Nobel prize-winning dna pioneer stripped of titles for his views on race.

[Jim Hardie 525]

6 hours ago, I1L2T3 said:

He’s entirely free to voice his thoughts.

 

If his thoughts are racist then he will unfortunately have to pay the consequences.

 

That is how it works

And who decides his thoughts are racist?

Can publishing his scientific research be classed as his 'thoughts'?

As has already been said, were his research to be in a different field and he concluded that blacks are physically superior, would his thoughts be racist or would that be ok?

 

 

 

[Baron99 779]

It does seem that the Chinese, S.E Asians & the Italians are amongst the brightest according to I.Q results. 

 

https://brainstats.com/average-iq-by-country.html

 

However presumably the results are based on I.Q. tests.  I've never had such a test & don't know anyone else whose undertook one.  

 

Anyone on here took such a test? 

[I1L2T3 10]

3 hours ago, Jim Hardie said:

And who decides his thoughts are racist?

Can publishing his scientific research be classed as his 'thoughts'?

As has already been said, were his research to be in a different field and he concluded that blacks are physically superior, would his thoughts be racist or would that be ok?

 

 

 

Problem with that argument is he didn’t do research that compared intelligence. He came to his conclusion because he though black employees were less intelligent. 

 

Society basically gets to decide whether his views are acceptable. And as a result he ended up with much reduced income. Within society there are many arbiters of what is acceptable.

 

God help us if views like his ever become mainstream again. We’d be on a dangerous path.

[petemcewan 27]

He's not the first and won't be the last to make such comments

 

 

        This character peddled similar ideas.  Arthur Jensen.     

 

Edited January 14, 2019 by petemcewan

[RJRB 688]

This is the trouble with sweeping generalisations.

In this case it will give succour to those who believe in white supremacy ,which in some instances is demonstrably unsupported by their utterances.

[Jim Hardie 525]

2 hours ago, I1L2T3 said:

Problem with that argument is he didn’t do research that compared intelligence. He came to his conclusion because he though black employees were less intelligent. 

 

Society basically gets to decide whether his views are acceptable. And as a result he ended up with much reduced income. Within society there are many arbiters of what is acceptable.

 

God help us if views like his ever become mainstream again. We’d be on a dangerous path.

Sorry, jumped in with both feet there. I was confusing him with someone else who had expressed similar views some time ago and was hounded out of his job, unfairly in my opinion.

[petemcewan 27]

Genes and intelligence are part of the Sociobiologists tool kit . 

[I1L2T3 10]

1 hour ago, petemcewan said:

Genes and intelligence are part of the Sociobiologists tool kit . 

Is race a factor though?

 

From what I know of classic IQ tests you can train to do well in them. People who apply for Mensa often train for the tests. Different cultures have different educational practices, and perhaps the tests favour people who have been taught from young in certain ways. Even within the U.K. a good IQ score could be partly a result of having a good education so does that mean state educated Britons are not as intelligent as privately educated Britons. That’s not true of course. Just a thought but those are the sorts of conclusions cod science around IQ tests can lead to.

 

 

[geared 303]

Didn't the same article say he was now in a care home and barely aware of his surroundings??

 

Sounds like he's got dementia?  He could have had it for a while, he made a similar statement about 10 years ago, he was 80 then.

Edited January 14, 2019 by geared

[altus 538]

22 hours ago, frigate said:

Human characteristics, including IQ test aptitude are largely determined by environmental influences. Other genes are part of that environment, along with food, training, books, the net, parental indoctrination etc etc.

I wonder if he would have gotten into quite so much hot water if he had quipped that Black Africans are prepared by their genetic ancestry more likely to do well in athletic pursuits ?

Anyone who watches the big IQ test analogue, the Olympic Games can readily see the truth of that one.

Anybody who concluded such a thing just from looking at the results of the Olympics would be called a fool. It would be like claiming the Swiss are genetically more suited to skiing than Jamaicans because of their respective results in the Winter Olympics whilst ignoring that Switzerland has snowy mountains and Jamaica doesn't.

 

You have to exclude all confounding influences. For example, Kenyans dominate distance running. It's well known that being at a high altitude causes the body to increase the proportion of red blood cells to combat the relatively thinner air. This provides an advantage if you compete in distance events against people who have lived at lower altitudes. Much of Kenya is at high altitude so Kenyan athletes benefit from that. Does this mean there is a genetic component to this? It's difficult to tell. Elite lowland athletes can get significant benefits from training at high altitudes which implies not. Do Kenyan have an advantage from their bodies adapting to a lifetime spent at high altitude rather than just spending a few months at a high altitude training camp? Quite possibly, but that would be an adaptation to environment advantage not a genetic one.

 

There are a myriad of other influences, many far more subtle than the altitude you live at, that would have to be accounted for before you could claim any performance differences were due to genetics.

[petemcewan 27]

I1L2T3,

 

 

What part genetic factors play in the development of intelligence is uncertain and is likely to remain so, since they only exist by virtue of the fact that genetic and environmental factors have been in interaction from the time of conception.  We do know , however, that defective linguistic skills, dysfunctional patterns of conceptualisation, depressed motivation and academic performance- which so often characterise  low IQ score - are closely associated with poverty, social disorganisation and social isolation.

 We do need to think of intelligence not as a fixed mental capacity but as a  generic term for the individual's set of strategies for processing information,problem solving and artistic creativity.

 

 

 

[frigate 10]

On 13/01/2019 at 23:53, frigate said:

 

 

10

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 13/01/2019 at 23:53, frigate said:

 

10