Government to end petrol/diesel engines by 2040

[geared 315]

I think people want to see the main issues of range and charge time sorted before fully switching (although a Hybrid is a good compromise)

 

I guess the government ultimatum gives the manufacturers a kick up the arse and a solid direction for where to spend future R&D money.

[samssong 10]

Ultimately the people that suffer due to the rush to get older cars of the roads are those who run these cars due to financial restrictions .

Some have looked after and maintained those cars for years hoping that they will remain on the road due to that care.

 

Will the extra power stations needed to serve all the increased electricity for charging these vehicles be pollution free , will the massive lead batteries be pollution free in manufacture and end of life disposal .

 

Should folk who have bought and maintained the same car for its life time doing their bit by not causing even more pollution due to changing every two or three years be penalised .

[rayggb 13]

Nobody is mentioning what's going to happen to the nuclear waste with the new plants we are going to need to generate the electric. Electric black cabs will be on sale in London later this year at 50k or more just as the licensing authorities throughout the land are letting the non tax paying Uber flood the market with private hire cabs.Talk about stupidity!.

[bazjea 10]

Originally Posted by barleycorn View Post

Charging time is pretty much irrelevant. You just need a fast way to change the batteries and a forecourt big enough to store/charge loads ready to go.

 

Quote Cyclone

"This setup isn't being actively pursued by any manufacturer though." You may be mistaken.

An Israeli company are already demonstrating one

 

http://gas2.org/2017/05/13/elecrtric-car-battery-300-mile-range-5-minute-charging-time-israeli-company

Edited July 28, 2017 by bazjea

[ANGELFIRE1 10]

Originally Posted by barleycorn View Post

Charging time is pretty much irrelevant. You just need a fast way to change the batteries and a forecourt big enough to store/charge loads ready to go.

 

Quote Cyclone

"This setup isn't being actively pursued by any manufacturer though." You may be mistaken.

An Israeli company are already demonstrating one

 

http://gas2.org/2017/05/13/elecrtric-car-battery-300-mile-range-5-minute-charging-time-israeli-company

 

 

I simply do not believe it. Although time will tell.

 

Angel1

[Puggie 10]

Has anybody though about the consequences to the oil nations if their income from exporting oil is suddenly cut because electric energy is being used. Some are also the very rich nations that we export armaments too.

 

http://www.worldstopexports.com/worlds-top-oil-exports-country/

 

Could this lead to future armed conflict?

 

The Gulf Arab countries are onboard. Their economies have been growing exponentially which means more of their hydrocarbins are now being consumed domestically which is costing them money.

 

The UAE have said they want 50% of their energy consumption to come from renewable resources by 2050. Saudi Arabia that enjoys >300 days of uninterrupted sunshine is heavily investing in solar. Both countries have started building nuclear infrastructure to cope with future demand.

[Phili Buster 10]

Yeah that is hydrogen. Honda in particular have been looking at this for a while. Zero emissions and 5 minute refuel time, with 370 miles drive.

 

I think the problem has generally been the energy needed to make the hydrogen in the first place (the easiest way is through natural gas; through renewables is possible but not viable yet). It's still 55% less polluting than petrol

 

Yes - only water comes out of the exhaust, but it's creating the hydrogen in the first place that requires a lot of energy. You need electrolysis to separate the hydrogen from oxygen.

 

Spare power from wind turbines running at night could be used instead of turning them off.

 

This setup isn't being actively pursued by any manufacturer though.

 

---------- Post added 28-07-2017 at 07:44 ----------

 

 

They would however be useless when it's not windy, so they can't form the baseload provision, so with or without them we still need more power plants. Most of which can't actually be switched on or off quickly themselves, and so the wind power becomes largely irrelevant.

 

 

I read an article some time ago about one of the wind turbines at the Advanced Manufacturing Park, Catcliffe.

 

As expected, it is used to generate electricity for use by the factory but excess electricity is used to generate hydrogen which is then compressed and stored on site. The stored hydrogen is then used as fuel, for an internal combustion engine, to generate electricity when wind power is insufficient (or non-existent).

[Cyclone 10]

Which is a good idea for a small experimental facility, but probably doesn't scale, and still can't provide baseload.

There are periods, often in the winter, with cold high pressure systems which mean we have little win for up to a fortnight. In the winter is of course the time of year when we use the most power, with lights coming on at 1600 and staying on for 6 hours, heating being used, etc...

 

---------- Post added 30-07-2017 at 09:03 ----------

 

Originally Posted by barleycorn View Post

Charging time is pretty much irrelevant. You just need a fast way to change the batteries and a forecourt big enough to store/charge loads ready to go.

 

Quote Cyclone

"This setup isn't being actively pursued by any manufacturer though." You may be mistaken.

An Israeli company are already demonstrating one

 

http://gas2.org/2017/05/13/elecrtric-car-battery-300-mile-range-5-minute-charging-time-israeli-company

 

I specifically said that "swapping batteries" was not being actively pursued, and that isn't an example of a battery that can be swapped, so I'm not wrong.

 

There's lots of exciting battery research going on, and if we crack a fast charge cycle then the main remaining barrier to full scale adoption has been removed.

 

---------- Post added 30-07-2017 at 09:05 ----------

 

Nobody is mentioning what's going to happen to the nuclear waste with the new plants we are going to need to generate the electric. Electric black cabs will be on sale in London later this year at 50k or more just as the licensing authorities throughout the land are letting the non tax paying Uber flood the market with private hire cabs.Talk about stupidity!.

 

That's because the amount of nuclear waste is so small and relatively easy to store.

Uber is just a taxi company, like City Taxis, they just have a fancy app and automated charging, the authorities don't "let" or "not let" private hire companies operate, it's just part of the business, and the sale of electric black cabs is also not controlled by the government.

 

---------- Post added 30-07-2017 at 09:06 ----------

 

Ultimately the people that suffer due to the rush to get older cars of the roads are those who run these cars due to financial restrictions .

Some have looked after and maintained those cars for years hoping that they will remain on the road due to that care.

 

Will the extra power stations needed to serve all the increased electricity for charging these vehicles be pollution free , will the massive lead batteries be pollution free in manufacture and end of life disposal .

 

Should folk who have bought and maintained the same car for its life time doing their bit by not causing even more pollution due to changing every two or three years be penalised .

 

Has there been any suggestion about actually removing cars from the road?

 

Lead batteries? Electric cars aren't using anything as old hat as lead batteries.

[apelike 10]

Which is a good idea for a small experimental facility, but probably doesn't scale, and still can't provide baseload.

 

It can be scaled and because of that it is not necessary to provide any base load as we are talking about vehicle use anyway. Hydrogen can be stored and transported easily as well.

[Cyclone 10]

We're not talking about transporting it, the specific use mentioned was to be converted back into power at the site when the wind wasn't blowing. This wasn't a way of providing hydrogen for cars. Oh, and whilst it can be stored, I wouldn't call it easy. It's a volatile gas that's quite hard to effectively contain without leakage.

[apelike 10]

Oh, and whilst it can be stored, I wouldn't call it easy. It's a volatile gas that's quite hard to effectively contain without leakage.

 

My god.. I wonder how they manage to get Hydrogen powered cars to work with all that leakage! Mind you, a friend of mine did have a LPG converted car which blew up while driving in Barnsley.

[Cyclone 10]

The storage for hydrogen in cars is quite complex. It's not a case of simply pressurising the gas and storing it in a cylinder.