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Because they were being tested and commissioned and before they were ready to enter passenger services changed needed to be made before they could be used in passenger service.

 

This is part of the whole point of it being a trial. How is this so hard to understand?

 

Very easy but the question is why did it take a year longer than planned

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Very easy but the question is why did it take a year longer than planned

 

Because there were more issues than originally envisaged.

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Doesn't reflect well on the procurement and manufacturing. I am not aware of any new trains taking 18 months from delivery to first passenger use in the UK for running on existing infrastructure. Perhaps an unwanted record for Sheffield

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Doesn't reflect well on the procurement and manufacturing. I am not aware of any new trains taking 18 months from delivery to first passenger use in the UK for running on existing infrastructure. Perhaps an unwanted record for Sheffield

 

Perhaps not-

There are plenty of examples of "...new trains taking 18 months from delivery to first passenger use in the UK for running on existing infrastructure.".

But assuming you meant either trams or tram-trains, just a tiny bit of research would flag up the failings of the Manchester and Edinburgh trams and their operation.

 

Another clue is in the name tram-train.

Tram-trains are still tram-trains when operating on Supertram routes and need authorisation to be used in public service. No other system in the UK uses tram-trains, no other system has introduced tram-trains and no other tra-train have been evaluated for safety.

All the tram trains will have gone through evaluation and modification.

 

Strengthening the fleet of trams with three tram-trains is not the same as having three more vehicles running around increasing frequency.

 

Tram-trains on delivery were not capable of "...running on existing infrastructure."

 

That's why it is a trial of the tram-train principle and not three extra trams.

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Doesn't reflect well on the procurement and manufacturing. I am not aware of any new trains taking 18 months from delivery to first passenger use in the UK for running on existing infrastructure. Perhaps an unwanted record for Sheffield

 

Do you have a problem making links between information you are given?

 

I have previously said:

A) Part of the trial is that the Stadler vehicles were an off the shelf solution, rather than specifically designed for the Supertram network as the original

Tram were. This is something the trial is examining as to how effective and appropriate a solution that is.

B) The testing period took longer than expected.

 

Therefore perhaps one of the outcomes of the TRIAL will be that vehicles need to be specifically designed for a specific network. Therefore an element of the trial has been successful.

 

And in answer to your supposition it’s typical in the rail industry to have a commissioning period in the region of 36 months.

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Do you have a problem making links between information you are given?

 

I have previously said:

A) Part of the trial is that the Stadler vehicles were an off the shelf solution, rather than specifically designed for the Supertram network as the original

Tram were. This is something the trial is examining as to how effective and appropriate a solution that is.

B) The testing period took longer than expected.

 

Therefore perhaps one of the outcomes of the TRIAL will be that vehicles need to be specifically designed for a specific network. Therefore an element of the trial has been successful.

 

And in answer to your supposition it’s typical in the rail industry to have a commissioning period in the region of 36 months.

 

I would have thought it obvious that something like this would have needed to be designed for the network they are designed to run on.

 

 

A commissioning period of 36 months perhaps but not 18 months from commencement of delivery to running in service - true they may be phased in

 

By all means provide me with a list of the recent train deliveries that have had a delay of 18 months from delivery to in service running/testing. Greater Anglia announced in April 2017 they would be buying brand new trains to be introduced in 2019 /2020 into service for instance. I think you are again confusing the the whole purchase process with the process from delivery to in service.

 

One thing is certain it is going to be interesting to see what happens when they get out on to Network Rail territory

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I would have thought it obvious that something like this would have needed to be designed for the network they are designed to run on.

 

 

A commissioning period of 36 months perhaps but not 18 months from commencement of delivery to running in service - true they may be phased in

 

By all means provide me with a list of the recent train deliveries that have had a delay of 18 months from delivery to in service running/testing. Greater Anglia announced in April 2017 they would be buying brand new trains to be introduced in 2019 /2020 into service for instance. I think you are again confusing the the whole purchase process with the process from delivery to in service.

 

One thing is certain it is going to be interesting to see what happens when they get out on to Network Rail territory

 

It is a trial and no contracts exist for the use of the tram-trains after the trial.They are not trams, they are all tram-trains with different operational characteristics to trams.

They were not "commissioned" for Supertram routes, they were "commissioned" tor a pilot study/project/trial to operate on Supertram tracks and Network Rail tracks.

