Morrisons Upper Car Park Hillsborough

[Fougasse 10]

No, you are categorically not liable and it is the myth that you are that stops people from doing the decent thing and clearing their own patch.

 

Shopowners in particular should do so because they stand to benefit from clear paths, having said that - in relation to OP - that car park I believe is managed by the Barracks estate management (whoever that may be) and not Morrisons. I agree though, they probably should have taken measures.

 

I reckon all that's entirely reasonable tbh.

 

It strikes me that anyone taking whatever measures they can to increase the safety of pavements etc, should really be thanked rather than criticised.

 

Hst, I'm not sure what the availability of grit bins is in various places. Can't recall seeing one on Ecclesall Road tbh.

 

I tend to wear Yaktrax on my boots in the ice/snow etc in winter, partly to stop me looking a complete *** when I go head over heels on icy pavements and to prevent damaged limbs, but also the NHS doesn't need any extra pressure from broken bones at this time of year, when all it costs me is £10 and five minutes to stick them on.

[hagrid 10]

My daughter runs a Pub and does not clear the paths outside and here is why.

 

Under current legislation, householders and companies open themselves up to legal action if they try to clear a public pavement outside their property. If they leave the path in a treacherous condition, they cannot be sued.

 

Odd world we live in

[Fougasse 10]

My daughter runs a Pub and does not clear the paths outside and here is why.

 

Under current legislation, householders and companies open themselves up to legal action if they try to clear a public pavement outside their property. If they leave the path in a treacherous condition, they cannot be sued.

 

Odd world we live in

 

Surely the critical point there is leaving the path in a 'treacherous condition'?

 

Clearing snow and leaving ice behind MIGHT amount to that (not sure how though). Removing as much ice/snow as possible surely doesn't? Not even sure how throwing grit around might amount to that at all tbh.

[barleycorn 10]

My daughter runs a Pub and does not clear the paths outside and here is why.

 

Under current legislation, householders and companies open themselves up to legal action if they try to clear a public pavement outside their property. If they leave the path in a treacherous condition, they cannot be sued.

 

Odd world we live in

You can be sued for anything,hell I could sue you for making such an ignorant post. As has already been stated up thread there is no law preventing you from clearing snow and ice. Now you can tell your daughter to get out there with a shovel and some grit.

 

https://www.gov.uk/clear-snow-road-path-cycleway

http://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/law-surrounding-clearing-snow-ice-909444

[ENG601PM 10]

My daughter runs a Pub and does not clear the paths outside and here is why.

 

Under current legislation, householders and companies open themselves up to legal action if they try to clear a public pavement outside their property. If they leave the path in a treacherous condition, they cannot be sued.

 

Odd world we live in

 

She's completely incorrect. The official advice from both the Health and Safety Executive and the Government is to carry on clearing.

 

Minister for Health and Safety Lord Freud said:

 

People need to be aware that they will not be reprimanded for doing a good deed by clearing ice and snow. The truth is very simple: you can clear ice and snow from footpaths and pavements but always be careful that you don’t put yourself in danger.

 

Judith Hackett CBE, Chair of the Health and Safety Executive

 

If we face another harsh winter we need many more local authorities to encourage residents to do the responsible and neighbourly thing shifting their own snow… there's no health and safety reason for them not to.

 

As an operator of commercial / public premises she could be liable if she DOESN'T follow the HSE advice.

To reduce the risk of slips on ice, frost or snow, you need to assess the risk and put in a system to manage it.

 

Identify the outdoor areas used by pedestrians most likely to be affected by ice, for example: - building entrances, car parks, pedestrian walkways, shortcuts, sloped areas and areas constantly in the shade or wet.

 

Put a procedure in place to prevent an icy surface forming and/or keep pedestrians off the slippery surface;

• Use grit (see separate article below for more detail) or similar, on areas prone to be slippery in frosty, icy conditions;
  
• Consider covering walkways e.g. by an arbour high enough for people to walk through, or use an insulating material on smaller areas overnight;
  
• Divert pedestrians to less slippery walkways and barrier off existing ones.
  

 

 

 

Tell her to get the shovel out, she'll be fine. If it's too much like hard work I'm sure that the offer of a few free pints will do the trick.

