The Consequences of Brexit [part 5] Read 1st post before posting

[Car Boot 10]

A group I belong to have just conducted its own rerun of the referendum. We managed to get 150 people taking part. The question asked us how we voted first time and how we would vote now. In the first it was 80 remain and 70 leave in the second it was 82 remain and 65 leave 3 said they weren't sure. So there's a small moment back to remain. I know it's a small number but if it was replicated nationwide we'd end up roughly %50-50

 

The fact that the EU wishes to inflict a severe financial punishment beating on a former member of its club simply for democratically voting to Leave has damaged it in the eyes of a great many people who can now see that it seeks to never let us go.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

The fact that the EU wishes to inflict a severe financial punishment beating on a former member of its club simply for democratically voting to Leave

 

Don't talk such nonsense!

[melthebell 864]

Going back to the irish conundrum over brexit, another video that shows the tensions between the 2 communities lives on, massively (ive mentioned the bonfires before)

[I1L2T3 10]

Going back to the irish conundrum over brexit, another video that shows the tensions between the 2 communities lives on, massively (ive mentioned the bonfires before)

 

I watched a Newsnight story on the unionist community. Their hardliners are totally up for a reestablishment of hard sectarian lines, totally prepared for it and can’t wait for it to happen.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

I watched a Newsnight story on the unionist community. Their hardliners are totally up for a reestablishment of hard sectarian lines, totally prepared for it and can’t wait for it to happen.

 

Many Unionists were very unhappy about the Good Friday Agreement and would not be too unhappy about going back to the bad old days to re fight old battles.

 

What they need to realise, is that any resumption of sectarian violence makes a united Ireland more, rather than less likely.

[RJRB 688]

Many on here have given very credible and positive reasons for voting to Leave the neo liberal bankers and big business EU club time and time again over the last few years.

 

I would be very interested in the source of your 'facts' on this belief of yours. But I have to warn you that I will not consider 'inside your head' as a valid source.

 

I have beliefs but as many have stated,facts are only quotable after the event.

“Inside my head”seems a pretty good place to formulate ones own opinions .

Perhaps you use your gut which is closer to the orifice through which you speak.

So how do I arrive at my strong belief that we should remain in the EU.

Does the alternative offer:

A better future for U.K. industry....No

Will it be detrimental to investment in the U.K...Yes

Will it control immigration...possibly

Is this necessarily a good thing....no

Do I feel controlled by Brussels...no

Am I concerned about the judgements of the European Courts of Justice...Not particularly.

Is the European Union a work in progress...Yes

Are we better influencing as an insider....Yes

Did I know of the potential Irish problem when I voted...No

Has this added to my concerns....Yes

Do I think the EU has contributed to peace in Europe...Yes

Do we have better access to world markets by being a part of a major trading bloc ....Yes.

I could go on,but obviously my experience after over 40 years of working in U.K. industry,some of them for foreign owned companies is much different from yours.

Whatever the outcome,I don’t think it will make much difference to my own security,income or standard of living.

I have been very fortunate and enjoyed visiting most European countries

I wish the same for my grandchildren.

[Obelix 11]

The figures in that link clearly show that although there has been a rise in population there has also been a decrease in the percentage of young to older population.

 

Which isn't what you said originally. Hence it is a strawman because you are mistaken.

 

 

I am not debating with a person that wants to be pedantic for the sake of an argument and has to include the usual remoaner slurs.

 

Ah, I know I've won when you reach for the remoaner response.

 

Tip for you - I'm proud to be called a remoaner because it means youve utterly screwed up and you have no argument thats worth a wet fart.

[apelike 10]

Which isn't what you said originally. Hence it is a strawman because you are mistaken.

 

No and no..

 

The very fact that the birth rate in the UK has declined and has been for some time also backs up my argument. As less are being born it then automatically follows that the numbers of young people are in decline as some also move out of one data set into another. The only way it can increase is if the birth rate goes up. The increase in the elderly data is mainly because a greater percentage are moving into the over 65 slot. The only way the young population can increase is if the birth rate goes up by a greater amount than those that leave the young people slot. Hence no straw argument only an arrogant pedantic one from you. I think most intelligent people on here also know that.

 

From the ONS data:

 

1976 0-15 year olds 24.9%

2016 0-15 year olds 18.9%

 

Showing a decline of 6% over that period and projected to decline further.

