Another vote t'other side of the Border.

[Jacktari 10]

then get the british in to make good their work :hihi:

 

That is half the problem.

If they had paid the rate for the job, and employed Englishmen to start with, we would not have this trouble.

The shoddy work is only coming to the fore now.

Before I retired I worked on many large projects, and could see the poor workmanship done by men claiming to be builders and engineers, undercutting English workers for the job.

It is the old saying, 'you buy cheap, you buy twice'.

[ricgem2002 11]

That is half the problem.

If they had paid the rate for the job, and employed Englishmen to start with, we would not have this trouble.

The shoddy work is only coming to the fore now.

Before I retired I worked on many large projects, and could see the poor workmanship done by men claiming to be builders and engineers, undercutting English workers for the job.

It is the old saying, 'you buy cheap, you buy twice'.

faults of the employers then

[Jacktari 10]

faults of the employers then

 

As always, that is why I was against joining in the first place.

Free movement of labour driving down wages and standards.

 

this is on the wrong thread actually.

[tinfoilhat 11]

then get the british in to make good their work :hihi:

 

I've only had British tradesmen screw up jobs I've asked them to do.

[Justin Smith 10]

I have just heard on the Today programme that Theresa May is to refuse the Scots having a referendum before Brexit is concluded because it`d be "divisive". GORDON BENNET ! What a SODDIN` hypocrite Theresa May is ! ! Without any doubt the most divisive thing in my lifetime has been the referendum* and, critically, her attitude to it afterwards. No concessions to the 48% who voted remain remember, and stretching what even (all) the Remain voters even voted for.

 

Is it any wonder people have such a low opinion of politicians......

 

* And let`s remember that before the last General Election only 15% of voters put Europe in their top three of concerns, but that didn`t stop the Tories having this super divisive referendum ! It`d be absolutely laughable if it weren`t so unbelievably serious.

Edited March 14, 2017 by Justin Smith

[unbeliever 10]

I have just heard on the Today programme that Theresa May is to refuse the Scots having a referendum before Brexit is concluded because it`d be "divisive". GORDON BENNET ! What a SODDIN` hypocrite Theresa May is ! ! Without any doubt the most divisive thing in my lifetime has been the referendum* and, critically, her attitude to it afterwards. No concessions to the 48% who voted remain remember, and stretching what even (all) the Remain voters even voted for.

 

Is it any wonder people have such a low opinion of politicians......

 

* And let`s remember that before the last General Election only 15% of voters put Europe in their top three of concerns, but that didn`t stop the Tories having this super divisive referendum ! It`d be absolutely laughable if it weren`t so unbelievably serious.

 

Bogus poll comes out again.

[Justin Smith 10]

I have just heard on the Today programme that Theresa May is to refuse the Scots having a referendum before Brexit is concluded because it`d be "divisive". GORDON BENNET ! What a SODDIN` hypocrite Theresa May is ! ! Without any doubt the most divisive thing in my lifetime has been the referendum* and, critically, her attitude to it afterwards. No concessions to the 48% who voted remain remember, and stretching what even (all) the Remain voters even voted for.

 

Is it any wonder people have such a low opinion of politicians......

 

* And let`s remember that before the last General Election only 15% of voters put Europe in their top three of concerns, but that didn`t stop the Tories having this super divisive referendum ! It`d be absolutely laughable if it weren`t so unbelievably serious.

 

I can`t believe this, hypocrisy has hit even greater heights ! Apparently the UK Govt think it unfair that the Scottish should hold their referendum before the final terms of Brexit are known, thus, they say, any Scottish Referendum should occur after that point.

 

WHAT ! ! !

 

The UK had to vote on EU membership before any terms were even dreamt about. And, even more disgusting, any suggestion the UK should have any more choice in leaving the EU once the Brexit terms are known, is "undemocratic".

 

There really is no depths of hypocrisy to which the politicians, particularly Brexit Tories, will not stoop.

 

---------- Post added 14-03-2017 at 08:20 ----------

 

Bogus poll comes out again.

 

Actually, it isn`t a "Bogus poll", as you full well know, It`s just a poll which says something you`d rather people didn`t know about.

 

---------- Post added 14-03-2017 at 09:44 ----------

 

We are leaving the EU thank god ,get used to it.

 

Oh I shall never get used to it. My respect for British democracy has gone, I have no patriotism left. Leave repeatedly lied (and are still lying), won, and have got away with it.

 

We have plenty of unemployed in England to do the job [build a wall between us and Scotland].

 

You don`t know what you`re talking about Penny, we are short of builders and, in fact, tradesmen generally in this country. Any tradesman who is out of work is not much of a tradesman.

Edited March 14, 2017 by Justin Smith

[unbeliever 10]

I can`t believe this, hypocrisy has hit even greater heights ! Apparently the UK Govt think it unfair that the Scottish should hold their referendum before the final terms of Brexit are known, thus, they say, any Scottish Referendum should occur after that point.

 

WHAT ! ! !

 

The UK had to vote on EU membership before any terms were even dreamt about. And, even more disgusting, any suggestion the UK should have any more choice in leaving the EU once the Brexit terms are known, is "undemocratic".

 

There really is no depths of hypocrisy to which the politicians, particularly Brexit Tories, will not stoop.

 

---------- Post added 14-03-2017 at 08:20 ----------

 

 

Actually, it isn`t a "Bogus poll", as you full well know, It`s just a poll which says something you`d rather people didn`t know about.

