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16 hours ago, L00b said:

So, in West77's world, it is "undemocratic" for the democratically-elected representatives of the American people, to use constitutional measures for putting an end to Trump's unprecedented attempts at subverting American democracy...

 

:|

 

...do you want to try that one again, maybe?

Serious question: Is Trump more likely to cause further rioting by saying that he is not going to Biden's inauguration or is Pelosi more likely to cause further rioting by trying to impeach Trump?

4 minutes ago, frigate said:

 

 

4 minutes ago, frigate said:

 

Pelos symbolises the problems with the Democrats that resulted in Trump’s election in 2016. At no time since 2016 have the Democrats with Pelosi at the forefront of their arrogance ever addressed the issue of how someone like Trump could win an election. After 8 years of Obama did not someone question what they were doing wrong. If the Democrats were able to address at a level of commonality the concerns of more Americans Trump would not have won. But at no time in 4 years was there any introspection or evaluation. No one asked what did we do wrong. Instead led by Pelosi they embarked on a furious campaign against the President of the United States. His election was never accepted. And now they complain about a lack of a smooth transition. And were they a more reasonable lot that would be a fully justifiable complaint.
So after 4 years of constant attack Pelosi and her comrades should hardly be surprised that there is division in the country. Trump is at fault. So is Pelosi. And what does she do to heal division. She says to the almost 75 million people who voted for Trump that we are now going to pursue him much as one did to your enemies in the 17th century. Which guarantees further division. Bitterness does not make a politician and I can only hope that Joe Biden separates himself from Pelosi and says to his party, now is a time of forgiveness and reconciliation and not revenge.

Edited by frigate
.....................

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8 minutes ago, frigate said:

Serious question: Is Trump more likely to cause further rioting by saying that he is not going to Biden's inauguration or is Pelosi more likely to cause further rioting by trying to impeach Trump?

 

Pelos symbolises the problems with the Democrats that resulted in Trump’s election in 2016. At no time since 2016 have the Democrats with Pelosi at the forefront of their arrogance ever addressed the issue of how someone like Trump could win an election. After 8 years of Obama did not someone question what they were doing wrong. If the Democrats were able to address at a level of commonality the concerns of more Americans Trump would not have won. But at no time in 4 years was there any introspection or evaluation. No one asked what did we do wrong. Instead led by Pelosi they embarked on a furious campaign against the President of the United States. His election was never accepted. And now they complain about a lack of a smooth transition. And were they a more reasonable lot that would be a fully justifiable complaint.
So after 4 years of constant attack Pelosi and her comrades should hardly be surprised that there is division in the country. Trump is at fault. So is Pelosi. And what does she do to heal division. She says to the almost 75 million people who voted for Trump that we are now going to pursue him much as one did to your enemies in the 17th century. Which guarantees further division. Bitterness does not make a politician and I can only hope that Joe Biden separates himself from Pelosi and says to his party, now is a time of forgiveness and reconciliation and not revenge.

Excellent balanced contribution. 

 

The Democratics should listen to the words of Michelle Obama 

Quote

“When they go low, we go high”

 

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7 minutes ago, frigate said:

Serious question: Is Trump more likely to cause further rioting by saying that he is not going to Biden's inauguration or is Pelosi more likely to cause further rioting by trying to impeach Trump?

Serious answer: Neither.

 

Any more loaded questions?

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2 minutes ago, West 77 said:

Excellent balanced contribution. 

 

The Democratics should listen to the words of Michelle Obama 

 

I'd imagine there are alot of Americans who are quite happy not to be coming together with wannabe facists like trump.

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22 minutes ago, frigate said:

Serious question: Is Trump more likely to cause further rioting by saying that he is not going to Biden's inauguration or is Pelosi more likely to cause further rioting by trying to impeach Trump?

 

Pelos symbolises the problems with the Democrats that resulted in Trump’s election in 2016. At no time since 2016 have the Democrats with Pelosi at the forefront of their arrogance ever addressed the issue of how someone like Trump could win an election. After 8 years of Obama did not someone question what they were doing wrong. If the Democrats were able to address at a level of commonality the concerns of more Americans Trump would not have won. But at no time in 4 years was there any introspection or evaluation. No one asked what did we do wrong. Instead led by Pelosi they embarked on a furious campaign against the President of the United States. His election was never accepted. And now they complain about a lack of a smooth transition. And were they a more reasonable lot that would be a fully justifiable complaint.
So after 4 years of constant attack Pelosi and her comrades should hardly be surprised that there is division in the country. Trump is at fault. So is Pelosi. And what does she do to heal division. She says to the almost 75 million people who voted for Trump that we are now going to pursue him much as one did to your enemies in the 17th century. Which guarantees further division. Bitterness does not make a politician and I can only hope that Joe Biden separates himself from Pelosi and says to his party, now is a time of forgiveness and reconciliation and not revenge.

An American constitutional lawyer was on television yesterday talking about the necessity of impeaching Trump, not just to make him legally accountable; but to any future American president thinking they can take the American people and system for a ride, and not face the full weight of the law as a consequence. There has to be the rule of law. 

 

I don't agree that because you think the Democrats are arrogant, then they are just as responsible for the division in America, or the scenes on Capitol Hill. And I doubt whether any judge would consider Nancy Pelosi as culpable either.

