Mr Trump - All discussion here

[JamesR123 0]

17 minutes ago, bendix said:

Seriously?  Even if that foreign born person has earned the right to live in their new country legally, either by having the necessary visas or through naturalisation, has a job, pays taxes, is a good citizen and involved in no crime?

 

Sorry james.  I had some sympathy for your (admittedly) complex position on this, but that statement is just wrong.

This is nonsense.  There is a bit of difference between annoyed householders getting noisy tenants evicted, and getting them to leave the country because they were foreign born.  And they were asked to move because they were noisy, not because they were Welsh.

 

You're either trolling, or you clearly havent thought through your position fully.

Seriously.  A person can say whatever they want.

 

The people were moved in because they were noisy and foreign. The local Vietnamese made it very clear that they stood for very little foolishness from foreigners.

 

They were not evicted in any legal way.  They were forced to go by mob rule.

Just now, Top Cats Hat said:

Outside totalitarian regimes, I know of no party which has a policy on what view people should take on any matter.

 

During the revelations about Theresa May/Amber Rudd’s hostile environment for immigrants, a 65 year old black, Jamaican man missed his mother’s funeral in Jamaica because the Home Office were starting deportation proceedings against him. He was worried that once he left the UK he would not be allowed to return.

 

This guy had not only been a career soldier for most of his life but had also won medals for his service with the British Army in the Falklands. He had come over as a child on his mother’s passport and despite having worked all his life, paid tax and National Insurance and was eligible for both an army and a state pension, the Home Office said that if he could not prove that he was eligible for residency in the UK he would be deported back to Jamaica.

 

His case is not unique. He is one of many thousands of people born in the Caribbean who find themselves in the same situation. I find your attempts to claim an equivalence between these people and lager louts on the Spanish Costas highly offensive. 😡 

If you know of no party that takes a policy on people being able to say to foreign born people to go home, why did you use the BNP as an example of a party?

 

Very naughty of you.

 

One think I know about the BNP is that they were investigated for racism, much like the party led by the man you fantically support.

 

You are strawmanning once again.  Deportation is not what Trump was suggesting, nor what I am talking about.  Please be more honest in your discussions with me.

 

I also find the accusation that I compared Englishmen in the costas to the person you mention almost as offensive as your constant defense of anti semitism.

 

A person saying "go home" to a foreign born person is not deporting them.  I should not have to explain this to you.

2 minutes ago, L00b said:

Indeed, he was suggesting that they go back home, without any objective ground what-so-ever. Quite the feat, for a head of state, never mind of one as mongrelified as the US.

 

The very definition of rank xenophobia for starters, which Trump managed to upgrade to outright racism once you take the ethnicity of the subjects of the tweet (qualified by the definitional characterstics of the 'countries' given by Trump) into account.

I am unsure as to whether you realise how xenophobic that last comment, equating social nuisance with criminal behaviour for foreign born people, makes you appear.

Only  a racist would view it as you did.

 

All people, born in any country have a potential to commit crime.  In fact, foreign born people in the UK commit crime at a lower rate than people born here.

 

The fact that you see an equivalence between foreign born people and crime is really sad.  Please read more about crime rates of migrants vs non migrants.  You may be surprised.

 

What I said was that I would have no problem asking a criminal not born here to leave.  I find a Frenchman punching an old lady?  I would quite happily tell them to go back to France.  A Brazillian selling crack cocaine?  Ask them to leave.

 

I would happily ask a person born here to leave too, but they are our problem, we have no right dumping our criminals on other countries.

[bendix 10]

I've come to the conclusion that James is not quite a unique poster with an interesting and nuanced shade on the issues of our time I thought he was, to thinking he might just be a bit of a silly arse.

 

 

[L00b 441]

16 minutes ago, JamesR123 said:

 Only  a racist would view it as you did.

 

All people, born in any country have a potential to commit crime.  In fact, foreign born people in the UK commit crime at a lower rate than people born here.

 

The fact that you see an equivalence between foreign born people and crime is really sad.  Please read more about crime rates of migrants vs non migrants.  You may be surprised.

 

What I said was that I would have no problem asking a criminal not born here to leave.  I find a Frenchman punching an old lady?  I would quite happily tell them to go back to France.  A Brazillian selling crack cocaine?  Ask them to leave.

 

I would happily ask a person born here to leave too, but they are our problem, we have no right dumping our criminals on other countries.

Nice try, and rather the disgusting accusation and straw man. 

 

I'm not the poster who made that equivalence, you did:

Quote

Not at all.  Have any party you are aware of made it policy that people can't suggest that foreign born  people go back home?

