The Consequences of Brexit [Part 6] READ FIRST POST BEFORE COMMENTING

[Lockdoctor 10]

1 minute ago, Cyclone said:

And you're seizing onto the diesel thing and determinedly ignoring the other reasons they've given for moving production, one of them being brexit.

I listened to and understand what Nissan stated.  Brexit is not the reason the production of the new model will not happen in Sunderland.

[L00b 441]

11 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

Not long now until the British electorate deliver a devastating blow against the capitalist system and global finance - Brexit.

 

Brexit is the first link in a chain that will weaken and destroy an economic system that was designed to institutionalise inequality and keep power, wealth and arms in the hands of the few, not the many.

 

Bring on Brexit!

Not long now until the Brexit cheerleaders cash in.

 

Brexit will increase inequality and concentrate power, wealth and arms in the hands of the few, like no amount of democratic system lobbying ever could.

 

Bring on Brexit, you say?

 

With delicious irony, I agree with you: I've had a good-sized bet with the bookies on a crash-out Brexit for close to 2 years now (I'll let you imagine -or research- the odds I got), and am comfortably invested in gold. Make me richer, please

[Eater Sundae 12]

17 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

Hilarious, I am a rational person and understand that the fall in demand for diesel cars is not a consequence of the democratic UK people voting to  leave the EU and the unrational person says the rational person looks an arse.  

 

You must live a very sad life hoping others lose their jobs.

If the problem were just lack of demand for diesel cars, then Nissan would not be intending to make a new X-Trail. They still intend to make a new X-Trail, but the key point is that they have made a conscious decision to do it in Japan, and not in Sunderland

[Cyclone 10]

21 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

I listened to and understand what Nissan stated.  Brexit is not the reason the production of the new model will not happen in Sunderland.

You listened to and then seized on a small part of what they said, whilst ignoring the rest in order to support your political view and avoid cognitive dissonance.

11 minutes ago, Eater Sundae said:

If the problem were just lack of demand for diesel cars, then Nissan would not be intending to make a new X-Trail. They still intend to make a new X-Trail, but the key point is that they have made a conscious decision to do it in Japan, and not in Sunderland

Or they wouldn't make the diesel version and would make more of the petrol or hybrid versions.  I suspect in reality they will make less diesel variants and more of the others, rather than no diesel version at all.

[L00b 441]

34 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

I listened to and understand what Nissan stated.  Brexit is not the reason the production of the new model will not happen in Sunderland.

You're missing (we all are) a very large part of the puzzle: what assurances Theresa May told Nissan's chairman back in 2016, which is still not public knowledge.

 

Suffice to say, Nissan (allegedly) promised to make the new X-Trail in Sunderland at the times and, clearly, has now reneged on that (alleged) promise.

 

Common sense alone tells you that these 2016 assurances have lost their relevance by February 2019. Because businesses decide on a rational, objective, risk-assessed basis; not for political gain or according to gut feel. And the promises were made a good couple of years before the EU-Japan FTA was concluded, without any certainty that this FTA would be concluded before Brexit.

 

Some experience of doing business with the Japanese, next, would tell you that these 2016 assurances were most probably lies. Because, whether in a business or personal context, the Japanese do not renege on their word. Their super-developed sense of personal honour demands it.

 

The fact that they would in this instance (associated with their earlier intervention in the Brexit debate some months ago, very highly uncharacteristic again), means that they feel sufficiently betrayed, that it offsets the shame of reneging on their earlier promise.

Edited February 4, 2019 by L00b

[Lockdoctor 10]

12 minutes ago, Eater Sundae said:

If the problem were just lack of demand for diesel cars, then Nissan would not be intending to make a new X-Trail. They still intend to make a new X-Trail, but the key point is that they have made a conscious decision to do it in Japan, and not in Sunderland

The key word is fall.  The factory in Japan was the first choice  to build the new model and Sunderland was selected  to also build the new model at a  time when  Nissan  obviously forecast higher demand for a new diesel  car model.  It makes commercial sense for car a maker to only build a new diesel model in one factory after a sudden fall in demand for diesel cars.  It makes sense for a Japanese owned car maker to choose  the factory in Japan rather than Sunderland when the fall in demand for diesel cars means only one factory will be needed to produce the new model.

[Flanker7 20]

44 minutes ago, Car Boot said:

Not long now until the British electorate deliver a devastating blow against the capitalist system and global finance - Brexit.

 

Brexit is the first link in a chain that will weaken and destroy an economic system that was designed to institutionalise inequality and keep power, wealth and arms in the hands of the few, not the many.

 

Bring on Brexit!

Oh my goodness where to start.

Brexit is another link in the chain that will give more power to Global Companies over the UK. 

They are the new Super States that subjugate people into slave workers , strangle competition and reduce us to  the role of solely being consumers.

[Lockdoctor 10]

6 minutes ago, L00b said:

You're missing (we all are) a very large part of the puzzle: what assurances Theresa May told Nissan's chairman back in 2016, which is still not public knowledge.

 

Suffice to say, Nissan (allegedly) promised to make the new X-Trail in Sunderland at the times and, clearly, has now reneged on that (alleged) promise.

 

Common sense alone tells you that these 2016 assurances have lost their relevance by February 2019. Because businesses decide on a rational, objective, risk-assessed basis; not for political gain or according to gut feel.

 

Some experience of doing business with the Japanese, next, would tell you that these 2016 assurances were most probably lies. Because, whether in a business or personal context, the Japanese do not renege on their word. Their super-developed sense of personal honour demands it.

 

The fact that they would in this instance (associated with their earlier intervention in the Brexit debate some months ago, very highly uncharacteristic again), means that they feel sufficiently betrayed, that it offsets the shame of reneging on their earlier promise.

You have ignored the main fact which is there has been a huge fall in demand for diesel cars since Mrs May and Nissan had talks back in 2016,  

[I1L2T3 10]

50 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

Hilarious, I am a rational person and understand that the fall in demand for diesel cars is not a consequence of the democratic UK people voting to  leave the EU and the unrational person says the rational person looks an arse.  

 

You must live a very sad life hoping others lose their jobs.

You have to remember that Brexiters are happy for themselves and their families to lose their own jobs.

 

This is only giving them what they demanded

[L00b 441]

11 minutes ago, Lockdoctor said:

You have ignored the main fact which is there has been a huge fall in demand for diesel cars since Mrs May and Nissan had talks back in 2016,  

I haven't: this fall in diesel sales across the big 5 European markets is nothing new, it started long before the VW scandal in 2016, which simply accelerated the trend. The Economic Times was already writing about that trend in July 2014. The diesel share of the UK market started falling in 2012, and the fall accelerated in 2016.

 

I can't remember Nissan freezing its UK car manufacturing investments, until last year: Nissan has been consistently warning about no deal Brexit, requesting clarifications about Brexit, cutting workforce and freezing UK-bound investments since the beginning of 2018.

Edited February 4, 2019 by L00b

[El Cid 220]

1 hour ago, L00b said:

 The Economic Times was already writing about that trend in July 2014. The diesel share of the UK market started falling in 2012, and the fall accelerated in 2016.

 

Diesels are more economical, so why were sales falling?

[RJRB 688]

17 minutes ago, El Cid said:

Diesels are more economical, so why were sales falling?

More mpg but price manipulation of diesel v petrol firstly meant that the economy only works for high mileage drivers.

Now it seems obvious that the price differential of petrol and diesel will only go one way.