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Using Mobile Phones While Driving - New Laws

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I would imagine that a passenger in the car would be aware of the car's surroundings and know when not to speak. Someone on the phone will have no idea where the car is and if its not safe to talk.

 

Perhaps using a phone for a call should be banned while driving, whether handsfree or not. I have seen the research showing that it really does impair your ability to concentrate because you are having to split your brain. The same thing is true when having a discussion with a passenger in the car, but as alchresearch says, there's a good chance they'd shut up if they needed to, or they'd respond better to being told to be quiet!

 

However, as technology evolves and things like Siri and Alexa become more prevalent then I think phones in cars can become more and more useful and reduce potential distractions. For example, I run Spotify through my phone to my car. I can control Spotify using voice commands which means I don't need to touch anything whilst driving. Same as navigation, I can ask my phone to direct me to a place without touching a thing. For me this is increasing safety, so we need to be careful that we don't chuck the baby out with the bath water...technology has a place, but we need to make sure it's the right place.

 

---------- Post added 06-03-2017 at 10:16 ----------

 

Not if it's a child they wouldn't. Seen some awful driving caused by a parent turning round to scream at the kids in the back seat.

 

This. When I worked as a Special Constable we pulled over a SUV who had gone straight through a red light nearly hitting us, a marked police car, who was going through the junction legally on a green light...

 

Put blues on and expected a car chase but the driver pulled in just up the road. Turns out it was a mum on the school run with 5 kids all screaming in the back and she hadn't even realised there was a traffic light! When we pointed out to her that she was inches from potentially killing all the children in the car she was understandably in tears. Still got points and a fine as it was unbelievably dangerous so I really hope she learnt from that day.

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Is anyone sure how one stands when using a smart phone as a satnav?

 

I use mine by setting up before departure, leaving it running and talking to me from the passenger seat and only touching it again on arrival.

Am I running a risk of being charged?

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Is anyone sure how one stands when using a smart phone as a satnav?

 

I use mine by setting up before departure, leaving it running and talking to me from the passenger seat and only touching it again on arrival.

Am I running a risk of being charged?

 

Not unless you pick it up whilst the engine is running and start changing destination...if it's on but not touched then it's fine under the current law.

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Having been hit by a red light runner twice in the 80's, and injured both times. I am all for heavy fines for any form of distracted driving, It is now the number one killer on Ontario roads, way ahead of drink related deaths. Another stupid thing that some people still do, is not wear seat belts, as unbelievable as that may be. My daughter, who is a paramedic says it happens, so much that she feels like screaming. She has pronounced dead several people under these unnecessary circumstances, mainly from ejections from their vehicles.

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I would imagine that a passenger in the car would be aware of the car's surroundings and know when not to speak. Someone on the phone will have no idea where the car is and if its not safe to talk.

 

I've seen this argument before, but it's partially invalid.

Rear seat passengers, none driving passengers, perhaps even a sight impaired passenger, or just a passenger that isn't taking notice of the road ahead.

How is a conversation with any of these types of passenger any less dangerous than a conversation with the speaker in the dashboard or the phone?

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That's really a question for almost all major car manufacturers.

 

The research is pretty clear and unequivocal: Talking on the phone, hands-free or otherwise, causes changes in focus and reaction time that are comparable to driving over the limit.

 

I understand that people don't want to hear, or believe this, because they are in the habit of using hands-free with impunity and have no wish to acknowledge the driving impairment it is shown to cause.

 

I accept that talking hands-free will affect your concentration, just like any other activity whilst driving (including looking at billboards, thinking about the match/your partner/kids/that nice new car in the other lane/etc, listening to your favorite song or a discussion on the radio) but I think it's important to keep the risk in proportion.

It's one thing to physically reduce your driving ability (by holding a phone to your head) but to highlight the risk of talking hands-free while ignoring similar activities (talking passengers, radio/music, your own thoughts) is ridiculous. As some have already mentioned, talking hands-free is no different to talking to a passenger.

 

---------- Post added 07-03-2017 at 10:00 ----------

 

I would imagine that a passenger in the car would be aware of the car's surroundings and know when not to speak. Someone on the phone will have no idea where the car is and if its not safe to talk.

 

Really? Have you ever known anyone stop talking at busy junctions or other important times (which is most of the time) whilst driving?

I don't think I ever have, in fact I have to politely tell people to shush sometimes while I concentrate in busy situations.

Edited by RootsBooster

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.... About the new laws on use of mobile phones while driving. One part that isn't clear to me (and I can't find any explanation online) is this bit:

 

"You can use your phone as a sat nav as long as it's in a holder out of the 45-degree angle of the driver's view."

 

Does that mean 45 degrees or 22.5 degrees either side of the centre of the drivers view forward?

 

Also, does it mean to the left or right of a center line, or can it also mean above or below a centre point?

Edited by nickycheese

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.... About the new laws on use of mobile phones while driving. One part that isn't clear to me (and I can't find any explanation online) is this bit:

 

 

There have been adverts on the radio and TV, I guess if people dont see those ads many will be unaware. Not much detail, but who cares because there is no check-ups to see if motorists are up to date with things, 40 years after passing their test.

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.... About the new laws on use of mobile phones while driving. One part that isn't clear to me (and I can't find any explanation online) is this bit:

 

"You can use your phone as a sat nav as long as it's in a holder out of the 45-degree angle of the driver's view."

