How long would you expect to wait for a ambulance after ringing 999

[onewheeldave 22]

This pretty much hits the nail on the head.

 

Weekends in Sheffield are a big stretch on the Ambulance service as it is due to a shortage of vehicles on the road. Any major events in the area obviously stretch things a hell of a lot more and I consider hundreds of drunken, rowdy teenagers as a definite major event.

 

Unfortunately the truth of the matter is that the OP didn't have to wait 50 minutes for an ambulance due to sheer neglect but due to the fact that this was the quickest that it was logistically possible to get a crew to the patient.

 

There are multiple reasons for this and they all have knock on effects. You only have to read the local media to see that ambulances are queuing outside the doors of A&E just to book patients in, recent figures showed that this could take in excess of an hour and even up to 2 hours. Now we don't know how busy A&E at the Northern was but at a weekend you would imagine rather busy which means crews have to wait around and all of this wait time keeps them off the road.

 

The only real solution is to have more crews on the road. Trusts seem to be actively recruiting in an attempt to solve this despite cuts. Again it has been well documented in the local media that not only Sheffield but the UK as a whole is suffering a lack of qualified Ambulance staff.

 

EDIT:- A big well done to the OP by the way. I'm not saying everyone but some people would have simply drove past the patient believing them to be drunk or whatever and at that time of night I would imagine it is quite daunting to have to stop and offer assistance. Not only did you do so but you stayed around the whole time liaising with the ambulance staff. You definitely deserve respect and credit for that.

 

There's another obvious solution, which, I would argue, is better and more practical than more crews on the road (as more crews would require more money- which won't happen).

 

Which is to enable the current crews to do their job by addressing the inept admin system which means that "ambulances are queuing outside the doors of A&E just to book patients in, recent figures showed that this could take in excess of an hour and even up to 2 hours".

[Hesther 10]

This doesn't account for life in the real world - on a night when Sheffield has had an influx of thousands of new student 18 year olds out on the lash for the first time - the ambulance service doesn't have an infinite number of response crews .

50 minutes is a long time to wait for an ambulance but the caller was on the phone to the call handler the entire time - any deterioration in the casualty would have flagged up and some other poor soul waiting for an ambulance would have been pushed back in the queue.

What is the solution Nagel - apart from the obvious of having more response crews ?

 

So, this happens every year and the service is stretched to the max? This is a foreseeable event. When big numbers are expected for demonstrations, sports events, etc the police ship in numbers from neighbouring forces, 'just in case'. Why doesn't this happen in Sheffield, when actual lives are at risk then?

[peak4 274]

There's another obvious solution, which, I would argue, is better and more practical than more crews on the road (as more crews would require more money- which won't happen).

 

Which is to enable the current crews to do their job by addressing the inept admin system which means that "ambulances are queuing outside the doors of A&E just to book patients in, recent figures showed that this could take in excess of an hour and even up to 2 hours".

 

I know what you mean, but again the solution would need extra trained staff = more money.

I suspect the "Booking In" isn't admin; more a staff and bed shortage in A&E, which in turn is partly caused by a bed shortage in the hospital, some of which is caused by patients waiting for prescriptions from the pharmacy before discharge etc etc.

 

I've seen this quite a bit, admittedly at a different hospital in a different city (Stockport); My Dad has been a frequent visitor due to a heart complaint.

 

The longest we've had to wait was 55 minutes after the 999 call following a suspected heart attack. This was after he had been discharged too soon, the previous day, due to a bed shortage.

In this case the call handler didn't stay on the line as they expected a fast attendance. When I called back to see why no-one had arrived, I was just told that someone was on their way, but with no ETA. When I called back a second time, after 45 minutes, they got stroppy with me.

Eventually some wonderful staff turned up from Glossop, quite a long way away, so they were unfamiliar with the area and couldn't find the address; they had been given wrong details. Fortunately it all worked out OK in the end.

If someone had just been honest with me and said that there would be a major delay, I could have driven there myself in 10 minutes or less; obviously with a suspected MI the most important thing is to get a paramedic/doctor to the patient, hence not wanting to delay things by me providing the transport.

