What's May up to? General election 08/06/2017

[Anna B 1,401]

Tax can't fix it. There's a limit to how much the state can in practise collect in taxation. We need a hybrid healthcare system like most of Europe have.

 

As long as we continue to pretend otherwise because of stupid idealistic nostalgia, our healthcare will continue to suck.

 

What about a Robin Hood tax? 0.05% on financial transactions could raise £200 Billion apparently. I can think of plenty of good uses for that. Are any of the parties in favour of bringing something like that in ?

 

I don't object to the idea of a hybrid health care scheme, but it would all depend on how it was implemented.

[Obelix 11]

And how long before the City of London ups sticks and moves to Frankfurt and Berlin and Paris when you do that? They have many good reasons already to do that and whilst I'm sure youd like them gone Anna you really wont like the massive huge hole it'll leave in the UK's finances - you think you are experiencing a bit of austerity now? Lose the City and it'll be orders of magnitude worse.

 

---------- Post added 19-04-2017 at 23:32 ----------

 

But it was only around 10 years ago though that we managed to pay off that US WWII debt. We may have prospered since WWII but we have always been in debt and will continue to be.

 

To be fair that was because the war bonds had no finish date and so the coupon was paid in perpetuity. It was only when someone had a word with the Treasury and basically said they thought this really had gone on for long enough that they agreed to finally stop it.

[MamboNo5 10]

Borrow, invest and make money off the investments: makes a lot of sense.

And it has worked before: remember the war? We were properly bankrupt after that, but we borrowed, invested and prospered.

 

Not the topic of the thread and too complex to discuss here.

 

Who is successful without a society to be successful in?

Repaying society for its contribution to your success is not a punishment.

 

I have no qualms with the rich paying their fair share of tax.

 

A very simple example of what I mean: Labour want every primary school child to receive free school meals. I like this idea. The Lib Dems had it first but never mind. I think, if the meals are nutritious this would be one step towards tackling childhood obesity because if made compulsory you would be ensuring that every child gets at least one healthy meal a day, free. Instead of pop and crisps, cold McDonalds etc.

 

Labour want to pay for this by charging VAT on private school fees. I didn't use the word vindictive, I1L2T3 did. But I think it is the right word to use here.

 

Most of Sheffield is fairly safe Labour I thought. The little parties should get their acts together and have some kind of alliance so we have a fair chance to vote for a third option.

 

I just wondered what he meant by only voting Labour for tactical reasons when, if he lives in S8 as stated, it is a safe Labour seat anyway.

[Hairyloon 10]

But it was only around 10 years ago though that we managed to pay off that US WWII debt. We may have prospered since WWII but we have always been in debt and will continue to be.

So?

Debt is not in itself a problem provided the debt can be serviced.

[Anna B 1,401]

The thing is Anna I don't think that many people do actually dislike him. Daft as it may sound that's part of the problem.

 

He lacks personality, he lacks charisma, there's nothing there to like or dislike.

 

The people that I dislike currently in politics are Farage ( shifty, dodgy second hand car salesman ) Boris ( playing a part in order to hide what a nasty piece of work he is in reality ) Gove ( classed as a 'hawk' in political terms, happy for other mothers sons to ' take affirmative action ' while he hasn't the guts to face his mate when betraying him ) Ian Duncan Smith ( talks complete BS as regards future Brexit prospects with no substance to back it up ) but the thing is, as objectionable as I find these people there are others who think they're wonderful.

 

Jeremy just doesn't attract the same amount of emotion either negative or positive.

 

Do I dislike him personally? No, other than thinking he is unfit for his current position, but as I don't support any particular party it's none of my business other than the fact that I believe a strong opposition is important for good governance and he isn't capable of providing it.

 

Labour is going nowhere until he is replaced.

 

Maybe. But then Tony Blair had charisma by the bucketload, and what a snake in the grass he turned out to be. In fact post MP's expenses scandal, I wouldn't trust 90% of them. At least Corbyn is honest (he claimed £13 I believe.)

 

But you make an interesting point. To what extent do personalities have an affect on politics? Really it's the message / policies that should count, but we are all swayed by the messenger, which is why image is so important. If you are able to Destroy the image you also destroy the message.

[Hairyloon 10]

A very simple example of what I mean: Labour want every primary school child to receive free school meals. I like this idea. The Lib Dems had it first but never mind...

 

Labour want to pay for this by charging VAT on private school fees. I didn't use the word vindictive, I1L2T3 did. But I think it is the right word to use here.

I am not at all convinced that this is a good idea, but neither am I persuaded that private schools should be charities.

We might want to look to Sweden, which is widely held as having one of the best education systems in the world: they simply don't have private schools: it is an idea that makes a lot of sense.

 

I just wondered what he meant by only voting Labour for tactical reasons when, if he lives in S8 as stated, it is a safe Labour seat anyway.

I don't recall the post in question, but perhaps he was making a suggestion to others?