 

I would do it if someone was committing serious crimes, or being a social nuisance.

I just pulled you up about it, and in reply you accuse me of being a racist for making that equivalence?

 

 

Have the courage to own your opinions at least. Or give your head a wobble. Maybe better you do both, actually.

Edited July 15, 2019 by L00b

[bendix 10]

There is a school of thought that Trump does this sort of thing to create headlines to deflect attention away from other potentially embarassign areas.

 

It should be noted that it's Epstein's bail hearing in New York today. I wonder if he's worried about any embarassing details coming out.

 

I'm going to make a prediction here:  I genuinely believe Trump will spend some time in prison in the next 3-4 years.

 

[JamesR123 0]

That isn't an equivalence at all lol.

 

I would ask foreign born people to leave the country once any sentence if completed.  Only someone who sees all foreign people as criminals would see that as drawing an equivalence.

[Top Cats Hat 10]

2 minutes ago, JamesR123 said:

If you know of no party that takes a policy on people being able to say to foreign born people to go home, why did you use the BNP as an example of a party?

BNP policy was to forcibly repatriate all non-white immigrants, not to allow people to say that they wanted the forceable repatriation of all non-white immigrants.

 

I think that most people have now sussed out that you are a very poor right wing troll. I showed a friend of mine who is a Lib Dem parish councillor in Derbyshire, some of your posts and asked her what political party she thought that you support. She said either BNP, UKIP or Brexit Party but your obsession with Corbyn means you could also be a Tory Party supporter.

 

When I told her that you claimed to support the Lib Dems she just laughed! Like comrade Lockdoctor who claims to have voted Remain, nobody believes you anymore. 😂

[L00b 441]

2 minutes ago, JamesR123 said:

That isn't an equivalence at all lol.

 

I would ask foreign born people to leave the country once any sentence if completed.  Only someone who sees all foreign people as criminals would see that as drawing an equivalence.

Keep digging, mate. Australia is that-a-way —>

[JamesR123 0]

Just now, Top Cats Hat said:

BNP policy was to forcibly repatriate all non-white immigrants, not to allow people to say that they wanted the forceable repatriation of all non-white immigrants.

 

I think that most people have now sussed out that you are a very poor right wing troll. I showed a friend of mine who is a Lib Dem parish councillor in Derbyshire, some of your posts and asked her what political party she thought that you support. She said either BNP, UKIP or Brexit Party but your obsession with Corbyn means you could also be a Tory Party supporter.

 

When I told her that you claimed to support the Lib Dems she just laughed! Like comrade Lockdoctor who claims to have voted Remain, nobody believes you anymore. 😂

Wow.  Strawman again.  Who said anything about forcibly repatriating?  Who also said anything about nin-whites?

 

I think you owe me an apology.  Also, if we ever meet I am pretty sure you will be surprised at my racial heritage.

 

One of my parents was not born in this country.

 

Which lib dem parish councillor?  I know a few. 

[bendix 10]

I dont think James really has these views.  I think he's a young fella who talks and writes things without really thinking them through logically, onto to become caught up in the inconsistences of his position.

Once he realises those issues, he doubles down and gets entangled more tightly.

 

 

[Top Cats Hat 10]

5 minutes ago, bendix said:

There is a school of thought that Trump does this sort of thing to create headlines to deflect attention away from other potentially embarassign areas.

I’m not sure he is that contrived.

 

Those close to him in the White House say that he doesn’t read briefs nor particularly follow current affairs but is obsessed with any news items about himself and any statistics which show good news on the economy. At one point he actually tweeted bad news about the US economy during a briefing because he misunderstood what he was being told by his economic advisors.

 

When a twitter storm coincides with the release of embarrassing news I suspect that it is nothing more than coincidence.

[JamesR123 0]

6 minutes ago, bendix said:

I dont think James really has these views.  I think he's a young fella who talks and writes things without really thinking them through logically, onto to become caught up in the inconsistences of his position.

Once he realises those issues, he doubles down and gets entangled more tightly.

 

 

There is no inconsistency.  I am absolutely ok with someone asking a foreign born person to leave the country.

 

It may not be very nice, but I can't force people to be nice.

 

This is not the same as forced deportation or any of the other nonsense that has been discussed in this thread.

[tinfoilhat 11]

24 minutes ago, bendix said:

I dont think James really has these views.  I think he's a young fella who talks and writes things without really thinking them through logically, onto to become caught up in the inconsistences of his position.

Once he realises those issues, he doubles down and gets entangled more tightly.

 

 

He is Boris Johnson and I claim my £5.