Why do Sheffield people pronounce Greenhill, as "Grenill"?

[t020 11]

anyone remember that guys name on masterchef? who thought he talked all prim and proper.... called it "queens english"

 

but actually he sounded like a complete and utter ****

 

I hate the way posh people seem to think they talk "proper" - what is the proper way to talk, is there a proper way to talk? Surely boundaries make it very hard to define what is actually "proper english"

 

?

 

Is there any point to this irrelevant digression?

 

Many people don't speak the "Queen's English" yet still pronounce Greenhill as "Greenhill".

[sheffieldism 10]

Is there any point to this irrelevant digression?

 

Many people don't speak the "Queen's English" yet still pronounce Greenhill as "Greenhill".

 

u must be really bored or enjoy arguing as this is going nowhere

[SUPERTYKE 10]

to2o.

 

YOU KEEP BANGING ON ABOUT THIS 'POLL' THAT IS IN NO WAY, SHAPE OR FORM OF ANY USE TO THIS DEBATE.

(Except to bolster your lonely and ludicrous argument.)

 

LET US BE CRYSTAL CLEAR ON THIS;-

 

AN IMPROPERLY CONDUCTED POLL IS INCAPABLE OF PRODUCING

RESULTS THAT ARE OF ANY VALUE STATISTICALLY.

 

MASSIVE FULL STOP.

 

Your twisted 'logic' says that even a totally meaningless poll is better than my lack of evidence.

 

SORRY - YOU COULDN'T BE MORE WRONG EVEN IF YOU WERE, "LORD WRONGEST OF NEVERBEENRIGHT, MISTAKENTOWN - BY THE SEA, ERRORSHIRE".

 

You see, my opinions are based on 38 years of living in Sheff, (almost; I''ve lived for a total of 4 yrs abroad and in a few english towns.) I'm gregarious and have made an effort to meet people. I used to have a girlyfriend who lived and was born on Grennll avenue.

Her parents who were very nice middle class people, insisted that the avenue was GREENHILL AVE. There was no argument from me but over the two or so years that I was with the girl, I heard them correct folks over the 'correct' pronunciation many times. In retrospect I find that.

THIS KIND OF LINGUISTIC FASCISM MAKES ME PUKE.

Your opinions, as you have demonstrated, not only here but in the 'SHEFFIELD ACCENT' thread, are mostly a frenzied attempt to prove that YOU PERSONALLY, have no trace of a Sheff accent and that you will go to any extreme to be 'right'. You very unnconvincingly align yourself with those that speak 'properly' in a pathetic attempt to show how 'superior' you are.

However I couldn't be arsed then and I'm even less inclined now to worry too much WHICH WAY people pronounce the word.

 

HERE AGAIN ARE MY OPENING COMMENTS ON THE SUBJECT;- (roughly)

'Some people try to 'up' their status by pronouncing their place name as poshly as poss.'

 

THAT WAS IS AND WILL REMAIN MY STAND ON THIS POINT.

All of my subsequent posts were provoked by YOUR absurd claims.

AND PLEASE DON'T WORRY ABOUT MY TIME SPENT HERE. It is but a fraction when compared with the days months and years that you have been trying, hereon, to convince people pf your greatness.

My fleeting fingers make short work of these remarks, and your arguments.

You are making an ass of yourself and your assness improves with each post.

 

You should pay more attention to comments such as BREEZAS, and try not to dismiss such points as rubbish in your high-handed and cynical way. Have some appreciation and respect for those whose opinions are spoken in earnest

and without the need or wish to offend, indeed, those who come here for an enjoyable and entertaining debate rather than to grapple endlessly with the ego of a psychotic opinionated and utterly offensive individual.

[t020 11]

to2o.

 

YOU KEEP BANGING ON ABOUT THIS 'POLL' THAT IS IN NO WAY, SHAPE OR FORM OF ANY USE TO THIS DEBATE.

(Except to bolster your lonely and ludicrous argument.)

 

LET US BE CRYSTAL CLEAR ON THIS;-

 

AN IMPROPERLY CONDUCTED POLL IS INCAPABLE OF PRODUCING

RESULTS THAT ARE OF ANY VALUE STATISTICALLY.

 

MASSIVE FULL STOP.

 

Your twisted 'logic' says that even a totally meaningless poll is better than my lack of evidence.

 

SORRY - YOU COULDN'T BE MORE WRONG EVEN IF YOU WERE, "LORD WRONGEST OF NEVERBEENRIGHT, MISTAKENTOWN - BY THE SEA, ERRORSHIRE".

 

It's not a totally meaningless poll at all, and my "argument" isn't "lonely" when it's shared by more people than yours is, according to the poll. It's only a small sample which is not necessarily representative, but it's still indicative (unless you have *proof* to suggest otherwise?). You keep saying how "wrong" I am about things, but I don't see anything resembling evidence of ANY kind coming from you.

