Sheffield lagging behind in job creation.

[Olive 10]

Here's some info from Sheffield Uni careers service:

 

Number of graduates in local employment or further education - 28%. These are from 2009/10 figures, and come from a survey done at 6 months post graduation. The report also goes on to say that a number of these graduates are working in what they term "stop-gap" jobs (bar work, call centre, temp admin work, retail). It doesn't look like data past the 6 month point is collected (and would be nigh on impossible, I'd imagine).

 

http://www.shef.ac.uk/polopoly_fs/1.86336!/file/retention.pdf

Edited February 5, 2014 by Olive

[ShefStealth 10]

So what conditions are stopping them from investing in Sheffield...? Genuine question

 

Rail links - we've got the slowest "mainline" rail link to London. East and West coast mainlines are already electrified, West coast is constrained by capacity/freight paths and East Coast is faster than MML because it's a lot straighter so can get upto faster speeds.

 

Roads - We've got a lot of one way systems, and our roads generally have been underinvested in over the past 20 years.

 

Incentives - Sheffield City Council are in massive debt and have very little leigh way in incentivising businesses to come to Sheffield. They can't afford to lower business rates, they can't afford to help with cutting through red-tape, they can't help with any major infrastructure changes that may be required to aid a new business in the area. I can cite at least two examples where by a big business was actually granted permission to setup shop only after they themselves invested in improving the road network into and around their new establishments. In other areas, councils would do all that they could to help a business to move in, in order that if they setup in the area, are happy and stayed then the initial work and outlay would easily be recouped over time and more by the business offering employment and taxes back to the council.

 

Perception - Sheffield isn't seen as a big "City" in a metropolitain sense like London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds or Liverpool are. They have large spread out city centres and are usually thrumming with people. If you wander around Sheffield, it's a fairly compact city centre and has a more "large town" feel to it. We're large from a population and physical area spread, but mostly it's residential and not businesses. Businesses need other businesses to interact with and make money. They usually find it works best if your suppliers are close to you, and a lot of the time this isn't the case with Sheffield. We also still have a perception that we're a run-down ex-Steel making town. "The Full Monty" is still stuck in a lot of out-of-towners minds as to what Sheffield is like as a city, and that's internationally not just within the UK, and that movie still paints a fairly bleak picture.

 

Debt - Our biggest hurdle as a city is to get our debt paid down. Once we've done that, we've then got more ability to work to get new things sorted and can look a lot more appealing to potential inward investment. One of the few things that we've got going for us is that we're fairly centrally located and have easy access to the M1. This is great for manufacturing and Logistics, but unfortunately that's about it right now.

[Olive 10]

That's a great post ShefStealth. Wasn't the East Cost line electrified years and years ago?

 

Really interesting what you say about perception as well. The university's been having a marketing re-jig, and from what they say, there is a negative perception of the city, which is a big hurdle they have to overcome. We need another box office smash to counter the Full Monty effect.

 

I know a lot of people don't agree, and there's been countless threads on it already, but I also think the lack of a business airport just adds to the list of negatives.

[alchresearch 214]

Roads - We've got a lot of one way systems, and our roads generally have been underinvested in over the past 20 years.

 

I'd add the terrible links to Manchester to that.

 

And Perception - Sevenstone, the city's continual "battle" with Ikea or anyone not wanting a second rate site in the city centre.

[barpen 10]

Just like Leeds then.

 

No Leeds are Labour. Sheffield is lefties.

 

---------- Post added 29-01-2014 at 11:34 ----------

 

Businesses are more interested in making money.

 

Which is why they invest their money where it will give them the best return.

 

---------- Post added 29-01-2014 at 11:36 ----------

 

I'd add the terrible links to Manchester to that.

 

And Perception - Sevenstone, the city's continual "battle" with Ikea or anyone not wanting a second rate site in the city centre.

 

Plus the need for future taxation to pay off the debts built up by stupid projects like the toy airport and the Student Games.

Edited January 29, 2014 by barpen

[Cyclone 10]

Rail links - we've got the slowest "mainline" rail link to London. East and West coast mainlines are already electrified, West coast is constrained by capacity/freight paths and East Coast is faster than MML because it's a lot straighter so can get upto faster speeds.

EML is definitely faster, but the last time I got a train from London to Manchester, it took about the same time as London to Sheffield. Trainline says 2:09, which is pretty similar.

 

Roads - We've got a lot of one way systems, and our roads generally have been underinvested in over the past 20 years.

That's common to every city I've driven in recently, including Leeds, Manchester and Birmingham.

 

Incentives - Sheffield City Council are in massive debt and have very little leigh way in incentivising businesses to come to Sheffield. They can't afford to lower business rates, they can't afford to help with cutting through red-tape, they can't help with any major infrastructure changes that may be required to aid a new business in the area. I can cite at least two examples where by a big business was actually granted permission to setup shop only after they themselves invested in improving the road network into and around their new establishments. In other areas, councils would do all that they could to help a business to move in, in order that if they setup in the area, are happy and stayed then the initial work and outlay would easily be recouped over time and more by the business offering employment and taxes back to the council.

Can't argue with this one.

 

Perception - Sheffield isn't seen as a big "City" in a metropolitain sense like London, Birmingham, Manchester, Leeds or Liverpool are.

