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The Labour Party. All discussion here please

Vaati

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Unabashed Corbyn supporter here. I would like to share a quote from Steve Hilton, former director of strategy for David Cameron:

"The establishment scratches its head: “How could …?” Well, let’s just check what the “serious” people have done for us lately: economic disaster with rewards for those who caused it and barely a gain for anyone else; foreign policy disaster with cack-handed interventions bringing instability and chaos; social disaster with poverty festering, family life foundering and inequality growing. If that’s what being “serious” gets you, no wonder people prefer the joker".

 

He also goes on to say:

 

'Jeremy Corbyn’s answers may be wrong, but many of his questions are right. Instead of patronising his supporters, the insular ruling elite and their allies in big business and big finance should realise they are the cause of Corbyn. I doubt that Corbyn-led Labour will introduce the more human world I want to see: markets made more competitive; democracy made more local; families boosted as the bedrock of society. But you never know …'

 

Nice bit of sitting on the fence Mr. Hilton.

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Apparently the majority of people that voted for Corbyn were under 30. No wonder these are the people who have had to pay for their university fees at £9k a year, leave with £30k -£40k debts, can't get housing benefit for a one bedroom flat if under 35. Tories now want to stop all HB for under 25s next year, and will never afford to buy a home due to rents costing more than mortgages and therefore unable to save for a deposit. Yet their rent can pay for their landlord's mortgage. What a future for the next generation.

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That wasn't my point. My point was Corbyn's policies coming straight from the 1983 manifesto, to which you said they were nothing of the sort. They are. The man is a political dinosaur.

 

Like it or not the policies are textbook social democratic and deployed effectively in other European countries, notably Germany.

 

Maybe we got it wrong in the 80s after all ;)

 

---------- Post added 13-09-2015 at 20:06 ----------

 

He also goes on to say:

 

'Jeremy Corbyn’s answers may be wrong, but many of his questions are right. Instead of patronising his supporters, the insular ruling elite and their allies in big business and big finance should realise they are the cause of Corbyn. I doubt that Corbyn-led Labour will introduce the more human world I want to see: markets made more competitive; democracy made more local; families boosted as the bedrock of society. But you never know …'

 

Nice bit of sitting on the fence Mr. Hilton.

 

Sitting on the fence? By that you mean he's resisted the temptation to become hysterical over nowt?

 

What is really going on here. If Corbyn is such a no-hoper why all the attacks?

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Apparently the majority of people that voted for Corbyn were under 30. No wonder these are the people who have had to pay for their university fees at £9k a year, leave with £30k -£40k debts, can't get housing benefit for a one bedroom flat if under 35. Tories now want to stop all HB for under 25s next year, and will never afford to buy a home due to rents costing more than mortgages and therefore unable to save for a deposit. Yet their rent can pay for their landlord's mortgage. What a future for the next generation.

 

but weren't tuition a labour idea in the first place. i tell you, i would really be chocked off if i'd just done a university degree and emerged with £30k owing in tuition fees only to find that tuition fees were to abolished and as well as my own fees, i would have to contribute extra tax to pay everyone else's as well.

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Like it or not the policies are textbook social democratic and deployed effectively in other European countries, notably Germany.

 

Maybe we got it wrong in the 80s after all ;)

 

---------- Post added 13-09-2015 at 20:06 ----------

 

 

Sitting on the fence? By that you mean he's resisted the temptation to become hysterical over nowt?

 

What is really going on here. If Corbyn is such a no-hoper why all the attacks?

Because he is charismatic and good at convincing the naïve. His policies need to be shown up for what they are. We need to address them. Otherwise more naïve people will believe them.

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but weren't tuition a labour idea in the first place. i tell you, i would really be chocked off if i'd just done a university degree and emerged with £30k owing in tuition fees only to find that tuition fees were to abolished and as well as my own fees, i would have to contribute extra tax to pay everyone else's as well.

 

Yes it was a policy of New Labour. Corbyn opposed it.

 

Odd that the Blairites don't want to support Corbyn. Now perhaps they know how old Labour members felt when Blair changed the Labour Party to New Labour.

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Apparently the majority of people that voted for Corbyn were under 30. No wonder these are the people who have had to pay for their university fees at £9k a year, leave with £30k -£40k debts, can't get housing benefit for a one bedroom flat if under 35. Tories now want to stop all HB for under 25s next year, and will never afford to buy a home due to rents costing more than mortgages and therefore unable to save for a deposit. Yet their rent can pay for their landlord's mortgage. What a future for the next generation.

