Help for hero - bradley manning

[dvp82 10]

Manning leaked information that he agreed not to when he accepted the job that required the security clearance he had. So whether you regard him as a hero or not on that level alone he deserves to go to prison.

 

Snowden is possibly slightly different as he knew what information he was releasing, still he has to face up to the consequences of his actions as well. Manning on the other hand knew pretty much zip about the information he was leaking and just handed it all over to that egomaniac Assange.

[frank ryan 10]

I'm defending nothing. I am simply stating that this man is a traitor, and has put his compratriots in peril, by his actions. I have no need to bow to Mr. Ryan or you or anybody else. I heard nothing up to now about this helicopter action. If I had i would know how to react to it, but i Can't and won't about something I know nothing about, not like you and your fellow haters and rabble rousers. You exist in this world because of duty served by myself and others like me who carried the burden of keeplng you safe. My son served in Iraq honorably and will carry the serious wounds he received for the rest of his life. I served in the RN for 18 years. We fight and some of us die for it. In war there are collateral casualties. We hate that but its one of the tragedies we face. If you think your country is pure, read about Dresden for example, or the Black and Tans. You yell and sputter your hate for us, but you come crying when you need us and we're always there, more fool us. You take off soon enough when it gets rough out there.

 

how do you feel about ed snowden - traitor? hero? what's the word on your US street?

 

ps the black & tans were a death squad - not defending them!!

[Jim Hardie 517]

Apparently the information he leaked was available to 2.7m people. That tells me it was hardly secret information. It also tells me he's a complete idiot.

2,699,999 people can't be wrong.

[ronthenekred 10]

Why the need for the homophobic language?

 

 

Psychological propaganda. What you do is force feed limp minds so that it becomes entrenched, entrenched so much that the limp minds become so convinced. Not because of facts but purely based on the constant barrage of misinformation.

 

If you say "ladyboy" enough times it becomes true..even if it isn't.

[buck 11]

how do you feel about ed snowden - traitor? hero? what's the word on your US street?

 

ps the black & tans were a death squad - not defending them!!

my main thought about Snowden is that he's an idiot, a self important little jackass. You'd know the type well.

[mort 10]

If the personal insults and attacks don't stop i will be issuing suspensions.

[syne 10]

I'm defending nothing. I am simply stating that this man is a traitor, and has put his compratriots in peril, by his actions. I have no need to bow to Mr. Ryan or you or anybody else. I heard nothing up to now about this helicopter action. If I had i would know how to react to it, but i Can't and won't about something I know nothing about, not like you and your fellow haters and rabble rousers. You exist in this world because of duty served by myself and others like me who carried the burden of keeplng you safe. My son served in Iraq honorably and will carry the serious wounds he received for the rest of his life. I served in the RN for 18 years. We fight and some of us die for it. In war there are collateral casualties. We hate that but its one of the tragedies we face. If you think your country is pure, read about Dresden for example, or the Black and Tans. You yell and sputter your hate for us, but you come crying when you need us and we're always there, more fool us. You take off soon enough when it gets rough out there.

 

I'm sure you didn't fight to give the US/UK the right to treat citizens as an untrusted commodity, To abandon democracy and liberty, for your country(s) to be kow-towing to corporations that have little respect for laws or people alike, to lie to you with a bare face.

Or did you?

Our countries seem to think the standards we agreed to many years ago, ie the Geneva convention, The UN, The international rule of law just simply apply when we want them too.

Fine, so be it, but they should at least have the balls to admit that's the case. When its published/proven we should have the decency not to act like countries that do similar are somehow worse than us.

 

Regarding the underlined bit, are you saying you haven't watched this?

http://www.collateralmurder.com/

It 100% goes against the Geneva convention. and the US military denied knowing what happened to the people, then decided that what happened is ok..Its a war crime.

 

Having read a lot of the cables It does seem like a lot of them are just inter office crap, there are highlighted ones that are more sinister but to my untrained eye it does just seem like an info grab n dump.

[ronthenekred 10]

Seriously?

 

You know that little about the dude/tte and you're pontificating?

 

Yes seriously, I'm asking you a question. Rather than using the term sexuality, you seem to be going for a high score almost at every post with what you will deny but is as obvious as the nose on your face with derogatory alternatives.

 

It's the same type of argument Harleyman would and has used "Pale face" or as someone else mentioned "looks like a "weasel". Can you provide (I'm not saying there isn't) some evidence that his sexuality is the cause of him divulging information? The reason I ask you is I'd like to read what you are reading.

 

You don't have to consume bandwidth by throwing it up on the thread, a link will do.

