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2 hours ago, Longcol said:

 

So what is your interpretation of this ?

 

"In an interview on Fox Business Network, Trump explicitly noted two funding provisions that Democrats are seeking in a relief package that has stalled on Capitol Hill. Without the additional money, he said, the Postal Service won’t have the resources to handle a flood of ballots from voters who are seeking to avoid polling places during the coronavirus pandemic.

“If we don’t make a deal, that means they don’t get the money,” Trump told host Maria Bartiromo. “That means they can’t have universal mail-in voting; they just can’t have it.”

As I understand it (the bit in bold) is about Universal Mail In Voting whereby all votes are cast by mail and not in person. The extra money is being demanded by the democrats to enable that to happen and yet so far only a few states have stated they will be doing it that way. Apparently there is a great deal of risk in that it is not secure enough and can be fraudulently used as it has been in the past.  Meanwhile here in the UK postal voting has been criticised many times for that very same reason. Listening to the Fox interview it seems Trump wants a voting ID system put in place so that people can go out and vote securely as doing it that way it is not open to abuse. Can't see any problem with the latter.

Edited by apelike

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The NZ election was postponed for 4 weeks in conjunction with the main opposition party.

I could not point to Belarus on a map but have seen a clip of state security guys beating the living Jesus out of what looked like students.

Has a feel of Romania's last election about it.

 

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7 hours ago, apelike said:

As I understand it (the bit in bold) is about Universal Mail In Voting whereby all votes are cast by mail and not in person. The extra money is being demanded by the democrats to enable that to happen and yet so far only a few states have stated they will be doing it that way. Apparently there is a great deal of risk in that it is not secure enough and can be fraudulently used as it has been in the past.  Meanwhile here in the UK postal voting has been criticised many times for that very same reason. Listening to the Fox interview it seems Trump wants a voting ID system put in place so that people can go out and vote securely as doing it that way it is not open to abuse. Can't see any problem with the latter.

The Democrats are not seeking 'universal mail voting', that's a strawman.

 

The extra money demanded by the Democrats is not needed, USPS and its union are on record confirming that they can cope with the 150m votes  (USPS handles 500m items a day), and they already started engaging/preparing with electoral bodies in each US state as far back as March.

 

The problem is De Joy's hard-charging reforms hindering USPS workflows and asset-stripping it. 

 

De Joy, who is a long-time Trump donor ($2m estimate), was only recently appointed to the Postmaster General position by the USPS board...members of which are appointed by Trump.

Edited by L00b

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8 hours ago, tinfoilhat said:

Democracy is a funny thing. Belarus had elections, trump is trying to make voting hard, the lovely Jacinda has cancelled NZ elections and nobody has batted an eyelid!

Not cancelled, postponed for very real public health concerns. The fact that she's clearly a responsible leader and not a maniac helps.

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1 hour ago, Halibut said:

Not cancelled, postponed for very real public health concerns. The fact that she's clearly a responsible leader and not a maniac helps.

Postponed at the request of the opposition party as well. 

 

"The opposition National Party has argued the election should be delayed as restrictions on campaigning mean Ms Ardern had an unfair advantage."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53796434

 

Back to Mr Trump though, I can't see the USA either (a) being in a position where a four week delay would help (pandemic-wise) and (b) having both parties agree to the delay.

 

I think there is scope in the US electoral rules to allow for a small delay as the electoral college don't actually cast their votes for President (following the results of the national vote) until mid-December although it is unlikely. I wouldn't be surpirsed to see individual State Governors delaying the release of their states results to allow for delay in the post service.

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20 hours ago, BobOfRoth said:

The Democrats lost, President Trump is possibly one of the most successful presidents in Americas history

LOL, according to Trump, but in reality... his only major success is his ability to get it wrong.

 

By almost every measurable metric, be that jobs, the economy, national debt, golfing and ability to string a sentence together... his predecessor did a better job.

 

Quote

and the only US president that has decided to tackle amongst many many other things, one of the biggest problems in any society that of people trafficking.

Sure... well, except his predecessor:

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/blog/2017/01/13/obama-administration-efforts-combat-human-trafficking-0

 

...and the one before him:

https://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/infocus/traffic/

 

So much for the "only US president" :?

 

Quote

No other President has done so much to try and deal with this problem and he should be applauded.

Nope:

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/06/20/trumps-human-trafficking-record-is-fake-news/

"these seemingly small changes amount to a systematic dismantling of services for America’s most vulnerable communities, particularly noncitizen victims."

Edited by Magilla

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10 hours ago, apelike said:

As I understand it (the bit in bold) is about Universal Mail In Voting whereby all votes are cast by mail and not in person. The extra money is being demanded by the democrats to enable that to happen and yet so far only a few states have stated they will be doing it that way. Apparently there is a great deal of risk in that it is not secure enough and can be fraudulently used as it has been in the past.  Meanwhile here in the UK postal voting has been criticised many times for that very same reason. Listening to the Fox interview it seems Trump wants a voting ID system put in place so that people can go out and vote securely as doing it that way it is not open to abuse. Can't see any problem with the latter.