[Arthur Ritus 30]

I was listening to jeremy vine on radio 2 once about this matter when the landlord of the Strines pub phoned in. He said he was sued by a customer who hurt himself falling down in the carpark on the snow.

 

The landlord not expecting much custom due to the conditions cleared only half of the car park knowing it would be plenty of room. This customer for some reason went and parked in a part of the carpark that he hadn't cleared and walking from his car to the pub slipped and fell. The reason the landlord was held accountable was because he had cleared only half the carpark, if he hadn't cleared any at all he would not have been. He said in future he would not clear it at all.

 

I would always put some salt down after clearing snow if its still a bit slippy for similar reason as by clearing the snow you are acknowledging a problem but not correctly resolving it.

Edited December 12, 2017 by Arthur Ritus

[hagrid 10]

Probably just gossip about the clearing of paths, however the advice on the Gov web site

stated this.

 

You can clear snow and ice from pavements yourself. It’s unlikely that you’ll be sued or held responsible if someone is injured on a path or pavement if you’ve cleared it carefully.

 

The word Unlikely springs out at you. If it is a council path then they will probably be

responsible for clearing and making safe.

 

I think that the Area Manager warned my daughter not to clear the outside of her pub.

 

Years ago we all cleared the bit in front of your house and also the neighbours if the were unable to do so. Never a thought about being sued.

[Dannyno 19]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/snow-clearing-health-and-safety-myth-shattered

 

"Snow Clearing Health and Safety Myth Shattered"

 

---------- Post added 12-12-2017 at 17:22 ----------

 

I was listening to jeremy vine on radio 2 once about this matter when the landlord of the Strines pub phoned in. He said he was sued by a customer who hurt himself falling down in the carpark on the snow.

 

Being sued is not the same as being successfully sued. How much did the landlord end up paying in compensation? Anything?

 

Nobody can stop someone getting a lawyer to draft a threatening letter. Doesn't mean there's necessarily actually a case to answer.

[tzijlstra 11]

My daughter runs a Pub and does not clear the paths outside and here is why.

 

Under current legislation, householders and companies open themselves up to legal action if they try to clear a public pavement outside their property. If they leave the path in a treacherous condition, they cannot be sued.

 

Odd world we live in

 

As others have pointed out - nonsense. Stop propagating it.

[ANGELFIRE1 10]

Can't believe how rude some of the reply's are to my post are on here

Thought this was a site for adults ???

 

 

It's purported to be a family forum I believe. You will have to get used to some of the adults behaving like petulant children though. It's my belief that they roam the forum looking to post in some kind of superior manor, believing that it makes them look intelligent.

 

Angel1.

[Padders 2,871]

It's purported to be a family forum I believe. You will have to get used to some of the adults behaving like petulant children though. It's my belief that they roam the forum looking to post in some kind of superior manor, believing that it makes them look intelligent.

 

Angel1.

 

Or the wybourn.

[Arthur Ritus 30]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/snow-clearing-health-and-safety-myth-shattered

 

"Snow Clearing Health and Safety Myth Shattered"

 

---------- Post added 12-12-2017 at 17:22 ----------

 

 

Being sued is not the same as being successfully sued. How much did the landlord end up paying in compensation? Anything?

 

Nobody can stop someone getting a lawyer to draft a threatening letter. Doesn't mean there's necessarily actually a case to answer.

 

I only remember he talked of being claimed against all past tense, he didn't say how much was paid, no doubt sorted through insurance. He did say the reason he was claimed against was because he had cleared half the car park and would not have been held liable if he had not. Presumably some barrier tape across the uncleared section and a warning notice would have kept him liable free. Perhaps it did not go to court, as is often the case when insurance companies are involved they settle in their own way which is really the same as being held liable just different set of judges.

 

I do have to think if he was clearing all the car park and the customer arrived whilst he was halfway through how would it have been any different? i suppose he would have been present to give verbal advice.

 

All said i cannot find any record of it on the net except for some one elses thread on here https://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=453661. The next time i am in there i will ask if the current tenants know anything of it.

 

There has to be the extremes like if i chucked water on the path to freeze and make slippery quite rightly i should be liable if it caused an accident. The water company is responsible for damage caused by its leaking pipes (i personally have claimed against them for damages caused by flooding to the house, not court just off their insurance company) so if that leak then froze and caused and accident is it not the same?

Edited December 12, 2017 by Arthur Ritus
more thought