The Bible is a awesome Book even if you dont believe its Gods word

[bulldog D 10]

A lot of these visions that prophets had have been attributed to taking hallucinogenic substances which was quite common at the time. Similar to Carlos Castaneda and his Shaman rituals done to obtain that "higher knowledge."

 

Indeed the poppy and it's cultivation is recorded in Sumerian text some 6000 years ago but there's no inference that Ezekiel was on hallucinogens at the time so let's cut the lad some slack!

[flamingjimmy 10]

Hey borderline does your seminar on how to understand the bible properly (because god didn't write it well enough) cover how to treat our slaves and the womenfolk of our enemies?

[bulldog D 10]

Hey borderline does your seminar on how to understand the bible properly (because god didn't write it well enough) cover how to treat our slaves and the womenfolk of our enemies?

 

 

Obviously I'm not Borderline but I'd point you in the direction of the Modern Slavery Act 2015 and the Geneva Convention, also international Law as a general direction:) hope that helps!

 

If your not sure check them out after all doubt is the origin of wisdom isn't it!

Edited August 31, 2015 by bulldog D

[apelike 10]

Indeed the poppy and it's cultivation is recorded in Sumerian text some 6000 years ago but there's no inference that Ezekiel was on hallucinogens at the time so let's cut the lad some slack!

 

It was nothing to do with the poppy as that is intoxicating but not really hallucinogenic. Have a read up on manna from heaven and its possible link to magic mushroom (Psilocybe Cubensis) as they were quite common.

 

Then there is also Ergot to consider.

 

Anyone who has ever taken LSD can get similar visions resulting in a state of euphoria. Those visions are characterised by iridescent shimmering colours and ghostly like apparitions.

 

Just to add, have a read of the book "The sacred mushroom and the cross."

Edited August 31, 2015 by apelike

[DrNorm 10]

If that's your definition of an amoral community, rather than it being a community of people without morals, then yes SF may be an amoral community. In that same way, parliament is an amoral community. So is my local gym. So is the local library/cafe/bus stop.

 

If that's what you think an amoral community is then I don't see any problem with amoral communities.

 

I wasn't belittling amoral communities - merely making the distinction between amoral and moral communities.

 

Amoral communities are in the ascendancy and moral communities are in the decline.

 

Whereas we may be reasonably confident there aren't many SFers who take advantage of a liberal approach to morals, I do wonder whether society will eventually suffer without a moral framework ... and I do know that atheists won't accept the bible as that moral framework. However, there isn't a moral guide for non-theists that has come close to taking its place. Aesop's Fables may be a small beginning, and no matter how "pure" they are, they will never have the clout of a book that's been around for centuries. In any case, they perhaps need addition and revision to remain relevant.

 

Perhaps we could have a fable to highlight the immorality of rape and slavery for flamingjimmy?

Edited August 31, 2015 by DrNorm

[bulldog D 10]

It was nothing to do with the poppy as that is intoxicating but not really hallucinogenic. Have a read up on manna from heaven and its possible link to magic mushroom (Psilocybe Cubensis) as they were quite common.

 

Then there is also Ergot to consider.

 

Anyone who has ever taken LSD can get similar visions resulting in a state of euphoria. Those visions are characterised by iridescent shimmering colours and ghostly like apparitions.

 

Just to add, have a read of the book "The sacred mushroom and the cross."

 

Thanks for the advice but I'll pass on that one as the authors suggestion that Jesus Christ existed due to the eating of magic mushrooms is a step too far even for me! and I'm quite open minded . I do feel a bit sorry for poor old Ezekiel though, as there he was, doing his best translating visions and then 2700 years later you turn up and accuse the poor old lad of doing drugs!

 

---------- Post added 31-08-2015 at 15:08 ----------

 

I wasn't belittling amoral communities - merely making the distinction between amoral and moral communities.

 

Amoral communities are in the ascendancy and moral communities are in the decline.

 

Whereas we may be reasonably confident there aren't many SFers who take advantage of a liberal approach to morals, I do wonder whether society will eventually suffer without a moral framework ... and I do know that atheists won't accept the bible as that moral framework. However, there isn't a moral guide for non-theists that has come close to taking its place. Aesop's Fables may be a small beginning, and no matter how "pure" they are, they will never have the clout of a book that's been around for centuries. In any case, they perhaps need addition and revision too to remain relevant.