Odd to see Liverpool in that list, it's significantly smaller.

They have large spread out city centres and are usually thrumming with people. If you wander around Sheffield, it's a fairly compact city centre and has a more "large town" feel to it. We're large from a population and physical area spread, but mostly it's residential and not businesses. Businesses need other businesses to interact with and make money. They usually find it works best if your suppliers are close to you, and a lot of the time this isn't the case with Sheffield. We also still have a perception that we're a run-down ex-Steel making town. "The Full Monty" is still stuck in a lot of out-of-towners minds as to what Sheffield is like as a city, and that's internationally not just within the UK, and that movie still paints a fairly bleak picture.

I don't think a 15 year old film is all that relevant to be honest.

 

Debt - Our biggest hurdle as a city is to get our debt paid down. Once we've done that, we've then got more ability to work to get new things sorted and can look a lot more appealing to potential inward investment. One of the few things that we've got going for us is that we're fairly centrally located and have easy access to the M1. This is great for manufacturing and Logistics, but unfortunately that's about it right now.

 

The council are supposed to be trying to reorganise some of the debt at the moment to get a lower interest rate and reduce payments.

[tinfoilhat 11]

EML is definitely faster, but the last time I got a train from London to Manchester, it took about the same time as London to Sheffield. Trainline says 2:09, which is pretty similar.

That's common to every city I've driven in recently, including Leeds, Manchester and Birmingham.

Can't argue with this one.

Odd to see Liverpool in that list, it's significantly smaller.

I don't think a 15 year old film is all that relevant to be honest.

 

The council are supposed to be trying to reorganise some of the debt at the moment to get a lower interest rate and reduce payments.

 

Ask a lot of southerners and I'll guarantee at least half will think Liverpool is bigger than Sheffield. More will think Leeds is bigger than Sheffield. We know that's bobbins but it boils down to perceptions.

 

Train times - London to Doncaster will be quicker still. Arguably better road network too.

[Anna Glypta 10]

Really interesting what you say about perception as well. The university's been having a marketing re-jig, and from what they say, there is a negative perception of the city, which is a big hurdle they have to overcome.

 

I'm not sure that perception is helped when you get someone like Julie Dore appearing on the news and speaking as leader of Sheffield Council.

 

---------- Post added 29-01-2014 at 12:31 ----------

 

Ask a lot of southerners and I'll guarantee at least half will think Liverpool is bigger than Sheffield. More will think Leeds is bigger than Sheffield. We know that's bobbins but it boils down to perceptions.

 

Train times - London to Doncaster will be quicker still. Arguably better road network too.

 

Mention Liverpool and folk think of the Albert Dock or Liverpool One. Mention Leeds and they imagine the Armouries the new developments, TV headquarters, Headingly. Mention Sheffield and they think of the Don Valley Stadium being knocked down.

 

What an opportunity was missed with the canal basin. Anywhere else that would be a tourist trap with posh flats, cafes bars restaurants and not a dumping ground for unwanted narrow boats.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Anna Glypta

[RutlandFlyer 10]

It comes down to money, basically. When people are setting up businesses or looking to invest they look at things like per household income and Sheffield's is probably the lowest of any British city of its size. Low incomes mean low disposable incomes, mean more money to be made in Leeds or York or Nottingham.

 

What doesn't help is the wave of across-the-board public sector cuts we get every twenty years or so. These kind of cuts will always hit post-industrial areas like Sheffield and parts of the North East harder than elsewhere, because the local economy is so dependent on public sector employment.

 

It's all well and good Cameron and Osborne saying new private sector jobs have more than outweighed public sector job losses, but the truth behind that little soundbyte is that 80% of new private sector jobs are in London and the South East, so it's a big net loss to places like this. Worse still it has a knock-on effect in that, as the recovery progresses the lost and unreplaced public sector jobs in Sheffield mean that once again, it's literally the poor man when businesses are looking to expand and invest because household incomes are even worse than they were before.

 

This cycle has gone on long enough and the losers are only going to keep on losing. It's time power was devolved to the regions so they can cut their own cloth. Replace public sector jobs with private ones in the regions where that's viable and where it's not, use the public sector to underpin the local economy whilst trying to attract the private sector in. The current system is just going to carry on concentrating wealth and jobs in London and the South East.

[truman 10]

It comes down to money, basically. When people are setting up businesses or looking to invest they look at things like per household income and Sheffield's is probably the lowest of any British city of its size. Low incomes mean low disposable incomes, mean more money to be made in Leeds or York or Nottingham.

 

 

I don't get this..why would low income stop a manufacturing business from setting up here? It's not as though they'll be selling their "widgets" to people on the high street..

[barpen 10]

I don't get this..why would low income stop a manufacturing business from setting up here? It's not as though they'll be selling their "widgets" to people on the high street..

 

Do you imagine all businesses manufacture widgets and don't trade with local people?

[Mr Bates 10]

Indeed. Lowering the local wages is actually government policy, if an unofficial one. Cut jobs in the public sector, and implement pay freezes in the remaining jobs, resulting in real terms pay cuts, means that lower waged private sector employers should move in to fill the gaps. That's the theory anyway.