 

Quote from me:

 

"Fortunately, the elderly population is still increasing in numbers unlike the younger population."

 

Quote from you:

 

"both young and elderly populations are increasing at the moment..."

 

 

Now answer this simple question:

 

If the birth rate is declining then are the numbers of young people on the increase as you seem to be making out?

 

Either the ONS figures are wrong or you are, so which is it?

Edited August 1, 2018 by apelike

[Titanic99 10]

I've asked this fairly straight forward question to a number of people without a response so let me try on here. The Government says it is ending Freedom of Movement as well as there will be no Hard Border between the North and South of Ireland. So without a border how do you stop an economic migrant going up to Belfast and over to England. Surely a border control of some description is essential or I@m missing something obvious here.

[L00b 441]

Fish, blue passports, and now for the latest pandering to Little Englanders: UK / RoW segregated airport queuing

 

Were you wondering what this latest bit of nothingburger noise by Theresa May is supposed to distract from? Here you go.

[Obelix 11]

No and no..

 

The very fact that the birth rate in the UK has declined and has been for some time also backs up my argument. As less are being born it then automatically follows that the numbers of young people are in decline

 

No it doenst. Not at all. The birth rate is the number of live births per thousand. As long as that is about the death rate then the population will increase. This really is basic stuff.

 

Birth rate of say, 2% Death rate of 1% Population goes up by 1% a year

 

If we decrease the birth rate by 0.5% then population still goes up... it just does it slower.

 

as some also move out of one data set into another. The only way it can increase is if the birth rate goes up.

 

Or the death rate goes down. Or immigration increases. Do you really understand what you are looking at here because I really dont think you do.

 

The increase in the elderly data is mainly because a greater percentage are moving into the over 65 slot. The only way the young population can increase is if the birth rate goes up by a greater amount than those that leave the young people slot. Hence no straw argument only an arrogant pedantic one from you. I think most intelligent people on here also know that.

 

I really hate to break this to you but this is not pedantry. It simply is that you are very wrong.

 

The UK population is increasing through more births than deaths, and through immigration as well.

 

Whilst the percentage splits may change a fall in one percentage relative to another does not imply a fall in the population - because the population is increasing!

 

The birth rate doenst have to go up - the birth rate is already the first derivative of population. You are talking about a second derivative here why?

 

From the ONS data:

 

1976 0-15 year olds 24.9%

2016 0-15 year olds 18.9%

 

Showing a decline of 6%

 

What is the population of the country? What about the 2006 figures?

 

 

 

Quote from me:

 

"Fortunately, the elderly population is still increasing in numbers unlike the younger population."

 

Quote from you:

 

"both young and elderly populations are increasing at the moment..."

 

 

Now answer this simple question:

 

If the birth rate is declining then are the numbers of young people on the increase as you seem to be making out?

 

Yes...

 

What is it doing now? We need the last two figures, so 2006 and 2016. Lets do some basic arithmetic..

 

2006 - population is 60,827,067

Young people 19.2% or 11.7m

Middle age 64.9% or 39.5m

Older peeps 15.9% or 9.7m

 

2016 - population is 65,648,054 - nearly fiv million more....

Young people 18.9% which is a fall BUT 12.4m of them which is an INCREASE

Middle age 63.1% or 41.4m which is a fall too but still an INCREASE

Older peeps 18% and 11.8m both increases......

 

 

 

Either the ONS figures are wrong or you are, so which is it?

 

You are very wrong is what it is.

 

Now this is so far off topic we should really stop, but it's instructive to see just how badly wrong you can get basic numerical analysis in the blind beleif you are right. I sincerely hope that other Brexiters are not so challenged.

[Lockdoctor 10]

I've asked this fairly straight forward question to a number of people without a response so let me try on here. The Government says it is ending Freedom of Movement as well as there will be no Hard Border between the North and South of Ireland. So without a border how do you stop an economic migrant going up to Belfast and over to England. Surely a border control of some description is essential or I@m missing something obvious here.

The authorities are allowed to ask anyone to show ID at the moment when they are travelling from Northern Ireland to England. I think sooner or later all UK citizens will have to carry ID cards, which most likely will have to be shown before being allowed on a Ferry whether it is from the Isle of Wight to England or Belfast to England.