 

Perhaps we could have a fable to highlight the immorality of rape and slavery for flamingjimmy?

 

I'm hoping you'd have evidence to support the conclusion on the ascendency of amoral communities as this is quite a statement and the implications are potentially serious and rather sad.

[DrNorm 10]

There is a fantastic exploration of early Christianity which I first saw on American PBS. It's available online here. Great watching for believers and non-believers and I'd say essential viewing in preparation for your course borderline (although I imagine most of it won't be comfortable listening)

 

---------- Post added 31-08-2015 at 15:22 ----------

 

I'm hoping you'd have evidence to support the conclusion on the ascendency of amoral communities as this is quite a statement and the implications are potentially serious and rather sad.

 

I haven't researched this fully, but isn't it true?

 

Please excuse the source, but, as I'm just off out, you get number one on my google search.

 

• New research shows that the number of Americans with religious affiliations has dropped by 18 per cent, or 25 million people
  
• Computer scientist Allen Downey says there is a correlation between the drop and the rise of Internet use
  

[teeny 10]

I personally like the NKJS new king James but when I was younger I always read the good news versions, but when you are reading certain versions be aware some have been paraphrased to help with understanding. I love the fact that Bible is the inspired word of God , Peoples ideas and beliefs make it harder for understanding what people believe. Faith isn't complicated and you can live by what the bible tells us

[flamingjimmy 10]

Perhaps we could have a fable to highlight the immorality of rape and slavery for flamingjimmy?

 

I know full well rape and slavery are wrong. I don't need a manual written by a supposed authority to figure that out.

 

I'm simply highlighting that whoever wrote the bible did not think slavery and rape were particularly wrong, at least not on the same level as say for example wearing two different kinds of fabrics or eating shellfish. Either that or they neglected to mention it, which is lazy at best.

 

One of many reasons why it is deeply flawed as a moral guide.

Edited August 31, 2015 by flamingjimmy

[borderline 10]

The poster will certainly not be attending any session and would certainly not advocate any other to attend.

 

The questions can all be answered without any intervention from those that would seek to impose or influence their views for whatever reason.

 

Humans are pre programmed to act collectively and conditions are created in mass events to encourage this. The behaviour seen in political rallies, sporting events, concerts, healing, clairvoyant, religious gatherings, demonstrations, collective bullying etc can be explained better by biochemistry of the brain rather than some ideology or "truth".

 

Wow so much wrong with this post it's hard to comprehend, firstly I said I would ask all the same questions she did and yet she is not prepared to listen... SHE asked! Secondly I lost count of the assumptions she made that are so far from the truth I hate any sort of clairvoyants or bullying we don't do any types demonstration and as for biochemistry we have them too and really can you explain it to you anyone . Thirdly you say we seek to impose or influence .she ask the questions and refuses to look at what we have to say, And then impose her influence on other forum members Wow!! Very poor post on any level

[bulldog D 10]

I know full well rape and slavery are wrong. I don't need a manual written by a supposed authority to figure that out.

 

I'm simply highlighting that whoever wrote the bible did not think slavery and rape were particularly wrong, at least not on the same level as say for example wearing two different kinds of fabrics or eating shellfish. Either that or they neglected to mention it, which is lazy at best.

 

One of many reasons why it is deeply flawed as a moral guide.

 

Fair do's! FlamingJ but in all fairness no one individual wrote the bible! It's a collection of books by different authors, approx 40 I think. Due to It's popularity over the centuries there's been hundreds of thousands that have looked to find fault in it. inevitably that continues to this day, and why not! the fact that it's been questioned, examined and argued over and yet still encourages discussion and debate tells me it's impact is still strong on our culture! Personally I believe for the right reasons in the vast majority of cases. In relation to the fabrics and shellfish bit have I missed the part on Diet and fashion.

[TJC1 10]

The bibles a work of fiction. All religion should be outlawed, it's responsible for wars and oppression and an excuse to fiddle with kids.

 

Religion has no place in secular society.