Audio (amps and speakers and things)

[Cyclone 10]

I shall reply to all these interesting posts when I've got to work.

[L00b 441]

Yes I did. Were they yours?

It's too rare a pair of items, and a pairing, to be a coincidence (whereby the winking smiley).

 

BTW, reminds me: I just found the S30's original manual (it's pretty much mint) when I recently redecorated my home office. If you want it for completion's sake, freebie, you to pick up in S9 (daytime, weekdays) or S81 (all other times)

 

...you didn't pick up one of the KEF 2005 sets from Worksop as well, did you?

Edited May 21, 2014 by L00b

[Cyclone 10]

Nice to see that other people do spend some time/money/effort to get a decent sound system, without just going down the route of £,£££'s, which I'm sure works well, but I don't think I could appreciate enough.

 

I looked at the single stereo speaker for the bathroom, but the pair I got were on offer and so were actually cheaper than the single.

L00b - you hadn't commented at that point, so I wasn't accusing you of having an expensive phone

 

I had a play about with the two DLNA receivers that I've bought last night, one of them doesn't seem to auto advance the track, which is annoying, so I guess the other one will be the one I use.

 

Might try a different app to drive them though, I use bubbleUp at the moment, paid for, or the built in audio webapp on my synology nas, but it's worth experimenting.

 

Speakers should be delivered tomorrow, and probably the amp as well. Must pick up some speaker cable.

I won't be getting silver plated nonsense, or oxygen free copper, or any other rubbish. Just some normal speaker cable, probably from maplin, unless someone can recommend anywhere better that's local to the Wadsley/Hillsborough area?

 

House lighting, what system have you used to do that Steroc?

 

One day I'll do a self build, and it'll have all this stuff, home automation, cabled networking, speakers and speaker points, HVAC, plug sockets, all remotely controllable.

 

---------- Post added 21-05-2014 at 09:05 ----------

 

Edit - I tried various bluetooth solutions, but I really don't like it. The range is atrocious, the quality is poor and even someone walking between the transmitter/receiver can cause a drop out.

[L00b 441]

Must pick up some speaker cable.

I won't be getting silver plated nonsense, or oxygen free copper, or any other rubbish. Just some normal speaker cable, probably from maplin, unless someone can recommend anywhere better that's local to the Wadsley/Hillsborough area?

RicherSounds often have very good cabling for next-to-nothing as part of their sales promotions (which seem to be semi-permanent) and I've let myself be told that they'll do deals on end-of-reels (few meters left on retail holder).

 

I got about 40 meters of QED "silver plated OFC nonsense" () ultra-thin cabling for under £2/meter (IIRC - I know bill was under £80), about 6 months ago when I was re-cabling the lounge.

 

Certainly a noticeable difference compared to the bog-standard cabling I'd been using until then (with the same Marantz amp and Jamo speakers) and, as said, I'm no audiophile (and that speaker set is no audiophile stuff either).

Edit - I tried various bluetooth solutions, but I really don't like it. The range is atrocious, the quality is poor and even someone walking between the transmitter/receiver can cause a drop out.

I use that. Snagged it complete/mint-in-box on eBay a few months ago for around £30-odd. The hype is well deserved.

 

No audio difference between stereo cable and BT (tried both with same source and same amp/speakers), effective (tested) range approx. 15 meters including outside walls and triple glazing in-between.

 

No interruptions, artefacts, signal/connection drop - switch amp on, pair iPod with QED, set iPod to play, forget about it for hours on end.

 

It's actually a problem when you don't (later on) remember where did you put the iPod down, so keep that amp remote handy

 

I don't have QED shares, and I'm on the snipe for a second unit for my setup in France

Edited May 21, 2014 by L00b

[Cyclone 10]

I can imagine that there would be a difference between cheap, thin, cable and decent quality cable, but when you start talking about silver plating and oxygen free, it's all just marketing gimmic IMO.

 

Interesting on the bluetooth, I've tried a few, I actually have 2 Belkin bluetooth receivers, but I don't find them to be reliable beyond a few metres, although that's only been tested with Galaxy S3s and S4s, so it could even be the phone BT implementation that is at fault.

[L00b 441]

I can imagine that there would be a difference between cheap, thin, cable and decent quality cable, but when you start talking about silver plating and oxygen free, it's all just marketing gimmic IMO.

Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't pay extra for it...but when it's given away at the price of bog standard cable (as it was), it would be a fool who goes to look the gift horse in the mouth

Interesting on the bluetooth, I've tried a few, I actually have 2 Belkin bluetooth receivers, but I don't find them to be reliable beyond a few metres, although that's only been tested with Galaxy S3s and S4s, so it could even be the phone BT implementation that is at fault.

I've never found anything made by Belkin to be any good/fit for purpose. In my eyes and experience, they're like the ALBA of small electronics and adapters, and I actively avoid Belkin-branded widgets. Call it brand snobbism if you wish, but I simply go by the few Belkin-branded items I've owned and used over time, and invariably had to replace or substitute in very short order. If I want cheap, I'll buy no-brand/China direct via e.g. DealExtreme, and I know what I'm getting. If I want good, I'll do my research and buy best in class (currently or in times gone by) or 2nd/3rd best, no lower. Matter of opinion of course. Edited May 21, 2014 by L00b

[geared 313]

I used Cat5 network cable as Audio cable for a long while, it always sounded pretty good IMO.

[dosxuk 10]

For speaker cabling, there's nothing wrong with normal mains flex, just make sure it's sufficiently sized.