I'm sure you're about to post a link to justify that "Apparently" because every official investigation I've seen reports of shows it's an insignificant issue (Donald Trump's tweets don't count). Don't forget, voting by mail is normal in many US states because it's simply not practical for the sparse populations to vote in person. Even before the pandemic about 25% of people voted that way, during the pandemic it's expected that 60% of people will. It's also worth remembering that Trump is encouraging his supporters to vote by mail - although they call it absentee ballots. With the reduced number of polling places, it makes sense to encourage as many people to vote by mail as possible to reduce the risk of spreading coronavirus.

 

Similarly, whilst there have been repeated claims of postal voting fraud in the UK, investigations have always found it to be a minor problem.

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12 hours ago, apelike said:

As I understand it (the bit in bold) is about Universal Mail In Voting whereby all votes are cast by mail and not in person. The extra money is being demanded by the democrats to enable that to happen and yet so far only a few states have stated they will be doing it that way. Apparently there is a great deal of risk in that it is not secure enough and can be fraudulently used as it has been in the past.  Meanwhile here in the UK postal voting has been criticised many times for that very same reason. Listening to the Fox interview it seems Trump wants a voting ID system put in place so that people can go out and vote securely as doing it that way it is not open to abuse. Can't see any problem with the latter.

Straight out of the Donald Trump playbook.

12 hours ago, apelike said:

As I understand it (the bit in bold) is about Universal Mail In Voting whereby all votes are cast by mail and not in person. The extra money is being demanded by the democrats to enable that to happen and yet so far only a few states have stated they will be doing it that way. Apparently there is a great deal of risk in that it is not secure enough and can be fraudulently used as it has been in the past.  Meanwhile here in the UK postal voting has been criticised many times for that very same reason. Listening to the Fox interview it seems Trump wants a voting ID system put in place so that people can go out and vote securely as doing it that way it is not open to abuse. Can't see any problem with the latter.

Dunno if you've noticed, but there's been a bit of a bug going round.

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4 hours ago, L00b said:

The Democrats are not seeking 'universal mail voting', that's a strawman.

Is it? well that's not a strawman by me as in his interview it clearly states that is what the Democrats are seeking. 

 

4 hours ago, L00b said:

The extra money demanded by the Democrats is not needed, USPS and its union are on record confirming that they can cope with the 150m votes  (USPS handles 500m items a day), and they already started engaging/preparing with electoral bodies in each US state as far back as March.

Yes I know, that's why I mentioned it before.

4 hours ago, L00b said:

The problem is De Joy's hard-charging reforms hindering USPS workflows and asset-stripping it. 

So on the one hand we have the USPS stating they can cope and yet on the other hand we have the idea that De Joy is asset stripping which is affecting its operation.... Mmmmm

 

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5 hours ago, Halibut said:

Not cancelled, postponed for very real public health concerns. The fact that she's clearly a responsible leader and not a maniac helps.

I know, I was being slightly facetious. Somebody - and I genuinely  can't remember who,  or from which side - suggested it was worth postponing the American election and was hammered for it. 

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49 minutes ago, Bargepole23 said:

Dunno if you've noticed, but there's been a bit of a bug going round.

Dunno if you have noticed that a great deal of the US public are not adhering to social distancing or the use of face coverings even though there is a bug going round. It is also possible to vote in person if it is done correctly and that is what other countries including New Zealand are doing.

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27 minutes ago, apelike said:

Is it? well that's not a strawman by me as in his interview it clearly states that is what the Democrats are seeking. 

I didn't say it was your strawman, did I?

27 minutes ago, apelike said:

So on the one hand we have the USPS stating they can cope and yet on the other hand we have the idea that De Joy is asset stripping which is affecting its operation.... Mmmmm

 

If in any doubt, as your uh-ming suggests, maybe you'd like to inform yourself about the issue a bit more? Just a friendly suggestion, no sarc.

 

The Atlantic of 4 days ago is a good start.

 

You can then enlarge your research to what is currently happening to sorting machines at USPS depots across the US (taken outside on orders with no explanation, and left fully exposed to the elements), and the mounting volume of anecdotal evidence (with filmed and/or photo evidence) about USPS post boxes condemened or removed overnight without notice, besides USPS delivery vans flatbed'd away in the wee hours (should you feel so inclined :)).

 

These reports should preferably be considered in the context of DeJoy' asset reduction plan for USPS, a Powerpoint reportedly presented to the USPS board less than month after he was appointed (circa May 2020, as I recall).

Edited by L00b

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