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2 minutes ago, Halibut said:

Can you imagine Boris (or the other poshboy/idiot for that matter) ever having the moral fortitude to call Trump out over his ever more blatantly racist rhetoric?

 

No, me neither. I find it both infuriating and profoundly depressing.

Pragmatically, we know that this cannot happen, because the dividend of the UK's plan to "regain control" has been to swap an imaginary EU bully for a very real US bully (get rid of your ambassador; sell your nhs or no deal; take our chlorinated chickens or no deal; do what we tell you about huawei and China or no deal <etc>).

 

So no, I can't imagine Boris ever calling Trump over anything.

 

Now Hunt made contrarian noises about the ambassador thing. But given his ministerial and leadership campaign records, I still wouldn't call it moral fortitude: he's just in different people's pockets, is all.

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20 minutes ago, Delayed said:

You've either not read my posts or deliberately misconstruing them to suit your own narrative. 

 

I've said they are inappropriate. You are trying to back me into a corner and say they are racist which doesn't make any difference to anything. I've said let's move on from trying to get me to say something

I've not misread your posts, they're very clear. You havent said trumps post are racist. You've said they're inappropriate, you've said it won't make any difference you saying they're racist, but you have not said they're racist.

 

If you don't want to say that, don't. I'm gave you an opportunity to clarify is all, but I'll leave it there. Your posts are there for all to see. 

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Hold on there TFH.  I have some sympathy for Delayed's position.

 

I am not convinced Trump is a racist.  Bear with me, before jumping into reply  😉

 

I have a theory that Trump is essentially amoral and apolitical.  He has no strong political opinions, evidenced by the fact he claimed to be a liberal democratic just a decade ago.  You don't make that kind of move over a decade with any innate and strongly held worldview.

 

What Trump is is an opportunist.  He has been advised to adopt his position by the likes of Gorka and Bannon and the weasley little runt whose name escapes me right now, because those very clever strategists understand the power of that base and realised he - and they - would get power if they played up to it.  And he does this now, over and over again, dogwhistling what he thinks will win him increased adoration at his rallies.  He knows that those tweets will be loved by his base, whether he believes in them or not.  Do you seriously think he has strong views on immigration, or Iran, or islam?  of course he doesn't - he has no strong views on anything.

 

He is an egotist.  Worse, he is a largely ignorant egotist.  The only driver he has is his self-regard and desire for approval.

 

Does that mean he is a racist?  I don't know.  I don't think he cares enough about the issue or any issue.  He just picks on anythnig he can to get a kick in for his fans, be it their origin, their looks, their intelligence, their nickname.  Were those particularly tweets racist, or could they be deemed as such.  Perhaps.  Either way, they were deeply ignorant and offensive, but that is the man we are dealing with.

Edited by bendix

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Theresa May has condemned Trump's remarks, according to a spokesman -  "The prime minister's view is that the language used to refer to these women was completely unacceptable."

 

I'm pleased she said something, but disappointed she didn't say it was racist.

Edited by Halibut

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1 hour ago, bendix said:

Hold on there TFH.  I have some sympathy for Delayed's position.

 

I am not convinced Trump is a racist.  Bear with me, before jumping into reply  😉

 

I have a theory that Trump is essentially amoral and apolitical.  He has no strong political opinions, evidenced by the fact he claimed to be a liberal democratic just a decade ago.  You don't make that kind of move over a decade with any innate and strongly held worldview.

 

What Trump is is an opportunist.  He has been advised to adopt his position by the likes of Gorka and Bannon and the weasley little runt whose name escapes me right now, because those very clever strategists understand the power of that base and realised he - and they - would get power if they played up to it.  And he does this now, over and over again, dogwhistling what he thinks will win him increased adoration at his rallies.  He knows that those tweets will be loved by his base, whether he believes in them or not.  Do you seriously think he has strong views on immigration, or Iran, or islam?  of course he doesn't - he has no strong views on anything.

 

He is an egotist.  Worse, he is a largely ignorant egotist.  The only driver he has is his self-regard and desire for approval.

 

Does that mean he is a racist?  I don't know.  I don't think he cares enough about the issue or any issue.  He just picks on anythnig he can to get a kick in for his fans, be it their origin, their looks, their intelligence, their nickname.  Were those particularly tweets racist, or could they be deemed as such.  Perhaps.  Either way, they were deeply ignorant and offensive, but that is the man we are dealing with.

Either way, his remarks are an utter disgrace. That’s the bottom line

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The remarks were clearly racist but I tend to agree with bendix that Trump has no strongly held views on anything other than his own status and advancement.

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His remarks are pretty bad. 

 

I have no issue with the one foreign born person being told to go back to where they are from (well it is rude, but not racist).

 

However three of the ladies were US born.   Trump was a tool.

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7 minutes ago, I1L2T3 said:

Either way, his remarks are an utter disgrace. That’s the bottom line

Candidly, it's hard to find any of his public utterances that aren't either a disgrace, or embarassingly stupid.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, JamesR123 said:

I have no issue with the one foreign born person being told to go back to where they are from (well it is rude, but not racist).

Given that you repeatedly claim to be a Lib Dem supporter, what do you think of your party leader Vince Cable calling Trump’s remarks racist and disgraceful?

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9 minutes ago, Top Cats Hat said:

Given that you repeatedly claim to be a Lib Dem supporter, what do you think of your party leader Vince Cable calling Trump’s remarks racist and disgraceful?

I have stated it a few times.  I am one.

 

I think his remarks were outrageous.  Too many people assume that someone who is non white is not from a white majority country.  Disgusting.

7 minutes ago, alchresearch said:

That's the kind of thing I expect from UKIP.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27202753

Also the type of thing you may get from a seasoned traveller.

 

I have no issue with someone being told to go back to their country.  I tend to stick away from English people abroad, because in my experience, it is the English that tend to be the most violent, drunken and least law abiding.

 

I would have no issue whatsoever with a Spaniard in one of the Costas telling an English person to go back to England after witnessing them peeing in the middle of the road or acting drunkenly.

 

People do not have  right to be in other people's countries.  When I lived abroad I tried my best to follow the laws and expectations.  Had I called foil of either, locals would have been within their rights to ask me to leave.

 

Do you disagree?

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14 minutes ago, JamesR123 said:

I have stated it a few times.  I am one.

 

I think his remarks were outrageous.  Too many people assume that someone who is non white is not from a white majority country.  Disgusting.

Also the type of thing you may get from a seasoned traveller.

 

I have no issue with someone being told to go back to their country.  I tend to stick away from English people abroad, because in my experience, it is the English that tend to be the most violent, drunken and least law abiding.

 

I would have no issue whatsoever with a Spaniard in one of the Costas telling an English person to go back to England after witnessing them peeing in the middle of the road or acting drunkenly.

 

People do not have  right to be in other people's countries.  When I lived abroad I tried my best to follow the laws and expectations.  Had I called foil of either, locals would have been within their rights to ask me to leave.

 

Do you disagree?

Rather than lager lout Brits on tour, what about the case at hand, of democratically-elected representatives, 3 of whom natives, going about their lawful business?

 

Do they have right to be in the US, you think?

 

Does their colour have nothing to do with Trump's description of their going back to "countries with non-functioning governments", you think?

Edited by L00b

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