 

I used Cat5 network cable as Audio cable for a long while, it always sounded pretty good IMO.

 

In what way, and at what signal level? I'd never want to use Cat5 as speaker cable, I'd be afraid of it melting. And for unbalanced audio links, it's a recipie for hums and buzzes to get into your system. But for balanced lines, you can literally go for miles with virtually no interference.

[geared 313]

Connecting the Amp to the speakers, performed faultlessly for years.

No hums or buzzing, certainly no melting or fires.

[steroc 10]

It's too rare a pair of items, and a pairing, to be a coincidence (whereby the winking smiley).

 

BTW, reminds me: I just found the S30's original manual (it's pretty much mint) when I recently redecorated my home office. If you want it for completion's sake, freebie, you to pick up in S9 (daytime, weekdays) or S81 (all other times)

 

...you didn't pick up one of the KEF 2005 sets from Worksop as well, did you?

Just started working in S9 myself this morning but don't know if I can escape during the day for a bit to pick it up with it being a new job, maybe when I'm a bit more settled.

One set of the Kef Eggs was picked up from Maltby I think (5 Kef 2001.3s and the Kube 2 Sub, unused still sealed in box on a buy it now for £120, couldn't turn it down), the other set were delivered from Liverpool I think,

 

House lighting, what system have you used to do that Steroc?

I'm using the LighwaveRF system. Reasonably priced and had it running trouble free for about 4 years now. Controlling it using the Roomie iOS app which also controls all my AV gear too. The Roomie app was quite expensive to get set up how I liked. But now I can press one button that will switch the TV on, Blueray on, switch TV to correct channel, turn Amp on to correct source, turn TV sound down to 0, switch main lights off and lamps on to a pre determined brightness. Still have to get up to put the Blueray in though ☹.

I tried various bluetooth solutions, but I really don't like it. The range is atrocious, the quality is poor and even someone walking between the transmitter/receiver can cause a drop out.

I got a Xantech Bluetooth Receiver for £20 off eBay which like the one L00b mentions sounds exactly the same as connected direct and has a 20m+ range. More than happy with it.

 

---------- Post added 21-05-2014 at 21:26 ----------

 

By the way all my cables and interconnects are as cheap as I can get away with. If it doesn't work satisfactory I will replace it with a better made cheap one. Only ever had two cables fail on me. One was a 15m Scart lead which I kind of expected not to work but was dirt cheap so took the risk. Stripped the cable down and it was completely unsheilded and thinner than cat5. Swapped that for a cheap shielded triple RCA cable of a decent CSA and had no problems. The other was a 5m HDMI which worked intermitantly with my PS3, again too thin a cable was a big factor. Swapped that over to the cable box which is 1080i not 1080p and it's worked flawlessly on that so wasn't wasted. All my speaker cable is cheap stuff but is 2.5mm2 CSA (which way bigger than necessary) so even if it is a lower grade Chinese copper it'll still have less resistance than expensive thinner cables. I firm believer that the placebo effect pays a big part when people claim that more expensive cables make a difference to the sound when trying similar sized CSAs of cables. Your brain is a very powerful thing that can convince you something is what it's not. Take a projector for example. I was in a pub a few weeks ago and it was very light. The projector screen came down and it was quite visibly white (obviously) yet when the projector was switched on I could suddenly see and clearly make out the colour black in the projected pictures. How is this possible by shining a bright light onto a white screen in near daylight.

Edited May 21, 2014 by steroc

[Cyclone 10]

All about contrasts and comparisons isn't it, that's the way the eye works. It's also why photographers white balance a camera, so it actually looks white later on in a photo and doesn't have a cast.

 

Audio is more complicated, in that the comparisons are less clear cut. But I suspect you're right. It would be interesting to do some blind testing and see if people who claim to be able to tell the difference, can do so when they don't know which cable is being used.

[anywebsite 10]

All about contrasts and comparisons isn't it, that's the way the eye works. It's also why photographers white balance a camera, so it actually looks white later on in a photo and doesn't have a cast.

 

Audio is more complicated, in that the comparisons are less clear cut. But I suspect you're right. It would be interesting to do some blind testing and see if people who claim to be able to tell the difference, can do so when they don't know which cable is being used.

 

It's been done, they can't. The speakers will make much more difference to the sound than the cables. The way the ear works is much simpler than the eye, human hearing is more limited. In blind tests I don't think anybody has been able to tell 256Kb/s mp3 from anything better even on the best equipment & the type of wire makes no audible difference whatsoever, unless it's really poor wire. If it's very thin wire it'll have a high resistance, could cause a loss of volume & some other frequencies that you might possibly hear, but it'd have to be some terrible wire or a long run of wire. For longer runs of wire (over about 15m) you'll need slightly better quality wire.

 

Do you think they spend hundreds on individual short audio cables in professional recording studios?

 

I've even seen 'audiophile' power cables, I'm not sure that most of that stuff isn't just a joke.

 

When it comes to digital cables it's getting ridiculous.

 

Gold plated connectors will mean they last a little longer, might not need to replace the connectors after 30 years & it's basically free they put such a thin layer of gold on. You're probably not going to notice an audio difference unless you choose something really unsuited to speaker wire. Main differences are just build quality, how long it'll last, etc, but that only goes up to a point just above the absolute cheapest cables.

 

I've not had a problem with a belkin cable yet, but I wouldn't pay any extra over a generic cable & I wouldn't trust the brand with anything more complex than putting some connectors on a wire. Stay well away from anything Belkin branded with any active parts.

Edited May 22, 2014 by anywebsite