The Labour Party. All discussion here please

[woodview 10]

Just now, lottiecass said:

When it comes down to the important factor, it's the voters that matter the most and members should remember that.

Good point, and I think that is well forgotten.

 

In my opinion, the Labour party has lost touch with what it is supposed to represent. People vote for them through habit, and because they would never vote Tory. Same and opposite goes for the Tories.

 

I wouldn't be sad if all 650 mps were sacked and replaced with Joe Bloggs from a mix of walks of life. More would get done in a more common sense way.

[banjodeano 28]

2 hours ago, Robin-H said:

Where is the evidence that she isn’t representing her constituents? Is she failing to hold surgeries, or respond to emails, or not raising local concerns with parliament? 

 

The vote text argues that she should be deselected because she has criticised the leader, not because she is failing to represent her constituents, unless you believe that you aren’t allowed to criticse the leader even when you believe it to be justified and may be echoing concerns of her constituents.. If so, how come Corbyn was allowed to? 

perhaps they may think that if she keeps running to the media to undermine her leader, then she is failing in her duties as a Labour MP

[banjodeano 28]

1 hour ago, sheffbag said:

nice try to deflect away from all the other points (as other posters are supporting))

In answer to your question, not really, Corbyn, as long as he's the trade union puppy, will be leader until they decide he's going nowhere or he suffers that many losses he will quit. I'm speaking as a person who has voted Labour in the past and will never do so as long as he and his cronies are in charge.

 

The difference is this

Corbyn is the leader of a party and was challenged by all the democratically elected representatives of the party who he is meant to represent as their leader. 

In this incident a democratically elected MP is being challenged by a minority of activists who are not elected and are only speaking on their own agenda, not on the party agenda. If it does go to a vote then it will be interesting to see what happens if/when she wins? 

 

Reading your comment on other posts above is Corbyn on the gravy train as well?

 

You say calling "Corbynistas" is belittling, would you not say that using the term "Blair's babe" and "Tory lite" is equally as bad when used by Labour activists trying to discredit MP's? Or even using the term "People like her"?

 

You say Corbyn may not get in because of "people like her causing divison". You seem to forget that because of "People like her" Labour has a higher representation in Parliament then it would have if there a MP for a different party in her place. 

What division is she actually causing by wanting Labour to be clear on its Anti - Semitism stance or being clear in her views on Brexit and supporting the will of her constituents.

 

they are not minority activists, they are labour party members...they pay into the labour party so THEY should have a say into who represents them...if they feel that their MP is sowing division withing the party, then it is their democratic right to get her replaced with someone that has the party at heart...its a shame you dont like democracy, but hey thats how it goes, 

As for people like her, i wonder if she stood as an independent  if she would get elected, probably not, she only got elected on the back of a labour ticket....

It makes me laugh also about all the labour rebels wanting to leave the party, they all talk about it but never go further than talking about it, like her she woulkd be out of a job, instead they prefer to stay and sow division

 

[Robin-H 11]

4 minutes ago, banjodeano said:

perhaps they may think that if she keeps running to the media to undermine her leader, then she is failing in her duties as a Labour MP

Funny that wasn’t also true of Corbyn then isn’t it? 

 

I dont think tweeting about antisemitism and the threats she’s recieved and suggesting more can be done to root it out really means she is ‘failing her duties as a Labour MP’. Surely that is exactly what an MP should be doing.

 

The fact an attempt has been made to remove her for doing so is shameful. 

[banjodeano 28]

1 minute ago, Robin-H said:

Funny that wasn’t also true of Corbyn then isn’t it? 

 

I dont think tweeting about antisemitism and the threats she’s recieved and suggesting more can be done to root it out really means she is ‘failing her duties as a Labour MP’. Surely that is exactly what an MP should be doing.

 

The fact an attempt has been made to remove her for doing so is shameful. 

ah....the old antisemitism stuff.....Abbott gets threats every day of her life, i dont see many people on here defending her tho, have you ever defended her?

1 hour ago, sheffbag said:

so by that reasoning, when Corbyn lost the vote in parliament he should have been deselected? 

when he lost what vote? the vote by the labour MP's?

but its the members that decide the leader, not the MP's, this is the labour party not the tory party..