 

19 minutes ago, West 77 said:

Excellent balanced contribution. 

 

The Democratics should listen to the words of Michelle Obama 

“When they go low, we go high”

 

Was Michelle Obama using that phrase in the context of what happened on Capitol Hill, and the immediate events leading up to it?

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The problem is that as far as a lot of Republicans are concerned, what the Democrats "did wrong" last time was have a black guy at the top.

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On 11/01/2021 at 23:30, tinfoilhat said:

You're comparing 1938  - 1945 Hitler to trump. I'm comparing 1935 Hitler to trump.  You look how they both manipulate their followers and have a guess on what he'd do if - and there is plenty of anecdotal evidence some of his followers would have done it - they'd have lynched Pelosi? 

 

EDIT: he's still not dialing back the rhetoric, and we might not have heard the last of it.

 

BBC News - Capitol riots: FBI warnings amid fears of more pro-Trump violence
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-55625707

 

On 12/01/2021 at 08:56, Delbow said:

Tinfoilhat is right - our knowledge of what the Nazis ultimately did can obscure our knowledge of what they were like before they perpetrated genocide. Before that they seemed a lot more ordinary - many people thought they were just silly; the Communists thought they would be a temporary blip, but in the event nearly all the Communists were murdered or imprisoned by the Nazis. So we have to remember that there is a phase before the murderous phase and compare that earlier phase to the present day, otherwise we end up with the logical fallacy that because there's not a genocide happening now, it can't happen again.

 

21 hours ago, melthebell said:

Not really, he has a knack for managing to whip up the crowds to such an extent that they become obsessed and radicalised to then be willing to commit heinous acts, and not even think they are doing anything wrong, in fact they are the good boys doing their country right as proud patriots in their warped eyes.

using lies, mistruths and nationalistic propaganda to appeal to the lowest common denominator, those who think they have nothing. Sowing the seeds that they are the victims and their country is under attack from the left, the communists, the immigrants, foriegners.

 

Certainly fits what the nazis were doing to sway their fellow countrymen.

 

Sowing extremism for his own ends

I will agree that Trump shares some similar characteristics to Hitler. He certainly thrived on the adulation of the crowds he addressed and loved the attention he received that had the result of making him feel more powerful and delusional. So there was a potential for abuse of power and in view of recent events we can see what that led to. 

 

But I can't imagine anything as bad as the situation in Fascist Germany ever happening in America. 

And yet, i could hardly  believe what I was seeing when I watched the storming of the Capital, what a shock that was! 

 

I rest my case. 

 

 

 

Edited by janie48

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1 minute ago, janie48 said:

 

 

I will agree that Trump shares some similar characteristics to Hitler. He certainly thrived on the adulation of the crowds he addressed and loved the attention he received that had the result of making him feel more powerful and delusional. So there was a potential for abuse of power and in view of recent events we can see what that led to. 

 

But I can't imagine anything as bad as the situation in Fascist Germany ever happening in America. 

And yet, i could hardly  believe what I seeing when I watched the storming of the Capital, what a shock that was! 

 

I rest my case. 

 

 

 

I think the US gets less predictable the more divided it gets. There are clearly a lot of people who see the prospect of racial equality as a threat, and when people feel threatened they act differently. And the QAnon stuff is completely bonkers but a lot of people think it's true, and that the Dems getting back in will allow systematic child sexual abuse on a grand scale. And they're all armed. So God only knows what's going to happen - which is kind of worrying.

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6 minutes ago, Delbow said:

I think the US gets less predictable the more divided it gets. There are clearly a lot of people who see the prospect of racial equality as a threat, and when people feel threatened they act differently. And the QAnon stuff is completely bonkers but a lot of people think it's true, and that the Dems getting back in will allow systematic child sexual abuse on a grand scale. And they're all armed. So God only knows what's going to happen - which is kind of worrying.

indeed it is, theres already been armed militias "protesting" outside certain "capitals", Michael Moore has seen posters advertising such things for the week of the inauguration. at ALL 50 capitals

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The only positive is that if the US has so much going on in its own backyard, it might have less time to go meddling in everyone else's.

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1 hour ago, Delbow said:

I think the US gets less predictable the more divided it gets. There are clearly a lot of people who see the prospect of racial equality as a threat, and when people feel threatened they act differently. And the QAnon stuff is completely bonkers but a lot of people think it's true, and that the Dems getting back in will allow systematic child sexual abuse on a grand scale. And they're all armed. So God only knows what's going to happen - which is kind of worrying.

3 firearms per person on average.

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I am loath to post on a political issue, but.....

 

Many Democrats have never really accepted the result of the 2016 Presidential election. That someone like Trump could garner a majority of votes and beat Hillary was inconceivable. He was the anithesis of everything they strived for, so they moaned and whinged and tried to frustrate hime at every turn. I don't care for Trump at all, and would never vote for someone like him here, but that's their system.

 

Having now got their wish and seen Biden elected, they are using the dying days of Trump's office to extract retribution. They will be rid of him in a week or so, but vindictiveness has set in. The USA has many issues that need sorting, Covid-19 being the most urgent. Yet they are spending days on inward looking self-pleasuring. 

 

No one comes out of it all with any credit. 

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