Beggars, homeless, street drinkers & drug users in Sheffield!

[dutch 68]

I don't think government really cares about rough sleepers dying. It would not surprise me that's how they want to get rid of them. UK history is full of deportation and death of poor minorities through ignorance stories through history.

Edited December 18, 2018 by dutch

[woodmally 10]

1 hour ago, dutch said:

I don't think government really cares about rough sleepers dying. It would not surprise me that's how they want to get rid of them. UK history is full of deportation and death of poor minorities through ignorance stories through history.

Its not they dont care its that these people have been offered help and refused to take it. I have read reports from various charities who regularly go on outreach and say that they are all offered support and accommodation.  

 

Someone said about the paperwork it takes to complete to request housing support.  Well there are charities that will help with that The Archer Project, Bens Centre.  

[Longcol 602]

1 hour ago, woodmally said:

Its not they dont care its that these people have been offered help and refused to take it. I have read reports from various charities who regularly go on outreach and say that they are all offered support and accommodation.  

 

Someone said about the paperwork it takes to complete to request housing support.  Well there are charities that will help with that The Archer Project, Bens Centre.  

If it was that simple we would have solved homelessness years ago. A number of people have already explained why it is difficult to engage with some people but you repeat the same old mantra.

 

Also, fact is that since 2010 central government has slashed local authority spending and services available to homeless people have suffered - no surprise there are more people on the streets than any time since WW2.

[Dragon 2 0]

It is a fact that SOME of these people for whatever reason choose to be homeless. If it is due to mental illness it can be very difficult to remedy. 

The fact that government has cut funding is only partly to blame for the councils lack of action, they still have a budget and to a degree can choose where to spend it. 

Maybe we need to look in more detail at where the council DO spend their money and ask if it is a good use of their (our) money. 

I suspect there are cuts that could be made in some areas to make way for better services to the disadvantaged but the question is would our elected "leaders" make those choices? 

I suspect not, there seems to be an appetite for headline grabbing spending to the detriment of necessary spending and we all know about councillors ego's don't we. 

[woodmally 10]

34 minutes ago, Longcol said:

If it was that simple we would have solved homelessness years ago. A number of people have already explained why it is difficult to engage with some people but you repeat the same old mantra.

 

Also, fact is that since 2010 central government has slashed local authority spending and services available to homeless people have suffered - no surprise there are more people on the streets than any time since WW2.

But if people are trying to engage with our street dwellers and they refuse that help despite the whole plethora of charities out there then what can we do. People need to have individual responsibility for thier lives. They are adults after all.  Also if people are handing out money to them they are going to be less likely to engade and seek help. 

Edited December 18, 2018 by woodmally

[Longcol 602]

4 hours ago, woodmally said:

But if people are trying to engage with our street dwellers and they refuse that help despite the whole plethora of charities out there then what can we do. People need to have individual responsibility for thier lives. They are adults after all.  Also if people are handing out money to them they are going to be less likely to engade and seek help. 

A lot of the accommodation they are offered is shared. Many of them will have been abused - whether sexually, physically, financially - in similar situations. Hence not surprising some are reluctant to take the support offered. At one time SCC had a policy of getting rid of shared housing for vulnerable people (in fact that was national policy IIRC). Massive funding cuts have made that impossible.

 

Many of them are not capable - whether physically or mentally (or both) of "taking responsibility" in the way you or I may be able to.

 

Giving money can make an awful situation a shade more comfortable  for a lot of people - if only in some cases by "escaping" for a short while by using drugs or alcohol. Myself, I prefer to give people choices within their terms / understanding rather than prescribing a course of action for them.

 

 

Edited December 18, 2018 by Longcol

[Cyclone 10]

17 hours ago, woodmally said:

Its not they dont care its that these people have been offered help and refused to take it. I have read reports from various charities who regularly go on outreach and say that they are all offered support and accommodation.  

 

Someone said about the paperwork it takes to complete to request housing support.  Well there are charities that will help with that The Archer Project, Bens Centre.  

You've already had it explained to you why rough sleepers might not engage with the available support services.

Do you need it drawing on a map or something?

15 hours ago, Dragon 2 said:

It is a fact that SOME of these people for whatever reason choose to be homeless. If it is due to mental illness it can be very difficult to remedy. 

The fact that government has cut funding is only partly to blame for the councils lack of action, they still have a budget and to a degree can choose where to spend it. 