[*_ash_* 88]

No you can't, the response time should be much quicker and resources much greater in the city.

 

It probably is quick in this city. That doesn't mean 100% of ambulances will be quick 100% of the time. Even if they had an almost perfect 99.99% record, it still means some poor sod loses out.

 

So, this happens every year and the service is stretched to the max? This is a foreseeable event. When big numbers are expected for demonstrations, sports events, etc the police ship in numbers from neighbouring forces, 'just in case'. Why doesn't this happen in Sheffield, when actual lives are at risk then?

 

See above.

 

Bold: Are you serious? What kind of analogy is this? (for at least 2 reasons)

 

-

 

It IS a foreseeable event, yes, how many 'just in cases' do you get? 'Just in cases' are probably the biggest part of the policing bill.

 

How many ambulances would you acquire and where from?

 

You'll probably find that Fri and Sat night are generally amongst their busiest times in every town/city.

 

Saturday night I would guess there were 30-40000 people out in Sheffield. What if O2 caught fire? Would you say after the event, 'why didn't they have 500 ambulances working?!?' - if that were the number that would have been required to saving everyone's life?

 

It would be interesting to hear from any mobile Paramedics/A&E workers. I'd guess Hesther, that if any staff had asked their manager 'can I have this sat off to go out?' the answer would have been no, you know?

Edited September 30, 2015 by *_ash_*

[cherriepie 10]

I had to call 999 late last Sunday night because my husband suspected he was having a heart attack and the paramedics came within 3 minutes shortly followed by an ambulance. They were brilliant.

[Hesther 10]

 

Bold: Are you serious? What kind of analogy is this? (for at least 2 reasons)

 

-

 

It IS a foreseeable event, yes, how many 'just in cases' do you get? 'Just in cases' are probably the biggest part of the policing bill.

 

How many ambulances would you acquire and where from?

 

You'll probably find that Fri and Sat night are generally amongst their busiest times in every town/city.

 

Saturday night I would guess there were 30-40000 people out in Sheffield. What if O2 caught fire? Would you say after the event, 'why didn't they have 500 ambulances working?!?' - if that were the number that would have been required to saving everyone's life?

 

It would be interesting to hear from any mobile Paramedics/A&E workers. I'd guess Hesther, that if any staff had asked their manager 'can I have this sat off to go out?' the answer would have been no, you know?

 

Of course I'm serious. Your comparison with the O2 fire is a bit daft - we're not talking about 'just in case' here, are we? We're talking about a totally foreseeable event which happens every year.

 

The police, like ambulance staff/paramedics etc is an emergency service. If we can organise to ship in hundreds of police 'just in case' something kicks off during a demonstration, why can't we organise to ship in paramedics, etc, from neighbouring areas, when we KNOW there is going to be a higher demand for these services, and we know lives will be put at risk?

[Cyclone 10]

There's another obvious solution, which, I would argue, is better and more practical than more crews on the road (as more crews would require more money- which won't happen).

 

Which is to enable the current crews to do their job by addressing the inept admin system which means that "ambulances are queuing outside the doors of A&E just to book patients in, recent figures showed that this could take in excess of an hour and even up to 2 hours".

 

That would require the government to actually do something to help the NHS though, when they are intent on running it down in practice and in the media.

[green_man 10]

There's another obvious solution, which, I would argue, is better and more practical than more crews on the road (as more crews would require more money- which won't happen).

 

Which is to enable the current crews to do their job by addressing the inept admin system which means that "ambulances are queuing outside the doors of A&E just to book patients in, recent figures showed that this could take in excess of an hour and even up to 2 hours".

 

I'm afraid that your solution is probably less feasible than mine.

 

The queuing of Ambulances outside A&E isn't due to any inept admin system but as a result of an NHS in crisis as a whole. It is quite simple, you can't take patients into a hospital if you don't have anywhere to put them. The wards are full which has a huge knock on effect as it means those sat in A&E waiting to be transferred to a ward can't move on, this ties up beds within the emergency department of the hospital and so on and so forth.

