Jump to content

The Consequences of Brexit [part 5] Read 1st post before posting

Recommended Posts

He turned the job down because he was told he couldnt re-negotiate anything. So not much of a job there really!

 

No need, he has "full confidence" in May..... apparently.

 

A case of 3rd time lucky... nah, seems unlikely. He'd have done no better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What amazes me is that we have a PM who is/was a remainer with a Cabinet stuffed with remainers and we are surprised that the so called negotiations have gone belly up.

I despair.

The negotiations did not go ‘belly-up’: they reflect perfectly the respective interests of the 2 parties.

 

The ‘belly-up’ bit is simply the natural, and inevitable, correction of the Brexiteers’ misplaced sense of entitlement: there was never any cake to be had and eaten.

 

No other PM, or different cabinet appointments (Davis, arch-Brexiteer, was in charge of the negotiations for 2 years btw) could have achieved more or different for the U.K.

 

Brexiteers, in fact all politicians across the board (except perhaps the few genuine imbeciles, like Dorries) are well aware of the fact, which is why none want the job.

 

Your despair is simply your realisation of the above. You’ll get over it I’m sure.

Edited by L00b

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Why would the EU27 make any alterations if Parliament rejects the deal? :confused:

 

I mean, sure, if the EU27 were mean-spirited, they may well make alterations to the deal, to make it still better for their own interests, the closer the U.K. gets to the deadline and the abyss.

 

But they’re not. So they most likely won’t.

 

You don’t really understand negotiations and the relative strength of the parties to them, do you?

You’re perfectly free to keep demonstrating your lack of basic understanding of geopolitics and economics, as you have reliably done for months :)

You don't seem to understand any agreement big or small in never finalised until all parties involved have signed it. It is common practice for amendments to be made to any contract / agreement in order for it to be ratified.

 

---------- Post added 16-11-2018 at 12:20 ----------

 

He turned the job down because he was told he couldnt re-negotiate anything. So not much of a job there really!

Exactly. A logical thought unlike some posters who criticise those who wanted the UK to leave the EU whether their actions are justified or not.

Edited by Lockdoctor

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You don't seem to understand any agreement big or small in never finalised until all parties involved have signed it. It is common practice for amendments to be made to any contract / agreement in order for it to be ratified.
You don’t seem to understand the EU ratification procedure for the withdrawal agreement: all 28 Member States need to vote it through. Not just Parliament and Brussels.

 

Your time is up. EUCO is meeting on 25 November to sign it off. Either May (or her replacement) attends to sign, and signs, on behalf of the U.K. And then the ratification procedure begins (and you want to hope it all gets done in time by 29 March 2019).

 

Or it’s no deal. And they’re better prepared for it than the U.K.

 

The EU27 are long past, and tired of, ‘Brexit’. They’ve moved on to other, newer issues on their collective plates. Don’t take my word for it, take that of most highly-experienced, -connected and -respected political commentators like Adler, Islam, etc or better, that of EU heads of state like Merkel, Macron & Sanchez: there is ZERO intention amongst the EU27 to renegotiate anything.

 

May knows it. As does Gove. Even Corbyn I’m sure.

 

You can stay. Or you can divorce. If you divorce, that’s the deal. If you want one. The end.

Edited by L00b

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Exactly. A logical thought unlike some posters who criticise those who wanted the UK to leave the EU whether their actions are justified or not.

 

Hardly, as the main proponent of the "We're sick of experts" mantra, there's plenty of quite justifiable criticism for Gove to answer.

 

Given his glittering list of previous successes, you can't seriously think he would have been in any way effective. I mean, how gullible do you have to be?

 

This deal is the reality of the leave vote, it was predicted before the referendum, it was always going to be something like this...

 

You're confused because you were gullible enough to believe a bunch of self evident lies... Shame on you!

Edited by Magilla

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Gove has made a smart move.

 

Like BoJo, he is more concerned with self advancement than principle. He went off the radar for most of yesterday and I guess he was assessing the lie of the land.

 

The turning point was when Rees-Smug announced that he was going to get the 48 letters sent to trigger a vote of no confidence. An hour later May came back fighting, her esteem seemed to go up among MPs and whispers started that the crank wing of the party was struggling to get the 48 letters needed.

 

I suspect that although a Brexiteer, Gove sees the hard Brexit lobby is looking like a busted flush so has decided to 'stick with the winning side'. He is clearly not a supporter of the deal as it is being said that he refused the job of Brexit Secretary because he could not renegotiate the deal, yet he remains a member of the cabinet which is promoting the deal to the party and the country.

