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How long would you expect to wait for a ambulance after ringing 999

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they are too busy with drunken louts all outside the clubs, i would fine them £200,they should also have names in the star paper,i think they used to print them years ago

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My next door neighbours father had a heart attack, they called 999, the ambulance arrived hours later.....

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My next door neighbours father had a heart attack, they called 999, the ambulance arrived hours later.....

 

Tell us the full story and we will comment on this :confused:

 

---------- Post added 01-10-2015 at 19:16 ----------

 

That would require the government to actually do something to help the NHS though, when they are intent on running it down in practice and in the media.

 

The Conservative party care not a jot about the NHS.

They will run it into the ground over the next few years.

We will be well on the way to a two tier system where those who can pay will get the care and treatment they need and the poor will get what is left.

I didn't vote for this government so my conscience is clear.

Is yours ?

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... and you brought police into it, which I'm trying to show you (like with taxis analogy) that there aren't the numbers of medically qualified that the police have in the form of bobbys.

 

Are you going to answer? You suggested it, so why can't you answer it?

 

where are going to ship lots of ambulances and paramedics from, on a Friday or Saturday night?

 

You berate me for bringing taxis into it, when it was in fact you that did.

 

You badger me for a solution, when I have already explained, I don't have one, but I have made possible suggestions.

 

Is there something in the Sheffield Forum Rules that state you cannot ask a question without having the answer yourself, or is that your rule, ash?

 

As I have already inferred, police are shipped in and the system works because there are financial incentives there, I presume, in the form of overtime. I imagine the problem could be resolved by making more resources available, like with most things.

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As I have already inferred, police are shipped in and the system works because there are financial incentives there, I presume, in the form of overtime. I imagine the problem could be resolved by making more resources available, like with most things.

 

It could, but a paramedic takes 2 or three years at university to train. A police officer can be on the street and active (albeit not a full constable) within 6 months.

 

In the meantime, the police can help out neighbouring constabularies with short term extra cover, eg riots, protests, etc because it's unlikely to find riots going off at the same time in neighbouring forces... The ambulance service is beyond breaking point, all over, all of the time.

 

Yes, they can send us CFRs, with our 4 days of training, and they can recruit a load more ECAs who have a few months of training to help cover some of the shortfall and try to get to more life threatening calls quicker and get the basics started, but ambulance services need more paramedics... who need more ambulances (at £100-250k each) to transport people in to cover the stack of ambulances waiting at A&E, who can't handover their patient because A&E is full, because A&E can't transfer a patient to an appropriate ward because the wards are full and can't discharge patients to make space because there isn't sufficient post-discharge community care in place. So patients end up getting discharged early without care in place because they're the least 'in need', so they go home, and get ill again, and call an ambulance...

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I guess the theory would be places that aren't having an event like freshers week, so Leeds and Manchester perhaps.

 

But it's not practical, because Fri/Sat night is still the busiest night of the week and presumably those services are already running at close to 100%, as our own does most weeks, there is simply no spare capacity for when it peaks higher due to something like freshers week (assuming it really does create a peak).

 

:thumbsup:

 

It could, but a paramedic takes 2 or three years at university to train. A police officer can be on the street and active (albeit not a full constable) within 6 months.

 

In the meantime, the police can help out neighbouring constabularies with short term extra cover, eg riots, protests, etc because it's unlikely to find riots going off at the same time in neighbouring forces... The ambulance service is beyond breaking point, all over, all of the time.

 

Yes, they can send us CFRs, with our 4 days of training, and they can recruit a load more ECAs who have a few months of training to help cover some of the shortfall and try to get to more life threatening calls quicker and get the basics started, but ambulance services need more paramedics... who need more ambulances (at £100-250k each) to transport people in to cover the stack of ambulances waiting at A&E, who can't handover their patient because A&E is full, because A&E can't transfer a patient to an appropriate ward because the wards are full and can't discharge patients to make space because there isn't sufficient post-discharge community care in place. So patients end up getting discharged early without care in place because they're the least 'in need', so they go home, and get ill again, and call an ambulance...

 

At last, 2 posters seeing what I would have thought was obvious.

 

-

 

You berate me for bringing taxis into it, when it was in fact you that did.

 

I haven't berated you, at least not on purpose.

 

You badger me for a solution, when I have already explained, I don't have one, but I have made possible suggestions.

 

Berate, badger... :hihi:

 

I'm NOT badgering you for a solution, I was questioning your suggestion. Nightflight has spelled it out a bit more clearly.

