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Campaign grows to switch the building of HS2 station to Sheffield city

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21 hours ago, probedb said:

I still don't understand why this was allowed to happen. The report should just have started with "there is no capacity at Sheffield Midland, put it somewhere else". Moving local services away from the station is mind-bogglingly stupid.

Anyone that has to sit on a train getting annoyed waiting for a platform to become free is surely going to be overjoyed by this...honest ;) Hey let's cram even more services in so we can be even later than we were before or maybe force us to walk to a tram stop which somehow would have to cope with a whole load of new tram services? Or am I getting that wrong?

I think the idea is the local Doncaster-Sheffield all station trains will be removed freeing up capacity at Sheffield station for the HS2 trains to Leeds/Birmingham/London and a new tram train service will run Sheffield City Centre to Doncaster town and Doncaster Airport. Whether the tram trains is from the Sheffield Station tram stop or Sheffield Cathedral isn't mentioned, however I think there is hope for major investment in the tram network to add lots of new tram train lines including one to Waverley/AMP and maybe one to Stocksbridge so what trams do in Sheffield City Centre may look different by then.

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2 hours ago, Andy C said:

I think the idea is the local Doncaster-Sheffield all station trains will be removed freeing up capacity at Sheffield station for the HS2 trains to Leeds/Birmingham/London and a new tram train service will run Sheffield City Centre to Doncaster town and Doncaster Airport. Whether the tram trains is from the Sheffield Station tram stop or Sheffield Cathedral isn't mentioned, however I think there is hope for major investment in the tram network to add lots of new tram train lines including one to Waverley/AMP and maybe one to Stocksbridge so what trams do in Sheffield City Centre may look different by then.

There is a decent service from Doncaster and Retford to London, much better than from Sheffield.  Are there plans to change these two routes?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Chez2 said:

There is a decent service from Doncaster and Retford to London, much better than from Sheffield.  Are there plans to change these two routes?

Im not overly convinced by that.

 

Its certainly not better if your dont live within a short distance from either station.       Yes, the line itself has shorter journey times from yorkshire down to the capital but factor in communting and/or additional waiting time getting to and interchanging and any time saving is completely lost.

 

Secondly, from my own experiences of the East Coast Mainline - it always seems to be the one with problems.   Its wholly oversubscribed because every TOC seems to want to fight to run a service on it, its clearly much busier with passengers which impacts the service levels, overcrowding and stations - plus there are frequent delays due to technical faults, power failures, signaling or otherwise.

 

The MML may not (yet) have the same prestige or the shiny new trains, but from my own experience it is rarely struck by long delays (certainly noticably lesser than ECML), the trains, whilst older are still half decent and the convenience of a direct service from Sheffield more than makes up for the 25 or so extra minutes of journey time.

 

 

Edited by ECCOnoob

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18 hours ago, ECCOnoob said:

Im not overly convinced by that.

 

Its certainly not better if your dont live within a short distance from either station.       Yes, the line itself has shorter journey times from yorkshire down to the capital but factor in communting and/or additional waiting time getting to and interchanging and any time saving is completely lost.

 

Secondly, from my own experiences of the East Coast Mainline - it always seems to be the one with problems.   Its wholly oversubscribed because every TOC seems to want to fight to run a service on it, its clearly much busier with passengers which impacts the service levels, overcrowding and stations - plus there are frequent delays due to technical faults, power failures, signaling or otherwise.

 

The MML may not (yet) have the same prestige or the shiny new trains, but from my own experience it is rarely struck by long delays (certainly noticably lesser than ECML), the trains, whilst older are still half decent and the convenience of a direct service from Sheffield more than makes up for the 25 or so extra minutes of journey time.

 

 

Where you live doesn't affect the service,  just your convenience. We live on the edge of Rotherham and Sheffield and find we can get to Doncaster or Retford station just as easy if not easier than Sheffield  due to traffic.  Once you get to Sheffield you can't park close by as easy as you can at Doncaster or Retford. The train journey is quicker too. 

 

My question was about the train service from Doncaster and Retford not a persons proximity to any of the stations. My husband has used these stations a lot for trips to London (and Scotland from Doncaster). He used to have to go at least monthly if not more frequently.  

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Looking at the maps that have been published for proposed HS2 services, trains from Scotland, North East England and Leeds that currently use the East Coast Main Line via Doncaster to Kings Cross will instead use the HS2 line from Yorkshire south. Likewise Cross Country trains will use HS2 between Yorkshire and Birmingham.