 

It is easy to sit around pointing fingers but there are multiple complex factors that have to be considered and the truth is that there is no overnight fix for them. If you read the national media and trust websites you will see that they are constantly working extremely hard to alleviate the problems.

Edited September 30, 2015 by green_man

[GoGo_dancer 10]

 

Originally Posted by verona View Post

 

Yes, good on you for staying with him, most people would have just driven passed.

 

Would they, how can you know that?[/QUOTE]

 

My mother-in-law tripped in a pot-hole on the pavement and landed face first, half in the road and suffered a broken nose and cuts to her lips. She was across the road from my house when it happened and as I tried to get to her, FOUR cars practically drove around her.

 

 

Last year my 86 year old Grandad collapsed in the bathroom at 2am after getting a nasty water infection. He was very weak and dizzy and was kind of wedged in a corner so my Grandma couldn't help him up. She called for an ambulance and it took 2 hours for a paramedic to arrive to get him off the bathroom floor and another 45 minutes for ambulance to come and take him to A&E. The paramedic could only apologise and explained as it was a weekend they were stretched with drunken fights in town.

 

He's had to have the ambulance out a few times since then, luckily all during the day and they've arrived within 10 mins, and overall the service he's received from all the medical staff we've come into contact with has been exceptional so I'm just eternally grateful we have the NHS!

[*_ash_* 88]

Of course I'm serious. Your comparison with the O2 fire is a bit daft - we're not talking about 'just in case' here, are we? We're talking about a totally foreseeable event which happens every year.

 

No it isn't... and your comparison using the police isn't?!

 

Let me ask you again, where are going to ship lots of ambulances and paramedics from, on a Friday or Saturday night?

 

Chesterfield? Rotherham? Barnsley? Donny? Does it occur to you that THEY are at their busiest on Friday and Saturday night as are most places? - and that students start everywhere around the same time.

 

Bobbys might be quite numerous across the country and there is scope for moving them around when there is something big occurring somewhere, but paramedics aren't 10 a penny. Even getting more police on a Fri/Sat night would be difficult and probably why major demonstrations are held in the daytime when demand is lower.

 

The police, like ambulance staff/paramedics etc is an emergency service. If we can organise to ship in hundreds of police 'just in case' something kicks off during a demonstration, why can't we organise to ship in paramedics, etc, from neighbouring areas, when we KNOW there is going to be a higher demand for these services, and we know lives will be put at risk?

 

See above.

 

As it happens there was at least one issue on Friday night, that probably took up a lot of emergency staff at the hospital and from paramedics.

 

-

 

You remind me of people who complain when there aren't enough taxis on mega-busy nights, and ring up and say 'why don't you get some more for events like this?! '

 

You might like my idea for Penistone Road to be come a 8 lane highway, because 20 times a year Wednesday fans completely block the roads around Hillsborough on match day

[dizzybird77 10]

Of course I'm serious. Your comparison with the O2 fire is a bit daft - we're not talking about 'just in case' here, are we? We're talking about a totally foreseeable event which happens every year.

 

The police, like ambulance staff/paramedics etc is an emergency service. If we can organise to ship in hundreds of police 'just in case' something kicks off during a demonstration, why can't we organise to ship in paramedics, etc, from neighbouring areas, when we KNOW there is going to be a higher demand for these services, and we know lives will be put at risk?

 

Unfortunately the ambulance service is not classed as an emergency service by the government, only an essential service.

Maybe if they were funded by the government (like police/fire) there would be more money available?

I remember signing a petition last year to make ambulance an emergency service.... Obviously the petition didn't work!

[S6 D.I.Y 10]

i wasent trying to blame anybody for this just if this was the normal to wait so long

 

also SPIDER not all from upperthorpe are bad people i am from here and a local

i DID NOT THROW WATER ON HIM

I DID NOT GO THROU HIS POCKETS

 

i could not just go past i treat others how i would like to be treated myself ..hope you not in need of help one day

 

ANY WAY THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR RESPONSES