 

These "young people" expecting life to be handed to them on a plate. Yes, well done vote for Corbyn. Let the highest earners and highest contributors to the public purse be taxed to hell and driven out.

 

Lets develop a society who go through mandatory free education to 16, then optional free college education to 18, then the newly reformed free university education (with reintroduced top up grants for living expenses), no student loan to pay back, oh then of course you can drift as long as you want jobless with generous benefits, get social housing and housing benefit for all ages....

 

..... on it goes.

 

Until of course one factor. Who is paying for all this. Who is actually putting into the system.

 

High earners - NOPE - you have driven all those away

 

Middle earners - NOPE - they have given up trying. What's the point if they are just going to be taxed to support those who cannot be bothered.

 

Low earners - NOPE - because they are on a minimum wage and don't pay tax.

 

So... Oops purse has run dry. Oops there is no money left. Better hand it back to those "nasty" tories to sort it all out again.

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These "young people" expecting life to be handed to them on a plate. Yes, well done vote for Corbyn. Let the highest earners and highest contributors to the public purse be taxed to hell and driven out.

 

Lets develop a society who go through mandatory free education to 16, then optional free college education to 18, then the newly reformed free university education (with reintroduced top up grants for living expenses), no student loan to pay back, oh then of course you can drift as long as you want jobless with generous benefits, get social housing and housing benefit for all ages....

 

..... on it goes.

 

Until of course one factor. Who is paying for all this. Who is actually putting into the system.

 

High earners - NOPE - you have driven all those away

 

Middle earners - NOPE - they have given up trying. What's the point if they are just going to be taxed to support those who cannot be bothered.

 

Low earners - NOPE - because they are on a minimum wage and don't pay tax.

 

So... Oops purse has run dry. Oops there is no money left. Better hand it back to those "nasty" tories to sort it all out again.

 

youre talking drivel. Its precisely the fear based rhetoric weve been getting from parts of the press.

 

No fact.

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Because he is charismatic and good at convincing the naïve. His policies need to be shown up for what they are. We need to address them. Otherwise more naïve people will believe them.

 

Address them then. Properly. Show them up. Tell us what is wrong.

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These "young people" expecting life to be handed to them on a plate. Yes, well done vote for Corbyn. Let the highest earners and highest contributors to the public purse be taxed to hell and driven out.

 

Lets develop a society who go through mandatory free education to 16, then optional free college education to 18, then the newly reformed free university education (with reintroduced top up grants for living expenses), no student loan to pay back, oh then of course you can drift as long as you want jobless with generous benefits, get social housing and housing benefit for all ages....

 

..... on it goes.

 

Until of course one factor. Who is paying for all this. Who is actually putting into the system.

 

 

Well many big businesses aren't putting into the system that's for sure. A collection of all the taxes they owe would wipe this deficit out overnight.

 

But many big businesses and high earners are avoiding paying tax NOW, :rant: and that's under a Tory Government, 'the government of big business'.

 

It's pure greed. No wonder this country is on its knees.

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Well many big businesses aren't putting into the system that's for sure. A collection of all the taxes they owe would wipe this deficit out overnight.

 

But many big businesses and high earners are avoiding paying tax NOW, :rant: and that's under a Tory Government, 'the government of big business'.

 

It's pure greed. No wonder this country is on its knees.

 

40 to 120 bn....tax avoidance is killing our growth and killing poor people.

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but weren't tuition a labour idea in the first place. i tell you, i would really be chocked off if i'd just done a university degree and emerged with £30k owing in tuition fees only to find that tuition fees were to abolished and as well as my own fees, i would have to contribute extra tax to pay everyone else's as well.

 

Indeed that would be harsh. But let us attribute to New Labour the policies of New Labour - which was the charging of tuition fees for University while all of us older people had a fantastic free education. So called New Labour deemed this a decent market driven policy. Now we know, it will cost the tax payers as much, if not more than the old system, as so many graduates will never pay back their loans. However, it puts youngsters in debt for a life time and affects their ability to qualify for a mortgage or any other loan. This policy is a total mess. The only honourable route out of this situation is for the State to absorb all debts caused by this policy. I can see no fair alternative.

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