Beyond a successful trial period a service four tram-trains would be required to maintain the Cathedral to Parkgate and three would be available to strengthen the current ageing fleet.

Until the trial is complete and a decision made about its future Stagecoach Supertram cannot rely on the availability of the tram-trains. They might not want them.

 

Examples of problems include the new Blackpool trams of the '50s, Edinburgh trams of the '00s to the current Class 700 and 800 and variations and late agreements on conversions.

Greater Anglia will still not be able to operate its new electrics in a full service to Cambridge North or Kings Lynn.

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It is a trial and no contracts exist for the use of the tram-trains after the trial.They are not trams, they are all tram-trains with different operational characteristics to trams.

They were not "commissioned" for Supertram routes, they were "commissioned" tor a pilot study/project/trial to operate on Supertram tracks and Network Rail tracks.

Beyond a successful trial period a service four tram-trains would be required to maintain the Cathedral to Parkgate and three would be available to strengthen the current ageing fleet.

Until the trial is complete and a decision made about its future Stagecoach Supertram cannot rely on the availability of the tram-trains. They might not want them.

 

Examples of problems include the new Blackpool trams of the '50s, Edinburgh trams of the '00s to the current Class 700 and 800 and variations and late agreements on conversions.

Greater Anglia will still not be able to operate its new electrics in a full service to Cambridge North or Kings Lynn.

 

Is not the trial for two years and the contract for the trams five?

 

The big problem for Edinburgh was the track if I recal there was a discussion about testing the trams in Croydon whilst they were waiting for track. Too young to remember Blackpool but one might have hoped that if there were problems then someone might have learnt the lessons 60 years later.

 

It is well known that if the spec keeps changing then problems arise have a word with the defence department for example after example.

 

Given the Greater Anglia is still a few years off then whilst surprising they would seem to be aware that something has gone wrong and not found out at the last minute they had bought something unfit for purpose. I am not aware with the problems there - is it that once again network rail have failed to deliver their side of the bargain or a problem in the original spec.

 

As I said I find it hard to believe that any one would have bought trams that were not at least designed to work on the existing tram network after all 3 of them were purchased to strengthen the service - true having more will provide cover for failures of the 4 on the Rotherham service

 

The concept of trams is great but based on this who would be advocating any extension to the network here. Perhaps with the Northern Powerhouse GMT might be bought in to show what can be done- no Don't take that as a serious suggestion but they do at least seem to have both vision and a degree of competency lacking here in Sheffield

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So... a bit of snow last night & yet again our Supertram system lets the public down.

 

I can understand the delays caused by the First Bus which became stuck on Park Grange Rd, however the rest of today's issues are depressingly familiar -

 

Failure of the points at Gleadless Townend (again) leading to temporary suspension of the service to Herdings Park - this seems to have happened every time it's snowed this winter.

 

Flooding at Spring Lane (again) causing delays. Another regular issue which hasn't been resolved.

 

Inevitably, another tram failure - this time at Tinsley, leading to temporary suspension of the service through to Meadowhall.

 

Hardly a shining advertisement for public transport!

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So... a bit of snow last night & yet again our Supertram system lets the public down.

 

Can’t be much of that axe left that you’re constantly grinding now eh.

 

 

I can understand the delays caused by the First Bus which became stuck on Park Grange Rd, however the rest of today's issues are depressingly familiar -

 

Failure of the points at Gleadless Townend (again) leading to temporary suspension of the service to Herdings Park - this seems to have happened every time it's snowed this winter.

 

How many points have failed on national rail network today?

 

Flooding at Spring Lane (again) causing delays. Another regular issue which hasn't been resolved.

 

Flooding is the trams fault how?

 

Inevitably, another tram failure - this time at Tinsley, leading to temporary suspension of the service through to Meadowhall.

 

How many buses and cars broke down today?

 

Hardly a shining advertisement for public transport!

 

How’s about you write a factual post showing accurate comparisons of how many buses and regional trains were cancelled, broke down or late

 

You might have a shred of credibility then :hihi:

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every time it's snowed this winter.

 

Flooding at Spring Lane (again) causing delays. Another regular issue which hasn't been resolved.

 

It wont get resolved till they clear out a blocked drain on the roadside going into the City.

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