 

 

You see, my opinions are based on 38 years of living in Sheff, (almost; I''ve lived for a total of 4 yrs abroad and in a few english towns.) I'm gregarious and have made an effort to meet people. I used to have a girlyfriend who lived and was born on Grennll avenue.

Her parents who were very nice middle class people, insisted that the avenue was GREENHILL AVE. There was no argument from me but over the two or so years that I was with the girl, I heard them correct folks over the 'correct' pronunciation many times. In retrospect I find that.

THIS KIND OF LINGUISTIC FASCISM MAKES ME PUKE.

Your opinions, as you have demonstrated, not only here but in the 'SHEFFIELD ACCENT' thread, are mostly a frenzied attempt to prove that YOU PERSONALLY, have no trace of a Sheff accent and that you will go to any extreme to be 'right'. You very unnconvincingly align yourself with those that speak 'properly' in a pathetic attempt to show how 'superior' you are.

However I couldn't be arsed then and I'm even less inclined now to worry too much WHICH WAY people pronounce the word.

 

So your opinion is actually based on a bitter experience with an ex? This explains a lot.

 

Why shouldn't they correct people? It's their choice. The person being corrected doesn't have to take the advice. I've never been in the position, having never heard anyone EVER say "Grenill", despite living in Sheffield all my life and having met people from most parts of the city.

 

As for the rest of your bile about me, you don't really know anything about me, do you? I could speak like Prince Charles, or like Johnny Vegas. I've never tried to "align myself" with those who speak "properly" - I've merely been honest in stating that I have a regionless accent. How you can comment on this I really don't know. Also, it's not a case of trying to be "superior" - again, this is just you with your chip on your shoulder.

 

 

HERE AGAIN ARE MY OPENING COMMENTS ON THE SUBJECT;- (roughly)

'Some people try to 'up' their status by pronouncing their place name as poshly as poss.'

 

THAT WAS IS AND WILL REMAIN MY STAND ON THIS POINT.

All of my subsequent posts were provoked by YOUR absurd claims.

AND PLEASE DON'T WORRY ABOUT MY TIME SPENT HERE. It is but a fraction when compared with the days months and years that you have been trying, hereon, to convince people pf your greatness.

My fleeting fingers make short work of these remarks, and your arguments.

You are making an ass of yourself and your assness improves with each post.

 

Keep THIS up and the men in white coats will be arriving....

 

 

You should pay more attention to comments such as BREEZAS, and try not to dismiss such points as rubbish in your high-handed and cynical way. Have some appreciation and respect for those whose opinions are spoken in earnest

and without the need or wish to offend, indeed, those who come here for an enjoyable and entertaining debate rather than to grapple endlessly with the ego of a psychotic opinionated and utterly offensive individual.

 

 

Please quote me on where I've dismissed any point as being "rubbish". All I've done is expressed my opinion - and you have the plain audacity to tell ME to have some "appreciation and respect" for other peoples' opinions. Maybe you should review your own behaviour in that respect, and allow me to have, and express freely, my opinion on how (of all important topics in the world) the word 'Greenhill' should be pronounced, without constantly insulting, degrading and personally attacking me.

 

 

It's about time you started to back things up with proof. You say I've dismissed points as "rubbish" - post a link to show this. You say I've expressed superiority - show a link that shows this. You denounce my poll and consistently tell me I'm wrong - show me some proof for your side of the argument.

 

In short, please back up your accusations and stop using this thread as an excuse to spew your vitriolic bile towards me, otherwise the moderators will be contacted as this isn't what the forum is for. Heated debate is one thing, a non-stop barrage of abusive, personal insults is quite another.

[42fta 10]

Why shouldn't they correct people? It's their choice.

That is the most appalling stance to take.

Well-bred people do NOT deliberately belittle others or make them feel uncomfortable, its the snobs and wannabees of this world who choose that path.

[t020 11]

That is the most appalling stance to take.

Well-bred people do NOT deliberately belittle others or make them feel uncomfortable, its the snobs and wannabees of this world who choose that path.

 

Yes, I wouldn't personally do it, but at the end of the day it's a free world.

[SUPERTYKE 10]

THE STRAWS AT WHICH YOU CLUTCH ARE GETTING SERIOUSLY WATER-LOGGED TO20.

 

Why would I need to prove that you and your spurious arguments are anything but vehicles for your enormous ego, when it is as plain as day to anyone?

I refer the dis-honourable member to his posts on similar threads never mind the ones here.

 

And while you may delight in so neatly listing quotes and so hoping that you come across as being scientifically/morally sound, you neither impress nor convince anyone.

 

While you admit that your 'poll' is 'unrepresentative', you insist that it is accurate and has substance. It is still, 'indicative', you say.

