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SCC Blasted For Spending £700K On Translation In 3 Years

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It may not be a large proportion of the budget , but when the council are bleating on about cuts , wasting money on Politically Correct nonsense like this beggars belief .

 

Sorry but even in the context of the so called "blackhole" in the council's budget even cancelling these services entirely would achieve nothing but it would mean that people whose first language is not English would not understand the services provided and potentially tie up frontline staff with these misunderstandings. You may find that these services are fully costed, to assist already stretched frontline staff.

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nie mówimy o osobach odwiedzających na wakacje, pieniądze są marnowane na ludzi, którzy przychodzą tu mieszkać i są zbyt leniwi, aby nauczyć się języka kraju, w którym żyją w.

 

nu vorbim de persoane care vizitează pentru sarbatori, bani se irosesc pe oamenii care vin să locuiască aici şi sunt prea leneşi pentru a învăţa limba ţării sunt locuiesc în.

 

우리가 휴가 위한 방문 하는 사람들에 대해 얘기 하지 않습니다, 그리고 돈을 살고 여기와 서 살고 있는 나라의 언어를 배울 수 게으른 사람들에 낭비 되 고 있다.

 

aren't vIghel maH nuvpu' QI'lop vISuch, wasted Huch nuvpu' 'ej QuQ Ha' naDev yIn 'ej buD je Sep qaStaHvIS yIn chaH Hol ghoj.

 

online translate seems to work fairly well = Penistone's post translated into Polish, Romanian, Korean and even Klingon.

 

What a waste of money

 

Of cause you can always trust computers to do any translations for you, or can you?

The internet is full of examples of where it has gone wrong including a report about medicine labels translated in New York.

 

"According to a new research study, computer programs that pharmacists depend on to translate prescription labels are prone to potentially dangerous errors. Examples of mistakes include the translation of “once a day” into “eleven times a day”; “by mouth” into “by the little”; and “two times” into “two kiss.” Study researcher Iman Sharif with the Nemours A.I. DuPont Hospital for Children says, “We’re not going to be able to reduce disparities in care if we cannot ensure that patients know how to use their medicines. Medication errors are a huge problem and this is just one venue where this happens, and I think a really important one.” Last year, New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg signed legislation mandating that pharmacy chains offer translated labels to customers speaking any one of the seven top foreign languages spoken in the city. The survey conducted by Sharif and Dartmouth College researcher Julia Tse looked at 286 pharmacies in the Bronx and found that 75 percent provided labels translated into Spanish. Of those pharmacies providing translations, 86 percent used a computer program to translate the labels, while 11 percent used staff members and three percent employed professional translators. A 50-percent error rate was documented in 76 of the computer-generated labels, including 32 incomplete translations and six major spelling or grammatical mistakes. Sharif says that ideally pharmacies would have professional translators on staff to make sure that the labels are translated properly. She adds that accurate translation would be greatly simplified through the standardization of how doctors write prescriptions. She believes these are two issues that should be addressed in health care reform. In the meantime, Sharif urges non-English speakers to “Ask for a professional interpreter. Don’t just accept that you don’t speak English and therefore you don’t get to have information about your medicine.”

From “Drug Label Accuracy Getting Lost in Translation”

http://healthcareinterpreting.org/computer-translations-of-drug-labels-often-wrong/

 

I would not want my medical records computer interpreted, I have read some scientific reports translated by computer and they were complete gibberish.

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Spot on . we shouldnt be spending large sums of money translating for people who cannot be bothered to learn basic English when entering the country.

 

I just think that's nasty.

 

What about my point that basic English might not be sufficient for some things?

 

In other words, people learning English still might need support.

 

You're assuming "laziness", which sounds like prejudice to me.

 

According to the 2011 Census, there were 490,407 people (over 3) out of a total of 532,164 people living in Sheffield whose main language was English.

 

There were 15,681 people whose main language wasn't English, but who spoke English very well.

 

A further 16,844 people didn't have English as their main language, but spoke English well.

 

7,753 people couldn't speak English well.

 

And 1,479 people couldn't speak English.

 

The census also tells us what people's main languages were.