 

Obviously those trains will no longer call at Doncaster or Retford, however nothing has been announced as to how the capacity freed up will be used. It is likely more commuter trains will run south of Peterborough, however it could also be used  to run more services from places like Lincoln, Grimsby and Hull through to London, some of which could serve Doncaster and Retford.  I would also imagine regular trains will still run from Doncaster but perhaps serving more intermediate stops as the fast trains will be on HS2 instead.

 

Originally the proposed HS2 station at Meadowhall Interchange was to serve all South Yorkshire as it is served by trains from Barnsley, Doncaster and Rotherham and is also easy to reach via the M1/M18. That isn't to be though unfortunately. There is talk instead of building a high speed station in the Dearne Valley somewere between Doncaster and Wakefield though.

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1 hour ago, Andy C said:

Originally the proposed HS2 station at Meadowhall Interchange was to serve all South Yorkshire as it is served by trains from Barnsley, Doncaster and Rotherham and is also easy to reach via the M1/M18. That isn't to be though unfortunately. There is talk instead of building a high speed station in the Dearne Valley somewere between Doncaster and Wakefield though.

Meadowhall was such a sensible idea.   No wonder the rest of South Yorkshire are reluctant to be part of the Sheffield City Region when Sheffield can act so selfishly to insist on Midland Station.  

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1 hour ago, Ms Macbeth said:

Meadowhall was such a sensible idea.   No wonder the rest of South Yorkshire are reluctant to be part of the Sheffield City Region when Sheffield can act so selfishly to insist on Midland Station.  

Absolutely. It would serve a far larger area of South Yorkshire with excellent links to other rail, road and tram. I really don’t understand Sheff Councils thinking on insisting it comes (at a snails pace) to midland station instead. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Blue Day said:

Absolutely. It would serve a far larger area of South Yorkshire with excellent links to other rail, road and tram. I really don’t understand Sheff Councils thinking on insisting it comes (at a snails pace) to midland station instead. 

 

2 hours ago, Ms Macbeth said:

Meadowhall was such a sensible idea.   No wonder the rest of South Yorkshire are reluctant to be part of the Sheffield City Region when Sheffield can act so selfishly to insist on Midland Station.  

 

1 hour ago, Blue Day said:

Absolutely. It would serve a far larger area of South Yorkshire with excellent links to other rail, road and tram. I really don’t understand Sheff Councils thinking on insisting it comes (at a snails pace) to midland station instead. 

Please stop perpetuating  the myth that accuses Sheffield City Council of wanting the HS2 station at Midland and is being copied by more and more people.

The Government settled on two finalists for routes through Sheffield.

1 Meadowhall (the "winner")

2 Beighton-Nunnery/Victoria- Chapletown.( preferred by SCC-  rejected on cost).

 

Sheffield (Midland) had been rejected on cost, capacity and on local and regional infrastructure and connectivity previously.

SCC wanted as 'city' station on the grounds of economic growth particularly around Nunnery-Victoria.

Like everyone else SCC knew  that Midland is a non starter.

Edited by Annie Bynnol

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1 hour ago, Annie Bynnol said:

 

 

Please stop perpetuating  the myth that accuses Sheffield City Council of wanting the HS2 station at Midland and is being copied by more and more people.

The Government settled on two finalists for routes through Sheffield.

1 Meadowhall (the "winner")

2 Beighton-Nunnery/Victoria- Chapletown.( preferred by SCC-  rejected on cost).

 

Sheffield (Midland) had been rejected on cost, capacity and on local and regional infrastructure and connectivity previously.

SCC wanted as 'city' station on the grounds of economic growth particularly around Nunnery-Victoria.

Like everyone else SCC knew  that Midland is a non starter.

I’m lost. I’ve heard nothing about it going through Meadowhall. Is that the chosen route now? I haven’t read that anywhere. 

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Doncaster will be the new Sheffield ... airport facilities ... ferry ports nearby ... m18 location near the town, location to Leeds. Its a no brainer

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10 hours ago, Blue Day said:

I’m lost. I’ve heard nothing about it going through Meadowhall. Is that the chosen route now? I haven’t read that anywhere. 

Meadowhall was a suggestion on the original proposal; how can you have missed that?

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10 hours ago, Blue Day said:

I’m lost. I’ve heard nothing about it going through Meadowhall. Is that the chosen route now? I haven’t read that anywhere. 

No, it will not be going through Meadowhall.

During the initial planning several routes were researched. 

From this list the Government chose two- Meadowhall and Victoria.

Of these two the Government  chose Meadowhall despite SCC wanting Victoria.

Detailed planning and consultation for the route  were carried out at the cost of millions.

The Government ordered a review to reduce costs.

The review found that a route further east through Mexborough would reduce costs. 

Sheffield would get a branch off the HS2 route to current Midland Mainlin( MML) at Clay Cross.

 

At no stage did SCC campaign for a Midland option.

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