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Is it safe to holiday in Muslim countries now?

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It's a shame. There's many countries I used to go to that I wouldn't dream of going to now - Tunisia, Algeria, Libya and Pakistan. Not sure about Mauritania too, I think there's been a few kidnappings there.

 

I think I'd still go to Turkey, but the most dangerous thing there was the driving!

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I say compare Istanbul and Paris and you somehow do a comparison of Egypt and France... Istanbul is in Turkey...

 

More people have been killed in Paris recently than in Istanbul. You can't really argue with that fact.

No, I invited you to check the count of terrorist attacks and victims in Turkey in 2014 and 2015, showing more attacks and victims in Turkey in the period (with more attacks in Istanbul itself, but fewer victims) than in Paris in the same period.

 

I wasn't so much arguing about your habitual statistical point-scoring, as placing it in some context.

 

2 major terrorist attacks in 12 months in Paris, the brunt of the victims down to careful target selection and planning (small enclosure providing a target-rich captive environment for aimed automatic gunfire), in a context providing little to no neutralising factors (such as plenty of armed police on hand and a shoot-to-kill few-questions-asked context...nowhere to be seen on the occasions).

 

Multiples of that number of terrorist attacks in 12 months in Turkey, with fewer victims due to opportunistic/ad hoc nature of attacks (small artisanal bombs, few instances of any gunfire) and arguably higher security (down to very long-standing PKK terror activities and more recently ISIL activity, and an existing border with Syria. Not to forget Erdogan's quasi-authoritarian rule in the context of Turkey's fairly lax (from a human rights/due process point of view) security and policing rules...and of course the flourishing oil business between Erdogan's son and ISIL and his own, less-than-orthodox relationship with ISIL and other anti-Assad movements.

 

But by all means, don't let me talk you off holidaying in Bodrum or Antalya (or Istanbul for that matter), must be cheap and only getting cheaper. Personally, I'll be avoiding Turkey (if not on security grounds, then at least on ideological grounds) and, in no particular order, Paris, Sweden, Germany (same again: if not on security grounds, then at least on ideological grounds) and anywhere in Africa (this time, quite clearly on security grounds).

Edited by L00b

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You cannot live your life in fear. Have been going to Hurghada every year for about 14yrs and will be going again soon. If there is a flight! Eventually nobody will go anywhere and we could get blown up in Britain

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Why would you desire to visit an overseas destination which may end your life prematurely. Possibly in some horrific and barbaric way.

 

Not for me, I am a coward and proud of it.

 

Angel1.

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Why would you desire to visit an overseas destination which may end your life prematurely. Possibly in some horrific and barbaric way.

 

Not for me, I am a coward and proud of it.

 

Angel1.

 

Two things we can be certain of we live we die. If I stay at home I could fall downstairs and break my neck! Would rather meet my maker doing something I want to do and hopefully not get run over tomorrow by a bus lol!!

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Two things we can be certain of we live we die. If I stay at home I could fall downstairs and break my neck! Would rather meet my maker doing something I want to do and hopefully not get run over tomorrow by a bus lol!!

 

I very much doubt that he's suggesting staying at home, just going somewhere nice with negligible threat of terrorism. There's plenty of nice places before considering Turkey, Egypt etc.

 

Even if you can live with the risk, there's also the suspicion mentioned by L00b that you could be supporting states which might be less than honest about their position on Islamism.

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Two things we can be certain of we live we die. If I stay at home I could fall downstairs and break my neck! Would rather meet my maker doing something I want to do and hopefully not get run over tomorrow by a bus lol!!

 

I agree. Though for me holidaying in a country full of people who have if we're being charitable a lack of respect to me because I don't share their faith is not my idea of what I want to do. Spent plenty of time in muslim countries but was always armed, don't see myself returning in speedos anytime soon.

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I was looking at a Villa in Turkey this summer for me, the missus and our daughters. Not now though, i'm not taking any chances with the girls. Italy, or Portugal for us.

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No, I invited you to check the count of terrorist attacks and victims in Turkey in 2014 and 2015, showing more attacks and victims in Turkey in the period (with more attacks in Istanbul itself, but fewer victims) than in Paris in the same period.

Yes you did.

When I had made a comparison to the number of people killed in Istanbul and Paris recently.

Apples and Oranges.

And anywhere in Africa (this time, quite clearly on security grounds).

 

You'd avoid an entire continent for security grounds?

 

Has South Africa got any more dangerous recently?

How about Guana? Or Cape Verde?

 

I'm not trying to score any points, I'm just trying to keep things in perspective.

People are poor at assessing risk, and each time something happens some people cross another entire country or continent of their "might holiday" list. But not France... Because that's close by, and we don't want to be worried that going to a concert in one of our closest neighbours might result in being killed in a terrorist atrocity.

Easier to rule out all of Africa than all of France, or even Paris.

 

---------- Post added 13-01-2016 at 08:34 ----------

 

Why would you desire to visit an overseas destination which may end your life prematurely. Possibly in some horrific and barbaric way.

 

Not for me, I am a coward and proud of it.

 

Angel1.

 

I assume you will be staying in the house this morning then, wrapped in bubble wrap.

 

After all, who'd want to cross a road when it may end your life prematurely. Possibly in a horrific and painful way.

 

---------- Post added 13-01-2016 at 08:36 ----------

 

I very much doubt that he's suggesting staying at home,

 

Then he should choose his words more carefully shouldn't he.

Edited by Cyclone

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I agree. Though for me holidaying in a country full of people who have if we're being charitable a lack of respect to me because I don't share their faith is not my idea of what I want to do. Spent plenty of time in muslim countries but was always armed, don't see myself returning in speedos anytime soon.

 

I see those nice chaps blew up a polio vaccination cenre in Pakistan yesterday killing a load of people including the doctors. Polio is on the rise again in Pakistan.

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I wouldn't go either. You have to cross roads, you have to go down flights of stairs, but you don't have to go on holiday to places where airliners are being blown out of the sky or people are being shot dead while sunbathing, or getting blown up whilst walking around an historic square.

 

Trouble is, the terrorists know this and are deliberately trying to crash the tourist industry in places like Morocco. This will lead to unemployment, alienation and a bigger chance of poor Muslims being radicalised.

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Airliners.. Plural?

 

So you've ruled out France then Harry? Too dangerous. And London? And New York?

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