 

The guy is clearly an unprincipled snake. :suspect:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hardly, as the main proponent of the "We're sick of experts" mantra, there's plenty of quite justifiable criticism for Gove to answer.

 

Given his glittering list of previous successes, you can't seriously think he would have been in any way effective.

 

This deal is the reality of the leave vote, it was always going to be this way, the only reason you're confused about that is because you were gullible to believe a transparent lie.

 

More fool you! :rolleyes:

I haven't stated Gove would have been successful. The fact is he asked Mrs May logical questions before accepting or rejecting the job. All you have done is prove my point that you criticise those who were on the opposite side of the EU referendum vote to yourself without justification.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why are these Brexit people now calling for a second vote? They had a vote already and Mrs May won. They knew what they were voting for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You don’t seem to understand the EU ratification procedure for the withdrawal agreement: all 28 Member States need to vote it through. Not just Parliament and Brussels.

 

Your time is up. EUCO is meeting on 25 November to sign it off. Either May (or her replacement) attends to sign, and signs, on behalf of the U.K. And then the ratification procedure begins (and you want to hope it all gets done in time by 29 March 2019).

 

Or it’s no deal. And they’re better prepared for it than the U.K.

 

The EU27 are long past, and tired of, ‘Brexit’. They’ve moved on to other, newer issues on their collective plates. Don’t take my word for it, take that of most highly-experienced, -connected and -respected political commentators like Adler, Islam, etc or better, that of EU heads of state like Merkel, Macron & Sanchez: there is ZERO intention amongst the EU27 to renegotiate anything.

 

May knows it. As does Gove. Even Corbyn I’m sure.

 

You can stay. Or you can divorce. If you divorce, that’s the deal. If you want one. The end.

It's quite obvious all the EU27 are in agreement with the withdrawal agreement on offer otherwise the EU wouldn't have been so quick of the mark releasing the document so soon after Mrs May announced in Downing Street that cabinet had approved the agreement and arranging a summit date. It's only the UK who haven't agreed to the agreement because of parliament. To say there is zero chance of anything being renegotiated or amended is nothing more than your biased opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
All you have done is prove my point that you criticise those who were on the opposite side of the EU referendum vote to yourself without justification.

 

There's plenty of justification to criticise Gove, and your ill-informed, utterly disasterous pie in the sky notions.

 

Any deal we were ever likely to get was always going to be detrimental to the UK.

 

Now you see the reality of the folly of the entire leave movement.

 

Government is under no doubt that no-deal would be far far worse, as Raab so cleverly demonstrated last week :?

 

They don't need us more than we need them, quite th opposite in fact, today the EU re-iterated that the integrity of the SM was far more important than a UK deal.. oh dear, so much for those German car manufacturers you were wrong about eh ;)

 

You're criticising the deal, IMV, without justification because it was always going to be the sort of thing that was by far the most likely.

 

You can't deliver on a fantasy!

 

---------- Post added 16-11-2018 at 13:12 ----------

 

It's quite obvious all the EU27 are in agreement with the withdrawal agreement on offer otherwise the EU wouldn't have been so quick of the mark releasing the document so soon after Mrs May announced in Downing Street that cabinet had approved the agreement and arranging a summit date.

 

It's also obvious that May was trying to keep it secret as long as possible so MP's wouldn't have time to digest it before their crucial vote.

 

If it wasn't for the EU, you might still not know the details of the deal :?

 

It's only the UK who haven't agreed to the agreement because of parliament. To say there is zero chance of anything being renegotiated or amended is nothing more than your biased opinion.

 

Well, that and the repeated statements to that effect that have been all over the news this morning. :rolleyes:

Edited by Magilla

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

You can't deliver on a fantasy!

 

The deadlock in this whole mess will only be broken when a significant number of Leave voters wake up to the fact that because they voted for something that doesn't automatically mean that it must, or can even happen.

 

I'm sure I've posted more than once that if we had a referendum to always have rain free, sunny weather on all Bank holidays (except Boxing Day of course) it would very likely be overwhelmingly supported by the electorate.

 

But then how to you implement the result of that vote?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

It's also obvious that May was trying to keep it secret as long as possible so MP's wouldn't have time to digest it before their crucial vote.

 

If it wasn't for the EU, you might still not know the details of the deal :?

 

 

You make a valid point about Mrs May keeping the agreement secret until the cabinet had 'approved' the deal.

 

The EU only released the details earlier than the UK Government. The UK Government were always going to release the details before Mrs May stood up in parliament to make the announcement of the details of the agreement. Mr Corbyn thanked Mrs May for getting a copy of the agreement early.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.