics and financial trouble happened after we had joined.

 

But unfortunately one is wrong... 

Which one?

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Mister Gee said:

Which one?

I have already eluded to it in my post, perhaps try reading it again. 

Edited by apelike

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1 minute ago, apelike said:

A lot of the negative economics and financial trouble happened after we had joined.

Agreed, but largely as a result of our pre-EEC situation and certainly not as a result of our joining.

 

Our EU membership has provided the longest period of economic stability of our history despite the best efforts of various Chancellors.

 

There are very good reasons why Sterling and the markets react badly to news of our leaving the EU and react favourably to any news that suggests that we may stay.

 

 If Theresa May revoked Article 50 on Monday, we would see the biggest surge in Sterling in history.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Largely due to our history as an empire. At the time we joined Europe in the 70s, we were in serious economic and financial trouble.


Whether you care to admit it or not, our 40 year membership of the EEC and then the EU has benefited our economy enormously.

Ranking of the World's richest countries by GDP

 

1955 UK (2)

1960 UK (2)

1965 UK (3)

1970 UK (5)

1972 UK (5)

2018 UK (5)

 

Economically our membership of the EU has barely benefitted the UK. GDP hasn't improved since we became an EU member.

 

The economic benefits of our EU membership have been greatly exaggerated.

Edited by Car Boot

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7 minutes ago, apelike said:

No we weren't. Between 1970-73 we had the Barber boom which was accompanied by rapid economic growth. From 1973 (the year we joined the EEC) we entered a period of rapid inflation with a major surge in oil prices and to counter that Heath tried to cap wages, which caused unrest. Then in 1974 we entered into a recession and later in 1976 we asked the IMF for a bailout of £2.6Billion which came with strict conditions. A lot of the negative economics and financial trouble happened after we had joined.

 

 

It was the "Barber Boom" (1972 budget) which triggered the inflation - or at least compounded with oil price rises and floating the pound (which tanked)  - which led to the chain of events leading to the IMF bailout.

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4 hours ago, Organgrinder said:

If it's a mythical past that didn't really exist, how do you remember much of it.

I was born in 1940 into a very poor, one parent family and from the early fifties things got better for all of us, our friends and our neighbours. That's not mythical or rose tinted,  it happened.

We can't  go back to that past but we can get stuck in and recreate a proud country where we rebuild our manufacturing base and make our own rules again.

Most of the countries in the world are not members of the European Union and they seem to manage fine. Do you think we are too useless to do the same? I don't

There are about 208 countries in the world that are NOT members of the EU. 

 

How on earth do they survive? 

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Posted (edited)
On 12 April 2019 at 17:18, apelike said:

Actually I didn't propose any approach as what I said was in reply to altus post #2177. You need to go back and read that post and my replies since to understand it.

 

Actually, you didn't see a problem with UKIP/Brexit Party MEPs taking their seats in the EU Parliament because "after all the remainers on here keep telling us that the only way to force change in the EU is from the inside by being amember. "

 

No need to go back, here, thanks. I understand you just fine: any excuse for hypocrites on your side of the argument :rolleyes:

 

Even a single Sinn Fein MP has more principles in his little finger than all of  Farage & Co. put together.

Edited by L00b

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18 hours ago, CaptainSwing said:

Given that you came out at -3.0 on the left/right axis of the Political Compass (Corbyn himself is only -4), you might like to spend a few minutes thinking about your pejorative use of the word 'lefty' there.

What would your description be of the biased BBC presenters.

 

Just as an aside, I point you to Question Time, where the first guest (forgot his name) asked to speak started off by saying that the usual BBC bias continues unabated,  "why am I the  only Brexiteer out of 5 guests", says it all in my opinion.

 

Angel1.

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29 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

On the subject of UK steel production, more Project Fear Brexit news.

 

“Brexit: British Steel seeks £100m government loan to meet EU rules”

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47921375

Is that story true or false?

 

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