 

Does that mean 45 degrees or 22.5 degrees either side of the centre of the drivers view forward?

 

Also, does it mean to the left or right of a center line, or can it also mean above or below a centre point?

 

I've not read that. I would hope that it is 22.5 either way, as 45 each way would pretty much cover the whole of the dashboard on most cars.

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There have been adverts on the radio and TV, I guess if people dont see those ads many will be unaware. Not much detail, but who cares because there is no check-ups to see if motorists are up to date with things, 40 years after passing their test.

 

Sorry, I don't get what you're saying.

 

Are you saying that the information about what the "45-degree angle of the driver's view" means was in TV and Radio Ads? Can't say it's been in any that I've seen.

 

Or are you saying that it doesn't matter?

 

---------- Post added 07-03-2017 at 14:02 ----------

 

I've not read that. I would hope that it is 22.5 either way, as 45 each way would pretty much cover the whole of the dashboard on most cars.

 

I would agree with 22.5, but can't find any info to be sure. It's mention in lots of online newspaper articles - e.g.:

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/lifestyle/motoring/new-harsh-penalties-drivers-caught-9931996

 

"Can you press buttons on your phone to answer/hang up a call on hands-free?

 

No. The phone must be secured in a holder out of the 45-degree angle of the driver's view. You can't touch it while driving."

 

I normally fix mine between the rev.counter and speedo, which seems like a sensible place, but I'm trying to work out if it's technically illegal...

Edited by nickycheese

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That 45 deg. FOV requirement seems daft to me.

 

Whilst it shouldn't be obscuring or impeding a driver's line of sight, placing a GPS phone (or other relevant device, e.g. dashcam or standalone GPS) 'much further away' from a driver FOV than e.g. the main instrument cluster (speedo/rpm), seems more dangerous (because the driver has to shift their gaze further away from the vehicle course, like e.g. when adjusting radio or air conditioning on a central cluster/console) as inviting unnecessary distraction.

 

I've never liked centrally-mounted GPS displays and instrument clusters (e.g. speedo dial on modern Minis, how daft: I never look at it when I drive the Mrs' Mini, instead I have the electronic display at the bottom of the rev counter dial (which does sit on front of the driver) set as a speedo repeater).

 

I've long mounted my GPS/dashcam-running phone in a holder at the bottom of the A pillar (driver side) atop the dashboard, as what I personally find to be, in practice, the least intrusive/most natural position. When underway, there's nothing "hidden" behind the phone in that position, that you haven't already observed long beforehand/before getting to it. If and when needed, only a fleeting glance required, within a couple inches or so of the speedo/rev counter.

 

Seems to me that, logically, vehicle instrumentation (built-in or aftermarket) should converge towards the highest standard of performance ergonomics, namely a plane-like heads-up display, with the most possible information in the smallest possible cluster as near to the driver's line of sight without impeding road observation. Not the contrary, "spreading" that instrumentation beyond the driver/pilot's line of sight, whether by design or statute.

 

Makes me wonder if that 45 deg. would even catch people I've often seen, who sucker their phone/GPS smack in the middle of the windscreen, halfway between the rear view mirror and the dashboard (and which strikes me as more distracting/dangerous).

Edited by L00b

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That 45 deg. FOV requirement seems daft to me.

 

Whilst it shouldn't be obscuring or impeding a driver's line of sight, placing a GPS phone (or other relevant device, e.g. dashcam or standalone GPS) 'much further away' from a driver FOV than e.g. the main instrument cluster (speedo/rpm), seems more dangerous (because the driver has to shift their gaze further away from the vehicle course, like e.g. when adjusting radio or air conditioning on a central cluster/console) as inviting unnecessary distraction.

 

I've never liked centrally-mounted GPS displays and instrument clusters (e.g. speedo dial on modern Minis, how daft: I never look at it when I drive the Mrs' Mini, instead I have the electronic display at the bottom of the rev counter dial (which does sit on front of the driver) set as a speedo repeater).

 

I've long mounted my GPS/dashcam-running phone in a holder at the bottom of the A pillar (driver side) atop the dashboard, as what I personally find to be, in practice, the least intrusive/most natural position. When underway, there's nothing "hidden" behind the phone in that position, that you haven't already observed long beforehand/before getting to it. If and when needed, only a fleeting glance required, within a couple inches or so of the speedo/rev counter.

 

Seems to me that, logically, vehicle instrumentation (built-in or aftermarket) should converge towards the highest standard of performance ergonomics, namely a plane-like heads-up display, with the most possible information in the smallest possible cluster as near to the driver's line of sight without impeding road observation. Not the contrary, "spreading" that instrumentation beyond the driver/pilot's line of sight, whether by design or statute.

 

Makes me wonder if that 45 deg. would even catch people I've often seen, who sucker their phone/GPS smack in the middle of the windscreen, halfway between the rear view mirror and the dashboard (and which strikes me as more distracting/dangerous).

 

I suspect it's just a (attempted but failing) clarification of the current law about nothing obstructing a drivers view on the windscreen:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/stickers-or-other-items-in-front-and-rear-windscreens

 

The current law talks about a zone 290mm wide from the centre of the steering wheel so I guess they are trying to make it easier for people to understand by saying 45 degrees. However this completely fails as this thread has shown and also depending on how far forward or back you sit changes the 45 degree area...so unless the start point of the 45 degrees is fixed at an arbitrary distance then leaning forward could make you legal again as the 45 degree area would become smaller...#pedantry

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