 

As I have already inferred, police are shipped in and the system works because there are financial incentives there, I presume, in the form of overtime. I imagine the problem could be resolved by making more resources available, like with most things.

 

This is dodging what you said really isn't it?

 

You didn't infer anything from when you wrote this, because I hadn't responded. What you did (I thought) was imply that this was an easy thing to fix... (ideology at its best)

 

So, this happens every year and the service is stretched to the max? This is a foreseeable event. When big numbers are expected for demonstrations, sports events, etc the police ship in numbers from neighbouring forces, 'just in case'. Why doesn't this happen in Sheffield, when actual lives are at risk then?

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Nice attempt at a dig, but like police, taxi drivers are numerous because it's not a job that particularly requires spectacular intelligence and neither of which many people want to do for a living. Paramedics aren't quite as freely available or numerous, nor is the finance to pay for them/ and their equipment which is far more expensive than police or taxis.

 

Just how many police officers do you think there are? You'd be majorly shocked. When officers stop attending all but the most serious of incidents, they'll get an idea. Hence Lincolnshire Police talking about being close to going "bankrupt"

 

Don't bother to reply. This is the first time I've logged on in about 18 months so probably won't read it.

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You berate me for bringing taxis into it, when it was in fact you that did.

 

You badger me for a solution, when I have already explained, I don't have one, but I have made possible suggestions.

 

Is there something in the Sheffield Forum Rules that state you cannot ask a question without having the answer yourself, or is that your rule, ash?

 

As I have already inferred, police are shipped in and the system works because there are financial incentives there, I presume, in the form of overtime. I imagine the problem could be resolved by making more resources available, like with most things.

 

Police are shipped in because football games that create peaks of work don't happen at the same time throughout the country or nearby counties.

Unlike Friday and Saturday evening, which happen at exactly the same time and create the same peak across all the services.

If everywhere is running close to capacity on a normal Fri/Sat night, then where could resource come from for an unusual peak? (If there even was such a peak, which I've seen no real evidence for).

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Just how many police officers do you think there are? You'd be majorly shocked. When officers stop attending all but the most serious of incidents, they'll get an idea. Hence Lincolnshire Police talking about being close to going "bankrupt"

 

Don't bother to reply. This is the first time I've logged on in about 18 months so probably won't read it.

 

Hi BG, long time no see. I'll reply anyway :D

 

I don't think that there are thousands of police on hand... I said that there was scope to moving people around at non-peak times, and mentioned demos, and football of course is an example which requires a lot of pre-planning throughout the season. (the obvious example is that two clubs close to each other don't play at the same times - due to this)

 

Bobbys might be quite numerous across the country and there is scope for moving them around when there is something big occurring somewhere, but paramedics aren't 10 a penny. Even getting more police on a Fri/Sat night would be difficult and probably why major demonstrations are held in the daytime when demand is lower.

 

I also said...

 

Paramedics aren't quite as freely available or numerous, nor is the finance to pay for them/ and their equipment which is far more expensive than police or taxis.

 

I would guess that drafting in 30 or 40 extra police for an NON-PEAK time demo from other forces for a big event is extremely difficult but possible with planning, whereas this wouldn't be possible in the case of paramedics OR police at PEAK-TIMEs. Wouldn't you agree? (if you pop back again :) )

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Where I work, we do require ambulances probably once a fortnight for whatever reason. If it is a life threatening one, we will be questioned by the operator on the phone to get as much information they can (we will be doing first aid as well as), and by the time the conversation has finished, an ambulance will be at the building.

If it was a lesser case (drunk, sprained ankle etc), it is known to take an hour. Sometimes we have had serious ones and the patient will be in our hands for a long time, sometimes seemingly too long, before an ambulance attends. It can be completely random how long we are waiting.

One incident that sticks in my mind was a young lad who suffered a broken leg, it was well over an hour before an ambulance arrived, however a paramedic was with us within 10 minutes and even he was on the phone to dispatch numerous times!

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Police are shipped in because football games that create peaks of work don't happen at the same time throughout the country or nearby counties.

).

 

I thought most football games happened on Saturday afternoon..

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I thought most football games happened on Saturday afternoon..

 

 

(the obvious example is that two clubs close to each other don't play at the same times - due to this)

 

-

 

I would also reckon that the policing of football matches has evolved together over a long period of time. If I invented a new sport now, and it took off to levels of football crowds, and I decided I wanted to play all games on Saturday nights, I bet I couldn't get any license to run it.

 

Much like when I worked in a night club, I was told and knew that I would have to work most weekends. I'd guess that requests for weekends off for police or ambulance has to be made quite early, and most probably quite restricted number wise.

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