 

---------- Post added 19-04-2017 at 23:48 ----------

 

To what extent do personalities have an affect on politics?

 

Far too much.

We'd probably be much better off if we did not see or hear them at all, and had them conduct parliamentary discussion in an internet type chatroom.

[Obelix 11]

Not the topic of the thread and too complex to discuss here.

 

 

 

I have no qualms with the rich paying their fair share of tax.

 

A very simple example of what I mean: Labour want every primary school child to receive free school meals. I like this idea. The Lib Dems had it first but never mind. I think, if the meals are nutritious this would be one step towards tackling childhood obesity because if made compulsory you would be ensuring that every child gets at least one healthy meal a day, free. Instead of pop and crisps, cold McDonalds etc.

 

Labour want to pay for this by charging VAT on private school fees. I didn't use the word vindictive, I1L2T3 did. But I think it is the right word to use here.

 

 

 

I just wondered what he meant by only voting Labour for tactical reasons when, if he lives in S8 as stated, it is a safe Labour seat anyway.

 

Mcdonnell was talking today about how the lower and middle income lot are facing income taxes burdens and how its not fair on them and it's time to screw the rich again.

 

Discounting the rest of the absolute crap he spoke - what income tax rises?

 

Can you recall ANY in the last erm five years or so?

 

Of course you can't. Income tax rates have fallen for all but the very top - so much so that between a quarter and a third of ALL income tax is paid by the top 1%

 

Day one and Labour already show they are utterly incompetent at anything involving money. At all. Full stop.

 

Going to be a long 7 weeks I bet...

[MamboNo5 10]

I don't recall the post in question, but perhaps he was making a suggestion to others?

 

Was in response to this part of the post.

 

I won't be voting Labour unless forced to tactically but I can understand Anna's point.

 

---------- Post added 19-04-2017 at 23:55 ----------

 

Mcdonnell was talking today about how the lower and middle income lot are facing income taxes burdens and how its not fair on them and it's time to screw the rich again.

 

Discounting the rest of the absolute crap he spoke - what income tax rises?

 

Can you recall ANY in the last erm five years or so?

 

Of course you can't. Income tax rates have fallen for all but the very top - so much so that between a quarter and a third of ALL income tax is paid by the top 1%

 

Day one and Labour already show they are utterly incompetent at anything involving money. At all. Full stop.

 

Going to be a long 7 weeks I bet...

 

Yup, they seem wholly inept when it comes to the economy. I'm rather worried about criticising them now though because I just get Tory policy thrown back at me.

 

Must one be a Tory to not like Labour at present? I can't be the only person who isn't?

Edited April 19, 2017 by MamboNo5

[Anna B 1,401]

Mcdonnell was talking today about how the lower and middle income lot are facing income taxes burdens and how its not fair on them and it's time to screw the rich again.

 

Discounting the rest of the absolute crap he spoke - what income tax rises?

 

Can you recall ANY in the last erm five years or so?

 

Of course you can't. Income tax rates have fallen for all but the very top - so much so that between a quarter and a third of ALL income tax is paid by the top 1%

 

Day one and Labour already show they are utterly incompetent at anything involving money. At all. Full stop.

 

Going to be a long 7 weeks I bet...

 

Screw the rich again? I wasn't aware the rich have been screwed at all. From what I hear they seem to be doing very well out of austerity and getting richer by the day. I'd just like the big corporations to pay the tax they owe.

 

Now you say they'd all up sticks and leave at the thought of a 0.05% Robin Hood tax to help the less fortunate? How much more money do they need? They can already afford to buy whole countries...

 

And you wonder why they're despised?

[MamboNo5 10]

But you make an interesting point. To what extent do personalities have an affect on politics? Really it's the message / policies that should count, but we are all swayed by the messenger, which is why image is so important. If you are able to Destroy the image you also destroy the message.

 

My opinion on this is as valuable and as worthless as everyone else's. I have only ever been impressed by two politicians: One is Jacob Rees Mogg. He has an almost total recall of government policy, history, facts and figures and never seems flustered or confused. And Frank Field, who, to me at least, was genuine.

 

I think Ruth Davidson and Andy Burnham are likeable. I liked Vince Cable when he was around. And the late Charles Kennedy was a good egg.

 

Otherwise.....meh.

[Hairyloon 10]

Must one be a Tory to not like Labour at present? I can't be the only person who isn't?

 

You are welcome to come join the revolution.

[MamboNo5 10]

You are welcome to come join the revolution.

 

You might not like me. I am the floating voter of which Carlinate spoke. I don't treat politics like a football team and blindly follow one party through thick and thin.

 

Further to my post above, if Mogg was standing as my local MP I'd probably vote for him. And I was a remainer. At least I'd know I was getting someone intelligent. Makes much more sense that voting for someone like Diane Abbott who is absolutely hopeless in every single way.

 

Thanks anyway though

Edited April 19, 2017 by MamboNo5