 

English: 490, 407

Welsh: 67

Irish Gaelic: 2

Scottish Gaelic: 0

Manx Gaelic: 0

Unspecified Gaelic: 4

Cornish: 0

Scots: 11

Gypsy/Traveller languages: 1

French: 922

Portuguese: 499

Spanish: 808

Italian: 358

German: 478

Polish: 2611

Slovak: 1244

Czech: 318

Romanian: 284

Lithuanian: 309

Latvian: 184

Hungarian: 291

Bulgarian: 166

Greek: 497

Dutch: 175

Swedish: 95

Danish: 45

Finnish: 41

Estonian: 41

Slovenian: 20

Maltese: 17

Other EU European: 29

Albanian: 194

Serbian/Croatian/Bosnian: 57

Ukranian: 46

Other Eastern European, non-EU: 3

Other northern European, non-EU: 49

Romani: 0

Yiddish: 0

Russian: 511

Turkish: 566

Arabic: 5043

Hebrew: 9

Kurdish: 960

Persian/Farsi: 1017

Pashto: 807

Other West/Central Asian: 97

Urdu: 4222

Hindi: 404

Panjabi: 2743

Pakistani Pahari (With Mirpuri and Potwari): 287

Bengali (With Sylheti and Chatgaya): 1515

Gujarati: 222

Marathi: 87

Telugu: 334

Tamil: 308

Malayalam: 303

Sinhala: 162

Nepalese: 39

Other South Asian Languages: 309

Mandarin Chinese 609

Cantonese Chinese 503

All Other Chinese 4439

Japanese 171

Korean 175

Vietnamese 78

Thai 195

Malay 492

Tagalog/Filipino 277

East Asian Language (All Other) 307

Oceanic/Australian languages: 2

North/South American languages: 1

Caribbean creole: 6

Amharic 201

Tigrinya 439

Somali 2074

Krio 9

Akan 61

Yoruba 91

Igbo 82

Swahili/Kiswahili 136

Luganda 16

Lingala 49

Shona 508

Afrikaans 20

Any Other Nigerian Language 55

West African Language (All Other) 122

African Language (All Other) 483

All Other Languages 132

 

Sign language: 240

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 17:59 ----------

 

The list of languages listed there is just far too many, it would be interesting to know how many people in Sheffield speak each of those languages (e.g. over 50k, over a thousand, under a hundred etc)- and if they do feel they have to provide some translation services, limit it to the most popular 20 or so...

 

So to pick out from the list I posted above:

 

Albanian: 194

Amharic: 201

Arabic: 5043

Bengali: 1515

Bulgarian: 166

Burmese: not listed separately

Cantonese: 503

Chinese: 609 (not sure if different from Mandarin below)

Czech: 318

Dari (Afghan Persian)/Farsi: (counted together in stats): 1017

English: almost everyone

French: 922

Hungarian: 291

Italian: 358

Karen (not listed separately)

Kinyarwanda: (Rwanda) (not listed separately)

Korean: 175

Kurdish: 960

Kurdish Sorani (not listed separately - included above?)

Lingala: 49

Lithuanian: 309

Mandarin: 609 (different to Chinese above?)

Nepali: 39

Oromo (Kenya, not listed separately)

Pashto: 807

Polish: 2611

Portuguese: 499

Punjabi: 2743

Pustu (not listed separately)

Roma: (not listed separately)

Romani Gypsey: 1?

Romanian: 284

Russian: 511

Slovak: 1244

Slovak Roma: (not listed separately)

Somali: 2074

Spanish: 808

Swahili: 136

Thai: 195

Tigrinya: 439

Turkish: 566

Urdu: 4222

Vietnamese: 78

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:07 ----------

 

Top 20 languages,

 

English (English or Welsh if in Wales) 490407

Arabic 5043

All Other Chinese 4439

Urdu 4222

Panjabi 2743

Polish 2611

Somali 2074

Bengali (With Sylheti and Chatgaya) 1515

Slovak 1244

Persian/Farsi 1017

Kurdish 960

French 922

Spanish 808

Pashto 807

Mandarin Chinese 609

Turkish 566

Russian 511

Shona 508

Cantonese Chinese 503

Portuguese 499

 

If you don't count English, Greek sneaks in at the bottom with 497 speakers.

Apparently the council don't translate into Greek.

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:12 ----------

 

So it looks like the target for translation is mainly going to be the people falling into these categories:

 

7,753 people couldn't speak English well.

And 1,479 people couldn't speak English.

 

That's an audience of 9232 people (aged over 3, of course translation/interpretation might be needed for under 3s).

 

If the council don't translate into Greek, maybe that means the Greek speakers all speak English well.

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:15 ----------

 

Rounding the budget up to £700,000, and assuming that the target of translation is those 9232 people (which it might not be) that means expenditure of (rounding up) £76 per each of those people over 3 years, or slightly over £25 a year.

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I just think that's nasty.

 

What about my point that basic English might not be sufficient for some things?

 

In other words, people learning English still might need support.