 

---------- Post added 14-03-2017 at 09:44 ----------

 

 

Oh I shall never get used to it. My respect for British democracy has gone, I have no patriotism left. Leave repeatedly lied (and are still lying), won, and have got away with it.

 

 

 

You don`t know what you`re talking about Penny, we are short of builders and, in fact, tradesmen generally in this country. Any tradesman who is out of work is not much of a tradesman.

 

 

It's a poll that you've selectively interpreted to man what you want.

 

I knew exactly what I was voting for.

Point out where it said "Kind of half leave the EU" on your ballot paper.

 

If the case for holding another Scexit referendum is based on Brexit then it makes zero sense to hold another vote mid-way through the negotiations.

If the Scottish are leaving then there's a string case against them participating in the process. So they should go now.

If they're seriously considering staying, then best they make that decision once things are settled between the UK and the EU.

Either early our late make sense. In the middle is just the worst.

Edited March 14, 2017 by unbeliever

[Justin Smith 10]

It's a poll that you've selectively interpreted to man what you want .

 

Er, no I`m not. How can I be "interpreting" only 15% of voters put Europe in their top three of concerns any other way than, well, 85% put Europe 4th or lower on their list of concerns ?

 

I knew exactly what I was voting for.

Point out where it said "Kind of half leave the EU" on your ballot paper.

 

If the case for holding another Scexit referendum is based on Brexit then it makes zero sense to hold another vote mid-way through the negotiations.

If the Scottish are leaving then there's a string case against them participating in the process. So they should go now.

If they're seriously considering staying, then best they make that decision once things are settled between the UK and the EU.

Either early our late make sense. In the middle is just the worst.

 

Nobody is suggesting that you personally were doing anything other than voting for a hard Brexit. I`d go further, I`d guess that comfortably over half (possibly as high as 70 or 80% ? ) of those who voted to Leave were doing the same thing. But, as you know full well, the result was 52/48. So it`d have to have been 96% or more that voted as you did for it to be a majority for your interpretation. That, I would respectively, but firmly, suggest, is highly unlikely.

 

The Scots have more about them than us, they`d like to know the terms before deciding. Anyone with any sense would, apart from hard core Brexiteers, the Daily Mail, the Daily Express or the Sun.

Edited March 14, 2017 by Justin Smith

[unbeliever 10]

Er, no I`m not. How can I be "interpreting" only 15% of voters put Europe in their top three of concerns any other way than, well, 85% put Europe 4th or lower on their list of concerns ?

 

 

https://www.ipsos-mori.com/researchpublications/researcharchive/3447/Economy-immigration-and-healthcare-are-Britons-top-three-issues-deciding-general-election-vote.aspx

The question posed in 2014 was "Looking ahead to the next general election, which, if any, issues do you think will be very important to you in helping you decide which party to vote for?"

31% for economy

30% immigration/asylum

23% education

13% benefits

12% foreign affairs

11% europe

 

This was not a matter of ranking items in order of importance. It was a question of what was likely to change peoples' votes. Only 11% thought that europe would change their vote.

With only 2 pro-EU parties standing any chance of forming a government and 5 of the 6 major and minor parties supporting EU membership what do you expect?

Now if you had a poll asking the direct question which you seem interested in that would be one thing. But you don't. You're making an inference and I reject it.

 

 

Nobody is suggesting that you personally were doing anything other than voting for a hard Brexit. I`d go further, I`d guess that comfortably over half (possibly as high as 70 or 80% ? ) of those who voted to Leave were doing the same thing. But, as you know full well, the result was 52/48. So it`d have to have been 96% or more that voted as you did for it to be a majority for your interpretation. That, I would respectively, but firmly, suggest, is highly unlikely.

 

The Scots have more about them than us, they`d like to know the terms before deciding. Anyone with any sense would, apart from hard core Brexiteers, the Daily Mail, the Daily Express or the Sun.

 

How many of the remain supporter do you suppose would agree that if we're leaving, we should leave completely and not dangle half-in and half-out? I suspect a lot. I shall look for numbers.

 

Also. Point out where it said "Kind of half leave the EU" on your ballot paper.

 

 

Edit: Okay that wasn't hard.

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/01/18/public-back-brexit-plan-think-eu-will-nix-it/

The people are in clear support of the government's plan.

82% of leavers and 34% of remainers for leaving the single market: total=59%

76% of leavers and 39% of remainers for leaving the customs union: total=58%

What say you to that my good man?

Edited March 14, 2017 by unbeliever

[melthebell 863]

‘Divisive’ referendum ‘will cause huge economic uncertainty’ says woman enacting divisive referendum causing huge economic uncertainty

 

 

 

 

http://newsthump.com/2017/03/14/divisive-referendum-will-cause-huge-economic-uncertainty-says-woman-enacting-divisive-referendum-causing-huge-economic-uncertainty/

[Justin Smith 10]

How many of the remain supporter do you suppose would agree that if we're leaving, we should leave completely and not dangle half-in and half-out? I suspect a lot. I shall look for numbers.

 

Also. Point out where it said "Kind of half leave the EU" on your ballot paper.

 

 

Edit: Okay that wasn't hard.

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/01/18/public-back-brexit-plan-think-eu-will-nix-it/

The people are in clear support of the government's plan.

82% of leavers and 34% of remainers for leaving the single market: total=59%

76% of leavers and 39% of remainers for leaving the customs union: total=58%

What say you to that my good man?

 

I say it rather depends on what comes out of it all doesn`t it ? It seems totally illogical to me. How could anyone vote to stay in the EU but actually want to come out of the single market. Can you explain that one to me ? Unless too many have been reading the Mail or Express of course.....