Labour - Limit dole to 2 years

[tzijlstra 11]

I seem to recall it was you who was lecturing me about my supposed sense of entitlement?

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 11:51 ----------

 

When I reversed the question you couldnt answer.

 

I've answered every single question you've asked of me, and yes, you do have a sense of entitlement if you would refuse to work for minimum wage.

[ubermaus 10]

I guess when you finish the PhD its down the jobcentre looking for min wage jobs is it?

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 11:53 ----------

 

I've answered every single question you've asked of me, and yes, you do have a sense of entitlement if you would refuse to work for minimum wage.

 

Except the one that matters. Would you now work for NMW?

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 11:57 ----------

 

They shouldn't. If you need a job, you'll take whatever you can get if you need the money to keep a roof over your head or food on the table. Beggars can't be choosers.

 

If people are in a position where they can turn work down when it is available safe in the knowledge that they are always going to get a hand out, then they have little incentive for looking for work.

 

I don't enjoy the thought of the wedge I give to the taxman each month funding people who deliberately don't want a job any more than I like the idea of it being used to buy arms or be frittered in a collapsed IT project.

 

Me neither. I dont think people should aim for a life on benefits funded by taxpayers. But then again i dont think the majority do.

[tzijlstra 11]

I guess when you finish the PhD its down the jobcentre looking for min wage jobs is it?

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 11:53 ----------

 

 

Except the one that matters. Would you now work for NMW?

 

Yes, of course I would, if I didn't have options. I already stated that I'd much rather work for a living than scrape the quickly emptying state coffers for a hand-out and have done so in the past. But since those hard times I have created options, I've worked bloody hard all my life to have them and I am making most of my opportunities.

 

You on the other hand have stated that if you had to choose between working for NMW and holding your hand up, you'd hold your hand up. So let me make it clear: I don't like paying into the state coffers so people like you have the option to stay at home and get yourself depressed and miserable and ending up costing society a multiple of what you would if you were working.

 

I DON'T mind paying into the state coffers so everybody has access to education, from kids to pensioners, with the aim of allowing people to develop themselves to a position of self-sustainability.

 

That is the difference between a liberal and a socialist.

[ubermaus 10]

Yes, of course I would, if I didn't have options. I already stated that I'd much rather work for a living than scrape the quickly emptying state coffers for a hand-out and have done so in the past. But since those hard times I have created options, I've worked bloody hard all my life to have them and I am making most of my opportunities.

 

You on the other hand have stated that if you had to choose between working for NMW and holding your hand up, you'd hold your hand up. So let me make it clear: I don't like paying into the state coffers so people like you have the option to stay at home and get yourself depressed and miserable and ending up costing society a multiple of what you would if you were working.

 

I DON'T mind paying into the state coffers so everybody has access to education, from kids to pensioners, with the aim of allowing people to develop themselves to a position of self-sustainability.

 

That is the difference between a liberal and a socialist.

 

This another one of your theoretical scenarios is it.

Like the one where you said i was sat at home on a channel 4 programme while you were out working and paying taxes. ROFL.

[tzijlstra 11]

This another one of your theoretical scenarios is it.

Like the one where you said i was sat at home on a channel 4 programme while you were out working and paying taxes. ROFL.

 

Arguing with you is a bit like arguing with a twelve year old, they know they have to argue, but don't quite know how to do it yet.

[Cyclone 10]

For me it isnt a choice between working or not. Its about min wage versus living wage.

As it stands however their is a welfare and benefits system in place for people working or not, and rightly so.

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 10:09 ----------

 

 

Yes everyone has to work or be in school. However, the idea of funneling people into jobs i dont agree with.

 

Given that minimum wage is what the law guarantees as a minimum, if you choose not to work for it, and don't have any other work, then the state should not support you.

[Dardandec 32]

For me it isnt a choice between working or not. Its about min wage versus living wage.

 

That is the typical attitude of a benefits worker, they will think of every reason possible to justify why they don't work and claim benefits instead.

 

They might be able to fool the government, but they don't fool me.

[ubermaus 10]

Given that minimum wage is what the law guarantees as a minimum, if you choose not to work for it, and don't have any other work, then the state should not support you.

 

The state supports 5.2 million+.

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 13:40 ----------

 

Arguing with you is a bit like arguing with a twelve year old, they know they have to argue, but don't quite know how to do it yet.

 

My argument is based on fact not fantasy. Maybe thats why you find it difficult.

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 13:42 ----------

 

Dardendec, whats a 'benefits worker'? I kind of understand your point otherwise. Although the Labour manifesto states they will raise NMW to NLW so its likely to happen in next 5 years.

Edited February 14, 2015 by ubermaus

[Dardandec 32]

Dardendec, whats a 'benefits worker'? I kind of understand your point otherwise.

 

A benefits worker is someone who chooses to be on benefits instead of working.

[tzijlstra 11]

My argument is based on fact not fantasy. Maybe thats why you find it difficult.

 

Sorry, what fact? You mean it is based on your opinion surely. But amuse me, show me where you introduced facts in this thread.

[ubermaus 10]

A benefits worker is someone who chooses to be on benefits instead of working.

 

Oh right. Well that clears it up.

 

---------- Post added 14-02-2015 at 14:09 ----------

 

Sorry, what fact? You mean it is based on your opinion surely. But amuse me, show me where you introduced facts in this thread.

 

What like 5.2 million working age claiming benefits, may 2014, govt statistics? This entire thread is littered with facts.

 

Or should i just do what you do and post links to jobsites and say look there are loads of uk jobs!

[MikeDaMouse 10]

Limit the Dole to 2 years??? they should limit it to 2 months. The dole is a joke anyone who is wanting to work will find employment fast, even if its MW .

 

Ive tried signing on once in my life when I was 17 and I didn't qualified for the dole at the time because of how much my mum and dad were earning. This was probably the best thing that happened to me.

I managed to get a MW job within a 1 week of trying and was there for abit before getting back on my feet.

 

I have a lot of mates on the other hand that have been on the dole for years, and probably will be for the rest of there life's. They haven't got any real work experience or ethics so even if they do get a job im pretty sure that they wont last ( I have got a couple of them jobs at previous places of work and they lasted about a month). Im sure most of them are depressed and feel down most of the time because they haven't got a job.

 

 

I also think that anyone who is on the dole should earn it... Having to help the Police, Fire service, Hospital, council, local businesses or something just to give them some sort feeling that they have earn there dosh instead of getting it for nothing.