 

[banjodeano 28]

7 minutes ago, Robin-H said:

Funny that wasn’t also true of Corbyn then isn’t it? 

 

I dont think tweeting about antisemitism and the threats she’s recieved and suggesting more can be done to root it out really means she is ‘failing her duties as a Labour MP’. Surely that is exactly what an MP should be doing.

 

The fact an attempt has been made to remove her for doing so is shameful. 

nope, he talked to the media to argue about policy, not to just undermine a democratically elected leader..we have the same MP's in the party who time and time again run to the media just to undermine their leader

[Robin-H 11]

10 minutes ago, banjodeano said:

nope, he talked to the media to argue about policy, not to just undermine a democratically elected leader..we have the same MP's in the party who time and time again run to the media just to undermine their leader

And she is tweeting about the abuse she has received. The fact some see it as ‘undermining’ Corbyn says more about them.. Some people would say criticising the Iraq War was undermining Blair. 

[WiseOwl182 10]

6 hours ago, sheffbag said:

Depends which figures you want to look at.

 

A labour person would show you that GDP debt has increased in the last 5 years

A conservative person would show you that UK borrowing deficit has declined sharply in the last 5 years

 

Both are on the same report on the ONS site https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/governmentpublicsectorandtaxes/publicspending/bulletins/ukgovernmentdebtanddeficitforeurostatmaast/september2018

 

A labour person would say that the govt is mishandling the economy

A tory would say " how much did the deficit rise under the various labour governments"

 

If Labour got in (never with Saint Jez at the helm) then the one of the measures of deficit may rise, a different one may fall, which ever suits that parties view at that time would be used. 

 

Its all a load of codswallop and subject to interpretation. 

No it isn't. I asked specifically about the deficit, which is separate to the GDP debt. The deficit has fallen under Conservatives, but obviously when there still is a deficit then the overall debt still increases. When Labour moan about this they should consider what real austerity would have meant, to cut the deficit and return to surplus within a couple of years. The "austerity" we had only really rolled back spending to the mid-Labour years, in most areas.

[banjodeano 28]

1 minute ago, Robin-H said:

And she is tweeting about the abuse she has received. The fact some see it as ‘undermining’ Corbyn says more about them.. Some people would say criticising the Iraq War was undermining Blair. 

I dont think it is the abuse claims that gets party members backs up, although i dont know much about her, but i suspect her running to the media undermining corbyn does...but as i say, i dont know much about her, 

Have you ever defended Abotts abuse?

[Robin-H 11]

23 minutes ago, banjodeano said:

I dont think it is the abuse claims that gets party members backs up, although i dont know much about her, but i suspect her running to the media undermining corbyn does...but as i say, i dont know much about her, 

Have you ever defended Abotts abuse?

I don’t think there has been reason to defend Abbott’s abuse on here, but I have linked to articles before that highlight and strongly condemn the abuse she receives. 

 

 I can unequivocally say now I think any form of racist abuse is disgusting.  I do not rate Abbott as an MP, but I think the racist abuse she receives is abhorrent. 

[Robin-H 11]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47178203

 

Good. I’m glad the backlash against this attempt to silence criticism of antisemism within the Labour Party has forced this to be pulled.

 

Well done to all the decent Labour MPs who called this for what it was. 

[banjodeano 28]

1 hour ago, Robin-H said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47178203

 

Good. I’m glad the backlash against this attempt to silence criticism of antisemism within the Labour Party has forced this to be pulled.

 

Well done to all the decent Labour MPs who called this for what it was. 

hahaha, brilliant...

 

But Labour MP for Liverpool Riverside Louise Ellman, who is also Jewish, called it "an absolutely disgraceful episode" and said it was "very clear the attacks" on Ms Berger had been down to anti-Semitism.

 

So now any criticism of her is automatically antisemitism because she is Jewish, no wonder this got pulled, everyone is scared to get labelled an anti Semite . this is all designed go curb free speech, Corbyn has been against racism all his life but is labelled antisemitic, the world has gone bonkers