foxy lady   10 #61 Posted June 8, 2016 (edited)   why not? If their business model is sound then there's no problem. There is nothing inherently wrong with selling beer for £6 a pint. Some beer is worth £6 a pint (and more). Whether the Sentinel beer is worth that is debateable, but it's a completely separate debate!  Saying that because mainstream beer is £3 a pint (the Timmy T brewery you mention has frankly shocking wholesale prices btw!) then all beer should be £3 is like going into Tesco and saying that because Jacobs Creek is a fiver a bottle then charging £14 for Chateauneuf du Pape is ridiculous  That's hardly the same unless Chateauneuf du Pape have started importing their grapes from Australia, or Sentinel have their own private supplier of malted barley and hops that none of the rest of us know about. Do you think they do?  If everyone has access to the same ingredients then we can all brew the same beers. Unless Jacobs Creek have access to the Rhone's best grapes it is doubtfull the same applies. Edited June 8, 2016 by foxy lady Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
SteelCityAle   10 #62 Posted June 8, 2016 like I say, I'm not arguing that Sentinel beer are or aren't worth £6  I'm simply stating some beers are worth more than others. People accept wine prices vary by orders of magnitude despite all being basically made from grapes, but for many the concept of some beer being more expensive than other beer can only be explained by profiteering... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
foxy lady   10 #63 Posted June 8, 2016 like I say, I'm not arguing that Sentinel beer are or aren't worth £6 I'm simply stating some beers are worth more than others. People accept wine prices vary by orders of magnitude despite all being basically made from grapes, but for many the concept of some beer being more expensive than other beer can only be explained by profiteering...  It seems you have on concept of terroir when discussing grapes and the lack of it when discussing barley. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
SteelCityAle   10 #64 Posted June 8, 2016 Terroir doesn't make a lot of difference to barley IMO, but then I try to minimise malt taste in my brews anyway  Hops however... Why do you think the better brewers use hops imported from America and Australasia and leave the fusty English hops to the big brewers of bland beer? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
foxy lady   10 #65 Posted June 8, 2016 (edited) Terroir doesn't make a lot of difference to barley IMO, but then I try to minimise malt taste in my brews anyway Hops however... Why do you think the better brewers use hops imported from America and Australasia and leave the fusty English hops to the big brewers of bland beer?  Wow. I'd be impressed if you actually knew where the barley you were using had been grown. But it was you trying to compare wines with beer not me. On to the next myth.  I think the reason brewers use hops from the USA and Australia is down to the world shortage of hops leading to micro brewers like yourself buying them where ever they can. The biggest mass of hops including the English grown ones were snapped up years in advance by the big brewers.  Anyhow. Unless Sentinel have access to supplies denied to the rest of us, and had ordered years in advance they too will be brewing with exactly the same ingredients that the rest of the micros are able use. Edited June 8, 2016 by foxy lady Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
SteelCityAle   10 #66 Posted June 8, 2016 Firstly, yes I know where the barley comes from. If I cared I could probably find the exact farm. But having tried a few different maltings, it's made no difference to taste. Obviously though it's all British (bar the odd bad of specialist German stuff)  As for hops, we buy new world hops that taste like citrus or tropical fruit or any number of other flavours rather than English ones that taste like damp grass and mouldy leather. That is terroir, there's been attempts at growing American varieties here, and they've been rubbish  Broadly, any brewery CAN get the same ingredients. But some don't, they buy the crap, or buy good stuff and don't use enough. So their beer is cheaper, but not as good... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
foxy lady   10 #67 Posted June 8, 2016 (edited) Firstly, yes I know where the barley comes from. If I cared I could probably find the exact farm. But having tried a few different maltings, it's made no difference to taste. Obviously though it's all British (bar the odd bad of specialist German stuff) As for hops, we buy new world hops that taste like citrus or tropical fruit or any number of other flavours rather than English ones that taste like damp grass and mouldy leather. That is terroir, there's been attempts at growing American varieties here, and they've been rubbish  Broadly, any brewery CAN get the same ingredients. But some don't, they buy the crap, or buy good stuff and don't use enough. So their beer is cheaper, but not as good...  So if your beers use such wonderful ingredients why aren't you charging £6/pint? Or are others using better malt and hops than you?  Incidentally. Do you know Dave Corby?  Anyhow. I need to drink some. Goodnight. Edited June 8, 2016 by foxy lady Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
taxman   12 #68 Posted June 8, 2016 So if your beers use such wonderful ingredients why aren't you charging £6/pint? Or are others using better malt and hops than you? Incidentally. Do you know Dave Corby?  Anyhow. I need to drink some. Goodnight.  How do you know he doesn't?  Really, this one would cause an argument with herself in a phone box. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
foxy lady   10 #69 Posted June 8, 2016 How do you know he doesn't? Really, this one would cause an argument with herself in a phone box.  OK. Does he? I would have thought he was more qualified to answer that than you. Perhaps you are looking to cause an argument with yourself in a phone box. You come across as a pillock wanting to get involved in other folks discussion. Pathetic!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
SteelCityAle   10 #70 Posted June 8, 2016 Imagine that, joining in a discussion on a public forum... Some folk have no manners...  I run a brewery not a bar/pub, so ultimately the price of a pint isn't set by me. Bear in mind the 6 quid beer in question is on keg, which costs more anyway. Sentinel cask beers are nearer 4 quid. Personally, even at 4 quid a beer has to be well above average to be worth it.  I personally probably wouldn't pay 6 quid for a beer unless it was justified, whether by the abv or by the use of e.g. fruits, barrel aging, etc which cost money. Once you go beyond malt/hops/yeast/water, there's a whole world of flavours. Most of which don't come free... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
foxy lady   10 #71 Posted June 9, 2016 (edited) Imagine that, joining in a discussion on a public forum... Some folk have no manners... I run a brewery not a bar/pub, so ultimately the price of a pint isn't set by me. Bear in mind the 6 quid beer in question is on keg, which costs more anyway. Sentinel cask beers are nearer 4 quid. Personally, even at 4 quid a beer has to be well above average to be worth it.  I personally probably wouldn't pay 6 quid for a beer unless it was justified, whether by the abv or by the use of e.g. fruits, barrel aging, etc which cost money. Once you go beyond malt/hops/yeast/water, there's a whole world of flavours. Most of which don't come free...  And we have an interest in a brewery in the UK and another near Limoges in France (hand pulled cask I might add). I also hold a large stake in Whitbread who now seems to make their money from selling coffee. I wouldn't pay £6/pint either. Anyhow we seem to have drifted away from the key point which was a claim that their beer was of a higher quality than that produced by the rest of the market. That being the justification for the price, which clearly it isn't. Edited June 9, 2016 by foxy lady Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Lurgh Mor   10 #72 Posted June 9, 2016 Here Dave! This a favourite of mine! Dave Line recipe for 25 litres-og1036- 2250g Crushed Pale 125g Flaked Barley 500g Malt Extract Syrup 250g Soft Dark Brown Sugar 60g Fuggles Hops 45g Northern Brewer Hops Brewers Yeast ( not specified )  It is a full mash method adding the extract for the boil There are no AA values or IBU given in the DL recipe. Guess what you get? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...