Mr Trump - All discussion here

[Guest]

13 hours ago, West 77 said:

Too many to mention.  However, he deserves most credit for supporting the UK leaving the EU.

That was his personal belief,  not a recommendation.

 

He wasn't saying that in terms of the UK being better off without the EU.

 

 

[Anna B 1,414]

8 hours ago, Pettytom said:

Trump comes across as entitled, a bit stupid and bigoted.

 

If you like that in a politician, that’s ok. If you admire that, then there’s probably something wrong with you.

 

He’s horrific and he’s lost. He won’t be missed by any reasonable human 

I agree. I do not like Trump, far from it! I was merely answering the question of why, IMO, people voted for him. 

What, in your opinion, is his appeal to so many American voters? Saying they're all stupid isn't good enough. There's a message here that people are ignoring.

[butlers 261]

Morning everyone

 

Trump is losing in Georgia

 

And the votes that flipped it came in the late civil rights icon John Lewis"s seat.

 

 

That folks is poetic.

 

 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, butlers said:

Morning everyone

 

Trump is losing in Georgia

 

And the votes that flipped it came in the late civil rights icon John Lewis"s seat.

 

 

That folks is poetic.

 

 

Good!

 

Trump is seeing the effects of his actions.

 

He didn't even attend John Lewis's funeral when you had Clinton, Bush and Obama deliver eulogies.

[L00b 441]

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

I agree. I do not like Trump, far from it! I was merely answering the question of why, IMO, people voted for him. 

What, in your opinion, is his appeal to so many American voters? Saying they're all stupid isn't good enough. There's a message here that people are ignoring.

It is. Only ignorant people could ever be led to believe, that a rabble-rousing wind-up merchant like Trump is a safer bet for improving their lot, than Clinton back in 2016, or Biden in 2020.

 

The issue is, there is an awful lot of them. That is what makes mass populist votes like those for Trump in 2020, such an indictment on the US educational system, at least as much as on other US societal failings. It is not exclusive to the US, either.

 

Politicians dislike too smart an electorate, unsurprisingly. And populist ones, like Trump, Johnson, Putin, Erdogan, Orban, Duterte <etc>, most of all.

 

I get the protest character of such votes by genuinely-disenfranchised voters who really want to 'change the system'. But a smart (enough) electorate uses a protest vote only when it is safe to do so, e.g. in an election system with a run-off built-in.

 

That's e.g. how the LePens (Senior back then, Junior these days) or Melenchons always make decent voting tallies in France in the first round of the presidential election: it's the eliminatory round wherein it's safe enough to protest-vote then...but not in the 2nd round wherein the actual incumbent gets voted in for the next few years. Exact same voting behaviour can be seen time-and-again in many other democracies with similar run-off systems.

Edited November 6, 2020 by L00b

[Pettytom 1]

1 hour ago, Anna B said:

I agree. I do not like Trump, far from it! I was merely answering the question of why, IMO, people voted for him. 

What, in your opinion, is his appeal to so many American voters? Saying they're all stupid isn't good enough. There's a message here that people are ignoring.

I think that  a subset of the American population are poorly educated, badly informed and not very curious. Stupid is a reasonable word for people like that. 
 

Trump appeals to the base instincts of people like that. There are parallels between his election strategy, Johnson’s strategy and Leave UK. That’s not to say that everyone who voted for Trump/Johnson/Brexit was stupid. But they all managed to attract a disproportionate number of such voters.

[davyboy 19]

One of our neighbours is an American from Louisiana.

She supports Trump and says he his a good man!!!!

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, West 77 said:

The UK had already voted to leave the EU before before Trump became US President. Trump supported the democratic decision the UK people made.  Nigel Farage helped in the 2016 Presidential campaign for Trump.  Trump would hardly want Farage helping him if he didn't support the UK leaving the EU.  Trump made it clear he wanted to do a trade deal with the UK and told Theresa May the UK should sue the crooked EU. 

 

 

And Biden was Obama's vice President at the time. 

Yes,  Trump and Farage.

 

Enough said 

[Michael_W 11]

11 minutes ago, L00b said:

It is. Only ignorant people could ever be led to believe, that a rabble-rousing wind-up merchant like Trump is a safer bet for improving their lot, than Clinton back in 2016, or Biden in 2020.

 

The issue is, there is an awful lot of them. That is what makes mass populist votes like those for Trump in 2020, such an indictment on the US educational system, at least as much as on other US societal failings. It is not exclusive to the US, either.

 

Politicians dislike too smart an electorate, unsurprisingly. And populist ones, like Trump, Johnson, Putin, Erdogan, Orban, Duterte <etc>, most of all.

 

I get the protest character of such votes by genuinely-disenfranchised voters who really want to 'change the system'. But a smart (enough) electorate uses a protest vote only when it is safe to do so, e.g. in an election system with a run-off built-in.

 

That's e.g. how the LePens (Senior back then, Junior these days) or Melenchons always make decent voting tallies in France in the first round of the presidential election: it's the eliminatory round wherein it's safe enough to protest-vote then...but not in the 2nd round wherein the actual incumbent gets voted in for the next few years. Exact same voting behaviour can be seen time-and-again in many other democracies with similar run-off systems.

There is only one thing I find worse than ignorant, and that is ignorance coupled with arrogance, I disagree with Anna  B frequently but she was correct in her statement that you highlighted in the quote, and that is what many people vote against, people are not voting for Trump or Johnson etc ... they are voting against the likes of you, people who think everyone should think like them or they are stupid, not educated enough blah blah blah you should listen to yourself fella.

I was 30 plus years in the AEU, MSF, Unite unions even been a rep, but I will never vote Labour again in my life, because Labour has been taken over by that very same arrogant ignorance displayed by those very same 'better than you' identity politic riddled 'middle class'  attitudes, little wonder that many working class people have turned against it don't you think ?

[altus 540]

16 hours ago, West 77 said:

Too many to mention.  However, he deserves most credit for supporting the UK leaving the EU.

The only reason Trump supports Brexit is it weakens both the UK and the EU. It's not some great ideological position he's taking here.

[tinfoilhat 11]

2 hours ago, Anna B said:

I agree. I do not like Trump, far from it! I was merely answering the question of why, IMO, people voted for him. 

What, in your opinion, is his appeal to so many American voters? Saying they're all stupid isn't good enough. There's a message here that people are ignoring.

Erm, that alot of Americans are racist? Alot of Americans believe any old **** on Facebook? Alot will believe his rant from last night, none of which had a scrap of evidence.

[altus 540]

15 minutes ago, West 77 said:

Why would Trump want the UK  weakened when he has commercial interests here?  The EU will certainly be weaker now the UK has left.                                

Because it means the US could negotiate a trade deal more advantageous to the US than it otherwise could.

 

Even if you are just focussing on benefits to him personally, a deal reducing UK environmental protections might make it easier for Trump to build golf courses on places denoted SSSI.