Maybe we need to look in more detail at where the council DO spend their money and ask if it is a good use of their (our) money. 

I suspect there are cuts that could be made in some areas to make way for better services to the disadvantaged but the question is would our elected "leaders" make those choices? 

I suspect not, there seems to be an appetite for headline grabbing spending to the detriment of necessary spending and we all know about councillors ego's don't we. 

The council has been cutting spending and services for about 8 years now.

The budgets for every year are available online.

Go have a look rather than guessing.

15 hours ago, woodmally said:

But if people are trying to engage with our street dwellers and they refuse that help despite the whole plethora of charities out there then what can we do. People need to have individual responsibility for thier lives. They are adults after all.  Also if people are handing out money to them they are going to be less likely to engade and seek help. 

What was your comment earlier about lack of empathy?

[woodmally 10]

16 minutes ago, Cyclone said:

You've already had it explained to you why rough sleepers might not engage with the available support services.

Do you need it drawing on a map or something?

The council has been cutting spending and services for about 8 years now.

The budgets for every year are available online.

Go have a look rather than guessing.

What was your comment earlier about lack of empathy?

Its not about lack of empathy. You can have all the empathy in the world but despite all the support you give them and they are still refusing to engage what can you do?  If you have any ideas please put them forward.  I dont need it drawing on a map. 

 

I just read posts from the various charities that say not to give money to beggars as it will prevent them from engaging with services.  i dont just pluck it out of thin air I read up comments from the experts ie charities.   Or the police.  https://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/should-you-give-money-to-street-beggars-what-police-and-charities-say-1-9214718

 

So I am not just simply spouting off I am basing it on what I have read such as the article above.   As for you explaining it to me why they dont engage. It has been posted on here by others that the charities do provide support in completing forms etc as part of the services they provide.  If a homeless person needed, for whatever reason, help with forms and the process I am sure the charities would help. 

[Cyclone 10]

Your attitude in general stems from a lack of empathy.  You refuse to learn anything about the topic and instead are intent on justifying your existing opinion.

 

RE: charities - I already told you that the view amongst charities itself is mixed, with some saying don't give cash and others saying do.  You cherry pick evidence to support your opinion.

 

You're sure of a lot of things, your opinion being one of them, and woe betide reality if it happens to conflict with it!

[woodmally 10]

Just now, Cyclone said:

Your attitude in general stems from a lack of empathy.  You refuse to learn anything about the topic and instead are intent on justifying your existing opinion.

 

RE: charities - I already told you that the view amongst charities itself is mixed, with some saying don't give cash and others saying do.  You cherry pick evidence to support your opinion.

 

You're sure of a lot of things, your opinion being one of them, and woe betide reality if it happens to conflict with it!

Can you find a single charity that says we can give money to beggars?  I cant find one to be honest. 

[Cyclone 10]

You didn't look very hard did you...

 

Quote

The views of charities and homeless support groups are mixed. While some advise against giving money directly to rough sleepers, warning that it can fuel addictions, other groups say giving money is often essential to helping homeless people buy the "bare necessities".

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/should-we-give-homeless-money-a8124951.html

 

Which is exactly what I meant about your opinion.  You're prepared to seek out evidence to support it, but you don't want to challenge yourself.

 

The founder of Streets Kitchen, a grassroots group that operates across the UK to provide soup kitchens and support for the homeless, is of a very different view.

Forty-seven-year-old John Glackin, who has been homeless himself, told The Independent the best way to help rough sleepers is to give them money directly

Edited December 19, 2018 by Cyclone

[woodmally 10]

8 minutes ago, Cyclone said:

You didn't look very hard did you...

 

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/should-we-give-homeless-money-a8124951.html

 

Which is exactly what I meant about your opinion.  You're prepared to seek out evidence to support it, but you don't want to challenge yourself.

 

 

Ok thank you for that information its appreciated.  I have had a read. So my question then is this.  If the opinion is mixed about if we should give money to beggars.  Should I follow the advice of these smaller charities or the police?  Because if what the police and Help us Help is saying is true then I am simply making things worse by giving money.  Also how can anyone tell if someone is going to use money for the items they say or drugs or alcohol?  Yes as some said it is  a small minority but if I am giving money to someone with an addiction I am not only fueling that addiction I could be harming them and making matters worse.