The Labour Party. All discussion here please

[Ridgewalk 101]

Looks like the Labour party has some soul searching to do. Has it run it's historical course as happened to the Whigs/Liberal party, are we all "embourgeoised" now, does it just manage capitalism, is it there just to gain power, has its constituency (industrial working class) disappeared ?

 

Incidentally what do people think the Conservative party is for and who do they represent ?

[Bigthumb 10]

What Labour should focus on first is wrestling Scotland back from the SNP.

 

I like that idea. Promising Scotland enough to bribe them to vote Labour would lose them massive support from the English who would get the bill.

[annbaker 10]

It'll be around but what shape it'll be in is anybody's guess. If it could make inroads in Scotland it might stand more of a chance, but every leadership candidate is what many Scots would call a 'red Tory'. Not looking good at all.

 

The only chance is for the SNP to really, really mess things up, but the SNP are too slick and organised for that.

 

Oh I think they'll trip themselves up and embarass themselves. Slick? No Organised ? No.

 

---------- Post added 21-06-2015 at 21:49 ----------

 

Yes the SNP won 56 seats but those 56 seats were 35% of the electorate. Quite a few don't want them. There was a bit of an envitability they'd win all those seats following the referendum result. Wasn't a total surprise and of course Gordon Brown stepping in to save Cameron's bacon and keep the Union intact led to accusations of Red Tories.

 

I am a Labour Party member and I am not sure at the moment who I'm going to vote for in the leadership. I have varying degrees of doubts about all of them sadly. Kendall is a no-no for me but not convinced by Cooper either so that's the girls out. Big decision

[Jeffrey Shaw 90]

The best thing they can do is give the Scottish Labour party full autonomy so they can take on the SNP without the dead hand of central office holding them back.

Yes. As far as anyone can see, SNP voters did not vote for SNP policies but- rather- just for the idea of 'Scotland'. To compete, other parties need to create 'Scotland-only' versions of themselves.

Cf in Germany: the CDU does not operate in Bavaria but its associate the CSU does.

[annbaker 10]

Yes. As far as anyone can see, SNP voters did not vote for SNP policies but- rather- just for the idea of 'Scotland'. To compete, other parties need to create 'Scotland-only' versions of themselves.

Cf in Germany: the CDU does not operate in Bavaria but its associate the CSU does.

 

To be fair quite a few did vote for the policies but sadly ,some of my countrymen being a bit p'd off the referendum didn't go their way decided to become cyber bullies. There were real threats of all sorts of nasty things if they didn't vote SNP. Some honestly wanted change and didn't see Labour as being able to deliver it. My mum and my bro got the 20 year old as her MP and not happy campers at all.

 

I live down here now but never ever would I consider voting for them as the majority are led by the nose and quite frankly behave like they think they're Rob Roy or William Wallace. Always have done and always will do.

 

---------- Post added 21-06-2015 at 23:23 ----------

 

You just have to look at their disgraceful behaviour towards Charles Kennedy. That's the SNP I know and grew up with. Total nasty nasty vindictive numpties

[Jeffrey Shaw 90]

I live down here now but never ever would I consider voting for them as the majority are led by the nose and quite frankly behave like they think they're Rob Roy or William Wallace. Always have done and always will do.

Yet they used to vote Labour, fairly consistently- until May 2015!

[annbaker 10]

Give them FFA cos they'll mess it up. They can't handle the budget they have now but means we'd all end up bailing them out which rather takes us back full circle to where the Union was created.

 

---------- Post added 21-06-2015 at 23:26 ----------

 

Yet they used to vote Labour, fairly consistently- until May 2015!

 

Not all but yes most. It was the referendum that changed things. Gordon Brown saved the Union for the Tories and Labour got the blame. It wasn;t nice to be in Glasgow at that time.

 

---------- Post added 21-06-2015 at 23:27 ----------

 

I am proud to be a Scot but I am not proud but ashamed indeed of the way some of them behave.

 

---------- Post added 21-06-2015 at 23:30 ----------

 

I have a friend who lives in Inverclyde. She's a Scot and her hubby is English. referendum wise he voted Yes and she voted No. The cyber nazis threatened her and her family just because she had an English husband. They have two wee ones and they were terrified in their own house. Police didn't seem bothered. That's not an isolated incident and even now they get abuse, cars graffitied by these people who have watched Braveheart too many times

 

---------- Post added 21-06-2015 at 23:41 ----------

 

This sums up really what the average No voter feels

 

xxxx xxxxxx make no mistake, I campaigned vigorously to remain in the United Kingdom , however we as unionists have lost ground.. The SNP knew that they could never command enough votes for independence , So the Yes campaign was created. Greens etc, I have lived in central Scotland for about 50 years, the hatred and division created by the Yes campaign has caused damage that will take decades to repair.

 

He's not far wrong there sad to say

[Bigthumb 10]

Gordon Brown saved the Union for the Tories and Labour got the blame.

 

That's pretty funny. The union was saved because the UK government gave the Scots another load of concessions to buy them off. I doubt Scots actually want to be independent, but like spoiled children they soon learn that if you cry loud enough the parent will usually give you another sweetie.

 

What Gordon Brown did was persuade lots of English voters not to vote Labour.

[Ridgewalk 101]

Some. And you don't have to be a member to vote for the new leader, it's £3 per vote.

 

 

"some" Hardly any then.

[Bigthumb 10]

Some. And you don't have to be a member to vote for the new leader, it's £3 per vote.

 

 

I can see history about to repeat itself.

 

http://www.sunnation.co.uk/unions-sign-up-thousands-to-boost-andy-burnhams-campaign-for-labour-leader/

 

Union chiefs have rounded up thousands of members and persuaded them to take part in the Labour leadership contest in a huge boost for Andy Burnham.

 

On the day the nominations close to take over from Ed Miliband, SunNation can reveal Unite and the GMB have been using phone banks to sign their members up as so-called “affiliates” – giving them a vote in the crunch contest.

 

Due to rule changes in how Labour chooses its leader, ironically brought in to try and water down union influence, they will have the same influence as full party members.

 

Sources have told SunNation the recruitment drive “is going very well”, with around 20,000 believed to have been signed up so far.

 

With three months of the leadership election still to run, the number of union members who could end up with a vote is set to run into six figures.

Edited June 22, 2015 by Bigthumb

[Flanker7 20]

 

[/color] ...................................................................Wasn't a total surprise and of course Gordon Brown stepping in to save Cameron's bacon and keep the Union intact led to accusations of Red Tories...................

 

IMO In the Independence Referendum Gordon Brown appeared on the same platform as the Tories and sealed the deal for the SNP landslide later in the General Election. Then in the General Election Cameron bad mouthed the SNP and confirmed the SNP's portrayal of those south of the border (English) the fruits of which will be harvested by the UK? for years to come.

 

The great sadness is that many people believed Cameron and voted for the Tories to keep the Union. The actual effect will be the opposite.

Edited June 22, 2015 by Flanker7

[Bigthumb 10]

 

The great sadness is that many people believed Cameron and voted for the Tories to keep the Union. The actual effect will be the opposite.

 

Or most people voted Tory because they didn't want A Labour Government and certainly didn't want Miliband as Prime Minister. Don't assume that you are the only person capable of independent thought. People who think that are actually usually rather dim.