Muslim country moves to ban burqa and Islamic veils in public places

[Chelle-82 10]

Hi there Chelle! I'm starting up a wee window cleaning business in your area. My rates are extremely reasonable.

 

Hahahaaa

 

The little dude with the eyebrows - so funny x

[Cyclone 10]

There's the very real danger of lack of VitD which can lead to life threatening conditions due to not getting enough sunlight and fresh air to the body. Maybe you should try wearing one every time you go out for a week or so. See how you like it yourself

 

The first description I ever read of the uncomfortableness of wearing a burqa was in A Thousand Splendid Suns, which I recommend to anyone who doesn't fully appreciate what women endure in places like Afghanistan and Iran.

 

But this is interesting ... a burqa experience as told by someone who's not been brainwashed into it through their culture.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-410376/What-really-feels-like-wear-burqa.html

 

We have no idea what they endure, because I bet none of us have ever even spoken to a woman in a burqa.

 

I'm pretty sure that burqa wearing women have posted on this forum before.

They probably left because of the rampant Islamophobia though.

[Berberis 10]

I'm pretty sure that burqa wearing women have posted on this forum before.

They probably left because of the rampant Islamophobia though.

 

I have been on this forum for many years and I have not see a single who claims to wear a burqa argue in their favour.

 

It is not islamophobic to discuss something that is being banned in the islamic world and I take exception at your attempt to try and shut down this discussion by using such a word.

[Cyclone 10]

I agree, it's not islamophobia to discuss a ban, I didn't claim that it was.

[Zamo 10]

I'm pretty sure that burqa wearing women have posted on this forum before.

They probably left because of the rampant Islamophobia though.

 

The Burqa is a symbol of Islamic extremism and is an affront to British values. That said, I'm not really in favour of a ban that specifically targets the burqa. I think it would be far better if we simply stuck to the principle of religious freedom where we do not treat people any differently because of their religious choices.

 

If I am unable to walk into a bank, public building or shop whilst wearing a mask without being challenged, asked to remove it or to leave, then a burqa wearer should get the exact same treatment. If I can be turned down for employment because I insist on wearing a mask then so too should the burqa wearer.

 

Instead of banning the burqa I would like our equality laws amended to remove the notion that treating people exactly the same can lead to an offence of indirect religious discrimination. If people make religious choices that make it difficult to function in our society then that is their choice and their problem. We need to stop bending the rules to accommodate certain groups of people because when we do it results in others being treated less favourably for making a different religious choice. It is wrong and causes resentment.

[Cyclone 10]

I agree completely that banks should be allowed to verify the identity of customers.

And in principle I agree that if a burqa is inappropriate for a specific workplace then there should be no requirement to hire that person (for example if they work with machinery or on a reception desk).

 

What was being suggested here is that the state start banning specific items of clothing in public.

[Berberis 10]

The Burqa is a symbol of Islamic extremism and is an affront to British values. That said, I'm not really in favour of a ban that specifically targets the burqa. I think it would be far better if we simply stuck to the principle of religious freedom where we do not treat people any differently because of their religious choices.

 

If I am unable to walk into a bank, public building or shop whilst wearing a mask without being challenged, asked to remove it or to leave, then a burqa wearer should get the exact same treatment. If I can be turned down for employment because I insist on wearing a mask then so too should the burqa wearer.

 

Instead of banning the burqa I would like our equality laws amended to remove the notion that treating people exactly the same can lead to an offence of indirect religious discrimination. If people make religious choices that make it difficult to function in our society then that is their choice and their problem. We need to stop bending the rules to accommodate certain groups of people because when we do it results in others being treated less favourably for making a different religious choice. It is wrong and causes resentment.

 

Zamo, currently employers cannot deny employment to a person if they wear a burqa irrespective of the job role. Polygamy is a part of Mormonism, should this religious freedom also be protected?

 

We are digressing here though as this thread is about how a Muslim country is calling the Burqa un-islamic. There is no part of the Quran that states women should cover their faces. This requirement is cultural and not religious.

[Cyclone 10]

Should we ban things that come from other cultures? Perhaps curry and rap music?

[Berberis 10]

Should we ban things that come from other cultures? Perhaps curry and rap music?

 

We DO ban some things that come from other cultures, but as the masters of our own destiny, we can pick and choose which cultural imports we will accept.

 

Should we accept anything and everything from around the world? FGM for example, that is cultural, should be allow this? How about the age of consent, should we lower this to the lowest value as part of this cultural free for all?

 

I know these are extreme examples, but without boundaries and laws, you will always have people pushing, such as we have (I feel) with the burqa. It is not a religious requirement, it is relatively new to the UK but is being protected under the guise of religious freedom, while if you or I was to cover our face in public, we would soon attract the attention of the security services and could be arrested. It's not a freedom is only a select few in the society are entitled to do it.

[Zamo 10]

Zamo, currently employers cannot deny employment to a person if they wear a burqa irrespective of the job role. Polygamy is a part of Mormonism, should this religious freedom also be protected?

 

We are digressing here though as this thread is about how a Muslim country is calling the Burqa un-islamic. There is no part of the Quran that states women should cover their faces. This requirement is cultural and not religious.

 

It isn't strictly true that there are no jobs that could be denied to someone who insisted on wearing a burqa e.g. a lathe operator could on health and safety grounds. However, I would like to see organisations and businesses given far more leeway under the Equalities Act, which currently affords the religious all sorts of exceptions (beyond just burqa wearing) from rules that are imposed on others. If people make religious (or cultural) choices that make it difficult to function in our society then that must be their problem.

 

To be honest I don't think we have anything to learn from Muslim countries about managing the demands of the religious... they have failed spectacularly to separate religious instruction from matters of state. Banning the burqa, or anything else, because it is un-Islamic is not a path a non-Muslim country should go down. Un-Islamic is good!!

[L00b 441]

Should we ban things that come from other cultures? Perhaps curry and rap music?

The UK certainly has plenty of form for banning cultural acts and items, and people (from entry) on cultural grounds, in relevant circumstances.

 

Political marches by the UK's National Front in 1970s.

Civil orders (ASBOs) banning recipients from wearing specific items of clothing.

Creationism in school curriculums.

Dieudonné being banned from entry into the UK on the back of the "quenelle" affair.

 

The list goes on, and it's a long one. But you knew that already

Edited March 14, 2016 by L00b

[Zamo 10]

Should we ban things that come from other cultures? Perhaps curry and rap music?

 

I don't think so but we should also not exempt people from rules because of their religious or cultural choices... and that is what currently happens.

 

The classic example is the turban wearing Sikh who can ride a motorbike without a helmet. Sorry but that is not equality. Either the rule is good enough for all or none. I simply do not accept that as a non-religious person it is fair that I am subject to rules and laws that the religious can be exempt.