 

You're assuming "laziness", which sounds like prejudice to me.

 

According to the 2011 Census, there were 490,407 people (over 3) out of a total of 532,164 people living in Sheffield whose main language was English.

 

There were 15,681 people whose main language wasn't English, but who spoke English very well.

 

A further 16,844 people didn't have English as their main language, but spoke English well.

 

7,753 people couldn't speak English well.

 

And 1,479 people couldn't speak English.

 

The census also tells us what people's main languages were.

 

English: 490, 407

Welsh: 67

Irish Gaelic: 2

Scottish Gaelic: 0

Manx Gaelic: 0

Unspecified Gaelic: 4

Cornish: 0

Scots: 11

Gypsy/Traveller languages: 1

French: 922

Portuguese: 499

Spanish: 808

Italian: 358

German: 478

Polish: 2611

Slovak: 1244

Czech: 318

Romanian: 284

Lithuanian: 309

Latvian: 184

Hungarian: 291

Bulgarian: 166

Greek: 497

Dutch: 175

Swedish: 95

Danish: 45

Finnish: 41

Estonian: 41

Slovenian: 20

Maltese: 17

Other EU European: 29

Albanian: 194

Serbian/Croatian/Bosnian: 57

Ukranian: 46

Other Eastern European, non-EU: 3

Other northern European, non-EU: 49

Romani: 0

Yiddish: 0

Russian: 511

Turkish: 566

Arabic: 5043

Hebrew: 9

Kurdish: 960

Persian/Farsi: 1017

Pashto: 807

Other West/Central Asian: 97

Urdu: 4222

Hindi: 404

Panjabi: 2743

Pakistani Pahari (With Mirpuri and Potwari): 287

Bengali (With Sylheti and Chatgaya): 1515

Gujarati: 222

Marathi: 87

Telugu: 334

Tamil: 308

Malayalam: 303

Sinhala: 162

Nepalese: 39

Other South Asian Languages: 309

Mandarin Chinese 609

Cantonese Chinese 503

All Other Chinese 4439

Japanese 171

Korean 175

Vietnamese 78

Thai 195

Malay 492

Tagalog/Filipino 277

East Asian Language (All Other) 307

Oceanic/Australian languages: 2

North/South American languages: 1

Caribbean creole: 6

Amharic 201

Tigrinya 439

Somali 2074

Krio 9

Akan 61

Yoruba 91

Igbo 82

Swahili/Kiswahili 136

Luganda 16

Lingala 49

Shona 508

Afrikaans 20

Any Other Nigerian Language 55

West African Language (All Other) 122

African Language (All Other) 483

All Other Languages 132

 

Sign language: 240

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 17:59 ----------

 

 

So to pick out from the list I posted above:

 

Albanian: 194

Amharic: 201

Arabic: 5043

Bengali: 1515

Bulgarian: 166

Burmese: not listed separately

Cantonese: 503

Chinese: 609 (not sure if different from Mandarin below)

Czech: 318

Dari (Afghan Persian)/Farsi: (counted together in stats): 1017

English: almost everyone

French: 922

Hungarian: 291

Italian: 358

Karen (not listed separately)

Kinyarwanda: (Rwanda) (not listed separately)

Korean: 175

Kurdish: 960

Kurdish Sorani (not listed separately - included above?)

Lingala: 49

Lithuanian: 309

Mandarin: 609 (different to Chinese above?)

Nepali: 39

Oromo (Kenya, not listed separately)

Pashto: 807

Polish: 2611

Portuguese: 499

Punjabi: 2743

Pustu (not listed separately)

Roma: (not listed separately)

Romani Gypsey: 1?

Romanian: 284

Russian: 511

Slovak: 1244

Slovak Roma: (not listed separately)

Somali: 2074

Spanish: 808

Swahili: 136

Thai: 195

Tigrinya: 439

Turkish: 566

Urdu: 4222

Vietnamese: 78

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:07 ----------

 

Top 20 languages,

 

English (English or Welsh if in Wales) 490407

Arabic 5043

All Other Chinese 4439

Urdu 4222

Panjabi 2743

Polish 2611

Somali 2074

Bengali (With Sylheti and Chatgaya) 1515

Slovak 1244

Persian/Farsi 1017

Kurdish 960

French 922

Spanish 808

Pashto 807

Mandarin Chinese 609

Turkish 566

Russian 511

Shona 508

Cantonese Chinese 503

Portuguese 499

 

If you don't count English, Greek sneaks in at the bottom with 497 speakers.

Apparently the council don't translate into Greek.