 

Tell me, HOW CAN A 'POLL' THAT IS UNREPRESENTATIVE PRODUCE ANY WORTHWHILE RESULTS?

 

The only thing that it 'indicates' is that its originator, (you) is MAD FOR TRYING TO SUPPORT his argument with a poll that EVERYONE knows is INCAPABLE OF PRODUCING MEANINGFUL STATISTICS.

 

YOUR 'POLL' IS NOT JUST UNREPRESENTATIVE BUT IS IN FACT SELECTIVE.

IT IS ABSOLUTELY AND TOTALLY

UNCONVINCING

MISLEADING

AND

DISHONEST.

 

YOUR SCHOOLBOY RANTINGS AND SNIDE REMARKS ARE KNOWN TO EVERYONE THAT HAS READ THESE AND PREVIOUS THREADS ON THE SUBECT, SO DON'T TRY INTIMIDATING ME WITH THREATS OF REPORTING ME TO THE MODERATOR.

I WOULD REMIND THE DIS-HONOURABLE MEMBER THAT IT IS HE WHO DESCRIBED ME AND/OR MY OPENING REMARKS AS 'STRANGE'. (When they were very clearly not;; once again, I SAID, 'SOME PEOPLE PRONOUNCE THEIR PLACE NAME AS POSHLY AS POSS' HE SAID THAT THIS IS 'VILLIFYING' THOSE PEOPLE.

WHY IS IT?

And, why do my observations need 'evidence'?

Indeed, in most cases, my arguments are openly personal opinion based on experience.

 

MY ASSERTIONS ARE THAT 'GRENN'LL' CAME BEFORE 'GREENHILL' (CHRONOLOGICALLY) AND THAT MOST PEOPLE WHO PRONOUNCE THEIR PLACE NAME AS POSHLY AS POSSIBLE, DO SO TO APPEAR OF HIGHER STATUS.

CLEAR CONCISE AND OBVIOUS.

YOU OUT OF ALL THE OTHER PARTICIPANTS HAD TO TREAT THESE ASSERTIONS WITH CONTEMPT AND RIDICULE, GALLOPING IN AS YOU DO, TO THE RESCUE OF THE GREAT AND GOOD,; YOUR BATTLE CRY BEING,---

 

'PRESERVE THE FLAG OF CORRECT ENGLISH AT ALL COSTS, DENY ALL CONECTIONS TO 'BARBARIAN' ANCESTRY, DISTANCE OURSELVES FROM THE TAINT OF BASE AND UN-ENGLISH LANGUAGE'.YOUR THINLY DISGUISED SNOBERY IS PLAIN TO EVERYONE, DESPITE THE FACT THAT YOU DOUBTLESSLY HAVE LITTLE TO BE SNOBISH ABOUT.

All of of my posts since my first have been RESPONDING TO YOUR BULL**** AND OR YOUR DISMISSIVE, HIGH HANDED AND EGOTISTICAL REPLIES TO OTHERS AS WELL AS MYSELF.

 

And my relationship with my ex that you describe as being 'a bitter experience' was quite the opposite. ( Though I'm sure that if you have had any they can only have been acidic never mind bitter.)

No, as I said, it was the parents of my ex who chose to correct people on this pronunciation, and it was a joke then as it is a joke now, that people can even bother to go to the trouble, when, as I said originally, people have the right to pronounce as they wish and nobody can claim an absolute right to dictate a specific pronunciation.

[t020 11]

Same old story. You're denouncing my argument, insulting me, yet not providing any evidence to back up to your own claims, e.g. quoting things I've said to prove I actually said them, providing links to your unfounded claims, e.g:

 

"MY ASSERTIONS ARE THAT 'GRENN'LL' CAME BEFORE 'GREENHILL' (CHRONOLOGICALLY) AND THAT MOST PEOPLE WHO PRONOUNCE THEIR PLACE NAME AS POSHLY AS POSSIBLE, DO SO TO APPEAR OF HIGHER STATUS.

CLEAR CONCISE AND OBVIOUS. "

 

Where's the proof? Or do we just take your word for it?

 

Seriously, you're starting to make yourself look like a complete fool now. And by the way, please refrain from the capitals - it's not very good etiquette (although I doubt this bothers you when you're in the middle of one of your melodramatic, ego tripping, insulting and unsubstantiated rants).

 

Finally, your real hypocrisy is underlined when you state:

 

"as I said originally, people have the right to pronounce as they wish and nobody can claim an absolute right to dictate a specific pronunciation."

 

If this is the case, why are you spending hours of your life trying to convince me that I should say "Grennill", that people I know say "Grennill", and that anyone who pronounces it otherwise is a snob? And once again, I re-iterate (although it's falling on deaf ears), I've never once stated a "right" or "wrong" pronunciation.

[Tracie 10]

Mod: As this thread has descended into personal insults, it's time to close it for a cooling off period.