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The Conservative Party. All discussion here please

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17 minutes ago, banjodeano said:

I was told by someone today who works in the NHS, that they are only allowed to use protective equipment when dealing with people who have been confirmed with covid19,  when dealing with people who have not been diagnosed with covid19 then they are not allowed to use it.

Another reason why we should be 'Testing, testing, testing,' as recommended by the WHO and other countries. It makes a mockery of our statistics.

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4 hours ago, MillerMike said:

It must hurt the brainwashed labour supporters to see Boris and his sidekicks doing such a great job in this crisis.

 

Leaders with a capital L

Really? I wonder who is most brainwashed?

 

Very interesting article in DM by Peter Hitchens, a very respected Conservative journalist who I rarely agree with but who on this occasion is brave enough to write the first article in the mainstream media which I've seen, (a 2 page spread,) daring to question the orthodox view of Boris' handling of this crisis. He writes:

 

".... It never ever does any harm to question decisions which you think are wrong. If they are right then no harm will be done, they will be able to deal with your questions. If they are in fact wrong you could save everyone a lot of trouble. 

So here I am, asking bluntly - is the closedown of the country the right answer to the Coronavirus? I'll be accused of undermining the NHS and threatening health and all kinds of other conformist rubbish, but I ask you to join me, because if we have this wrong we have a great deal to lose. I don't just address this plea to my readers, I think my fellow journalists should ask the same questions, I think MPs of all parties should ask them when they are urged tomorrow to pass into law a frightening series of restrictions on ancient liberties and vast increases in police and state powers."*

 

He then goes on to describe in great detail, (the main body of the article,) reasons why he thinks we have got it so wrong, and why the statistics are flawed, incomplete and taken out of context, for example;

 

'In the winter of 2017 - 18 more than 50,000 excess deaths occurred in England and Wales largely unnoticed.'

 

 In the governments table of 'deaths considered avoidable' it  lists 31,307 deaths from cardiovascular diseases in England and Wales for 2013 (the last year for which they could give me figures.)'

This, largely the toll of unhealthy lifestyles, was out of a total of 114,740 'avoidable' deaths in that year. To put these figures in perspective, please note that every human being in the United Kingdom suffers from a fatal condition - being alive.'

'About 1,600 people die every day in the UK for one reason or another. A similar figure applies in Italy and a much larger one in China.'

'Professor Ioannidis Professor of Medicine, of epidemiology and population health, of biomedical data science and of statistics at Stanford University says the data on Coronavirus are utterly unreliable because so many cases are going unrecorded.'

 

'Epidemic disasters have been predicted many times before and have not been anything like as bad as feared, Bird flu did not kill the predicted millions in 1997, 1999 Mad Cow/CJD predicted to kill 500,000 killed less than 200. SARS (2003)  predicted to kill millions, didn't.  Neither did 2009 swine flu predicted to kill 65,000. The Council of Europe described the hyping of pandemics as one of the great medical scandals of the century.'

 

' I despair that so many in the commentariat and politics obediently accept what they are being told. I have lived long enough and travelled far enough, to know that authority is often wrong and cannot always be trusted.'

 

I'm sure the whole article will be available online for anybody who wants to read it in it's entirety. As for Miller Mike, I'm sure our doting press/media will continue to back Boris all the way come what may and the public will unquestioningly believe everything they read. Boris is about to bring in Draconian laws, if you disagree with him, tough,  you will be arrested.

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, banjodeano said:

one thing that does make me wonder, when labour were in power and there was a worldwide financial crash, then it was all blamed on labours management of the economy, when the next financial crash comes  which is just around the corner, i wonder if it will be blamed on the tories or Covid 19?

So what part of Gordon Brown's gold selling was not mismanagement?

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18 minutes ago, alchresearch said:

So what part of Gordon Brown's gold selling was not mismanagement?

The Financial Times, for one, believe that it was good management of Britain's gold reserves:

Britain was right to sell off its pile of gold

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Please, please read SF thread 'Removal of Local Authority obligation to provide social care support' by onewheeldave. It's important!

 

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1 hour ago, alchresearch said:

So what part of Gordon Brown's gold selling was not mismanagement?

 

As much as you want it to be true, it didn't cause the financial crash.

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The Times on Boris Johnson's 'leadership' during the Coronavirus crisis:

 

The truth is that [Boris Johnson’s] performance so far has been chequered. Since the start he has appeared behind the curve. Considerable time that could have been spent preparing for the crisis appears to have been squandered. The World Health Organisation first warned of the risk of a deadly global pandemic in mid-January, by which point the coronavirus was spreading rapidly in China and parts of Asia. Yet the government spent much of February apparently distracted with fights with some of Britain’s institutions, including the civil service, the judiciary and the BBC. Even at the time many questioned why the prime minister disappeared from view for a week in the middle of the month to his grace-and-favour home in Kent. He did not preside over his first Cobra meeting to discuss the crisis until March 3. Even as the scale became apparent, Mr Johnson’s response to it has been uneven. For the most of the first half of March, the official advice was simply to wash one’s hands. On March 12, as countries across Europe and the world closed schools, restaurants, bars and shops and introduced lockdowns and travel bans, the government merely advised that those ill with coronavirus symptoms should self-isolate for seven days ...

Mr Johnson’s liberal instincts and reluctance to restrict civil liberties would normally be admirable. But dithering over whether to shut schools, bars and restaurants, combined with anonymous briefings warning of imminent lockdowns that are then ruled out by ministers, may have only made the crisis worse. Panicked shoppers have stripped supermarkets of supplies while many Londoners will have escaped to the country, almost certainly further spreading the virus. City traders say that doubts about Mr Johnson’s response contributed to the run on sterling. Britain’s death toll is now at the same level as Italy’s two weeks ago, yet already one hospital says that it has been overwhelmed and the NHS is warning of shortages of ventilators and protective clothing ...

And if the government is forced to introduce even more stringent restrictions to halt an escalating epidemic, they may ask why they weren’t introduced sooner, as they have been in much of the rest of the world. The country needs to know that Mr Johnson has a coherent strategy. Otherwise the prime minister who dreamt of being Churchill may find himself cast as Neville Chamberlain.

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22 hours ago, banjodeano said:

one thing that does make me wonder, when labour were in power and there was a worldwide financial crash, then it was all blamed on labours management of the economy, when the next financial crash comes  which is just around the corner, i wonder if it will be blamed on the tories or Covid 19?

 

8 hours ago, alchresearch said:

So what part of Gordon Brown's gold selling was not mismanagement?

Try answering the question, alch?

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22 hours ago, banjodeano said:

one thing that does make me wonder, when labour were in power and there was a worldwide financial crash, then it was all blamed on labours management of the economy, when the next financial crash comes  which is just around the corner, i wonder if it will be blamed on the tories or Covid 19?

I think you must be a little mixed up. Who blamed the financial crash of 2008 on Labours management of the economy? 

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6 minutes ago, apelike said:

I think you must be a little mixed up. Who blamed the financial crash of 2008 on Labours management of the economy? 

Just about every tory poster on this forum.......

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, banjodeano said:

Just about every tory poster on this forum.......

So only a few on SF then! I must admit I dispute that as well.

 

But just to add.. If there is another financial crash it will be blamed on Covid and I think the the rest of the world will too.

Edited by apelike

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3 minutes ago, apelike said:

So only a few on SF then! I must admit I dispute that as well.

erm.....okay

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