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:12 ----------

 

So it looks like the target for translation is mainly going to be the people falling into these categories:

 

7,753 people couldn't speak English well.

And 1,479 people couldn't speak English.

 

That's an audience of 9232 people (aged over 3, of course translation/interpretation might be needed for under 3s).

 

If the council don't translate into Greek, maybe that means the Greek speakers all speak English well.

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:15 ----------

 

Rounding the budget up to £700,000, and assuming that the target of translation is those 9232 people (which it might not be) that means expenditure of (rounding up) £76 per each of those people over 3 years, or slightly over £25 a year.

 

not nasty just truthful

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No as a matter of fact I haven't, have you?

 

But I have enough basic French and Spanish to get by to ask

for directions. I don't understand why people visiting a foreign country

think that there is no need to bother to learn a smattering of the language

but think that anyone visiting here should be able to speak English

It is a case of laziness as pointed out in posts above ,and double standards.

Caught in your own argument :D

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Spot on . we shouldnt be spending large sums of money translating for people who cannot be bothered to learn basic English when entering the country.

 

They are not exactly coming here in sunglasses and shorts for a two week holiday. Many of the people SCC are assisting will be refugees who have fled persecution and violence. Do you ever watch the news? When do you expect them to learn English? Between the water-boarding sessions?

 

I used to work with Kurdish refugees in London who had fled Iraq. Several of them had disabilities and visible injuries from torture. Ironically most of them were incredibly keen to learn English and find work and were very grateful for the safe haven this country offered them.

 

What do you and your jack-boots think of that?

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I just think that's nasty.

 

What about my point that basic English might not be sufficient for some things?

 

In other words, people learning English still might need support.

 

You're assuming "laziness", which sounds like prejudice to me.

 

According to the 2011 Census, there were 490,407 people (over 3) out of a total of 532,164 people living in Sheffield whose main language was English.

 

There were 15,681 people whose main language wasn't English, but who spoke English very well.

 

A further 16,844 people didn't have English as their main language, but spoke English well.

 

7,753 people couldn't speak English well.

 

And 1,479 people couldn't speak English.

 

The census also tells us what people's main languages were.

 

English: 490, 407

Welsh: 67

Irish Gaelic: 2

Scottish Gaelic: 0

Manx Gaelic: 0

Unspecified Gaelic: 4

Cornish: 0

Scots: 11

Gypsy/Traveller languages: 1

French: 922

Portuguese: 499

Spanish: 808

Italian: 358

German: 478

Polish: 2611

Slovak: 1244

Czech: 318

Romanian: 284

Lithuanian: 309

Latvian: 184

Hungarian: 291

Bulgarian: 166

Greek: 497

Dutch: 175

Swedish: 95

Danish: 45

Finnish: 41

Estonian: 41

Slovenian: 20

Maltese: 17

Other EU European: 29

Albanian: 194

Serbian/Croatian/Bosnian: 57

Ukranian: 46

Other Eastern European, non-EU: 3

Other northern European, non-EU: 49

Romani: 0

Yiddish: 0

Russian: 511

Turkish: 566

Arabic: 5043

Hebrew: 9

Kurdish: 960

Persian/Farsi: 1017

Pashto: 807

Other West/Central Asian: 97

Urdu: 4222

Hindi: 404

Panjabi: 2743

Pakistani Pahari (With Mirpuri and Potwari): 287

Bengali (With Sylheti and Chatgaya): 1515

Gujarati: 222

Marathi: 87

Telugu: 334

Tamil: 308

Malayalam: 303

Sinhala: 162

Nepalese: 39

Other South Asian Languages: 309

Mandarin Chinese 609

Cantonese Chinese 503

All Other Chinese 4439

Japanese 171

Korean 175

Vietnamese 78

Thai 195

Malay 492

Tagalog/Filipino 277

East Asian Language (All Other) 307

Oceanic/Australian languages: 2

North/South American languages: 1

Caribbean creole: 6

Amharic 201

Tigrinya 439

Somali 2074

Krio 9

Akan 61

Yoruba 91

Igbo 82

Swahili/Kiswahili 136

Luganda 16

Lingala 49

Shona 508

Afrikaans 20

Any Other Nigerian Language 55

West African Language (All Other) 122

African Language (All Other) 483

All Other Languages 132

 

Sign language: 240

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 17:59 ----------

 

 

So to pick out from the list I posted above:

 

Albanian: 194

Amharic: 201

Arabic: 5043

Bengali: 1515

Bulgarian: 166

Burmese: not listed separately

Cantonese: 503

Chinese: 609 (not sure if different from Mandarin below)

Czech: 318

Dari (Afghan Persian)/Farsi: (counted together in stats): 1017

English: almost everyone

French: 922

Hungarian: 291

Italian: 358

Karen (not listed separately)

Kinyarwanda: (Rwanda) (not listed separately)

Korean: 175

Kurdish: 960

Kurdish Sorani (not listed separately - included above?)

Lingala: 49

Lithuanian: 309

Mandarin: 609 (different to Chinese above?)

Nepali: 39

Oromo (Kenya, not listed separately)

Pashto: 807

Polish: 2611

Portuguese: 499

Punjabi: 2743

Pustu (not listed separately)

Roma: (not listed separately)

Romani Gypsey: 1?

Romanian: 284

Russian: 511

Slovak: 1244

Slovak Roma: (not listed separately)

Somali: 2074

Spanish: 808

Swahili: 136

Thai: 195

Tigrinya: 439

Turkish: 566

Urdu: 4222

Vietnamese: 78

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:07 ----------

 

Top 20 languages,

 

English (English or Welsh if in Wales) 490407

Arabic 5043

All Other Chinese 4439

Urdu 4222

Panjabi 2743

Polish 2611

Somali 2074

Bengali (With Sylheti and Chatgaya) 1515

Slovak 1244

Persian/Farsi 1017

Kurdish 960

French 922

Spanish 808

Pashto 807

Mandarin Chinese 609

Turkish 566

Russian 511

Shona 508

Cantonese Chinese 503

Portuguese 499

 

If you don't count English, Greek sneaks in at the bottom with 497 speakers.

Apparently the council don't translate into Greek.

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:12 ----------

 

So it looks like the target for translation is mainly going to be the people falling into these categories:

 

7,753 people couldn't speak English well.

And 1,479 people couldn't speak English.

 

That's an audience of 9232 people (aged over 3, of course translation/interpretation might be needed for under 3s).

 

If the council don't translate into Greek, maybe that means the Greek speakers all speak English well.

 

---------- Post added 22-02-2015 at 18:15 ----------

 

Rounding the budget up to £700,000, and assuming that the target of translation is those 9232 people (which it might not be) that means expenditure of (rounding up) £76 per each of those people over 3 years, or slightly over £25 a year.

 

11 Scot speakers. What's that then?:huh:

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we arnt talking about people visiting for holidays, the money is being wasted on people who come to live here and are too lazy to learn the language of the country they are living in.

 

Like you are too lazy to think beyond your initial reactionary thought.

 

What expertise do you have to make your statement. It's all guesses.

 

For example, I might think the rumours about people from Penistone and sheep are true. But I wouldn't state it without doing a bit of field observation first.

 

Don't we give droves of old codgers in the House of Lords £300 a day to snooze away of the plush leather. Now that is a shocking waste of money compared to helping someone understand a service or a legal notification.

 

Bahhh...

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11 Scot speakers. What's that then?:huh:

 

You never come across Scottish Gaelic? When I worked on South Usit I spent some time living with a family, the children could only speak Gaelic, their parents had left the island and worked on the mainland, England and overseas only returning to take over the croft when their own Gaelic speaking parents became to old to run it alone. Over breakfast each morning I would attempt to learn the language, 45 years later I can't remember very much apart from Madainn mhath (good morning).

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Sorry but even in the context of the so called "blackhole" in the council's budget even cancelling these services entirely would achieve nothing but it would mean that people whose first language is not English would not understand the services provided and potentially tie up frontline staff with these misunderstandings. You may find that these services are fully costed, to assist already stretched frontline staff.

 

They should make a start by cancelling those services and then continue cutting back on other waste.

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I moved to Spain for work over twenty years ago and had a mountain of paperwork to complete, all in spanish. As they were not translated into english I had to pay a translator to do this for me. I had to learn the language otherwise life would have been difficult. Now there are many different nationalities in Spain and the town halls still do not offer their paperwork in any other language but spanish. Why should they? The officials say,"you are in Spain, you should speak spanish". I agree with them, but that is my opinion.

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I moved to Spain for work over twenty years ago and had a mountain of paperwork to complete, all in spanish. As they were not translated into english I had to pay a translator to do this for me. I had to learn the language otherwise life would have been difficult. Now there are many different nationalities in Spain and the town halls still do not offer their paperwork in any other language but spanish. Why should they? The officials say,"you are in Spain, you should speak spanish". I agree with them, but that is my opinion.

I bet your glad you moved there and don't have to put up with all the pc rubbish us brits have to contend with now :hihi:

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