[Waldo 96]

I'm defending nothing. I am simply stating that this man is a traitor, and has put his compratriots in peril, by his actions. I have no need to bow to Mr. Ryan or you or anybody else. I heard nothing up to now about this helicopter action. If I had i would know how to react to it, but i Can't and won't about something I know nothing about, not like you and your fellow haters and rabble rousers. You exist in this world because of duty served by myself and others like me who carried the burden of keeplng you safe. My son served in Iraq honorably and will carry the serious wounds he received for the rest of his life. I served in the RN for 18 years. We fight and some of us die for it. In war there are collateral casualties. We hate that but its one of the tragedies we face. If you think your country is pure, read about Dresden for example, or the Black and Tans. You yell and sputter your hate for us, but you come crying when you need us and we're always there, more fool us. You take off soon enough when it gets rough out there.

 

Dear buck,

 

I do not hate you or your country. To be clear, my country is no better or worse that yours or many others. We all have our problems.

 

There is so much you say here, that I'd like to pick apart and examine point by point. I'm sure we have very different life experience and perspectives; so I am wondering if it is possible to proceed without us ripping in to each other?

 

It's interesting that you mention Dresden. For how long do you think the good people of Dresden continued to exist because of the protection of the German war machine? Did the military men of Germany keep them safe, or bring about their eventual demise? Where were the German military when the bombs started falling?

 

You see, to my mind; disregarding nationality, the more military men we have in the world, the more innocent civilians are killed; there is a direct correlation. Also, the more one depends on another agency, for ones own protection, the weaker and more vulnerable one is. Defend yourself, that is the first law of nature.

 

Sadly, things are a lot more complex that this; but only because the general mentality of humanity is not sufficiently evolved to stage where we can do without killing each other. We (humanity) make a pretence at civility, but deep down, on the whole, we are tribal, self-centered and violent.

 

Am I wrong?

 

Sorry to hear about your son by the way.

 

EDIT: Here's the link to the helicopter footage. It's grim viewing:

[andygardener 10]

Yes seriously, I'm asking you a question. Rather than using the term sexuality, you seem to be going for a high score almost at every post with what you will deny but is as obvious as the nose on your face with derogatory alternatives.

 

It's the same type of argument Harleyman would and has used "Pale face" or as someone else mentioned "looks like a "weasel". Can you provide (I'm not saying there isn't) some evidence that his sexuality is the cause of him divulging information? The reason I ask you is I'd like to read what you are reading.

 

You don't have to consume bandwidth by throwing it up on the thread, a link will do.

 

Wikipedia has a load of well sourced articles

[Harleyman 12]

how do you feel about ed snowden - traitor? hero? what's the word on your US street?

 

ps the black & tans were a death squad - not defending them!!

 

How do YOU feel about him? Right now the NSA may be reading your posts and laughing their asses off. Probably in the long run it's better not to know what really goes on. Could be hurtful to the ego old boy

 

---------- Post added 01-08-2013 at 05:10 ----------

 

Dear buck,

 

I do not hate you or your country. To be clear, my country is no better or worse that yours or many others. We all have our problems.

 

There is so much you say here, that I'd like to pick apart and examine point by point. I'm sure we have very different life experience and perspectives; so I am wondering if it is possible to proceed without us ripping in to each other?

 

It's interesting that you mention Dresden. For how long do you think the good people of Dresden continued to exist because of the protection of the German war machine? Did the military men of Germany keep them safe, or bring about their eventual demise? Where were the German military when the bombs started falling?You see, to my mind; disregarding nationality, the more military men we have in the world, the more innocent civilians are killed; there is a direct correlation. Also, the more one depends on another agency, for ones own protection, the weaker and more vulnerable one is. Defend yourself, that is the first law of nature.

 

Sadly, things are a lot more complex that this; but only because the general mentality of humanity is not sufficiently evolved to stage where we can do without killing each other. We (humanity) make a pretence at civility, but deep down, on the whole, we are tribal, self-centered and violent.

 

Am I wrong?

 

Sorry to hear about your son by the way.

 

EDIT: Here's the link to the helicopter footage. It's grim viewing:

 

The German military were being pasted on the east and western fronts and the Luftwaffe whose job it was to protect civilians ftom enemy bombers was almost none existent by that time.

 

I have a problemn with the words "innocent civilians" Babies and kids are always innocent but war machines cannot function without the support of civilan participation and the labour it provides. Hitler had plenty of support from the civilian population. They shed no tears when they read in their papers that the Luftwaffe had bombed Warsaw, Rotterdam and Coventry. It was all Sieg Heil. Hitler only became the bad guy to the Germans when it was clear that Germany was going to lose the war

Edited August 1, 2013 by Harleyman

[*Belle* 10]

 

I have a problemn with the words "innocent civilians" Babies and kids are always innocent but war machines cannot function without the support of civilan participation and the labour it provides. Hitler had plenty of support from the civilian population. They shed no tears when they read in their papers that the Luftwaffe had bombed Warsaw, Rotterdam and Coventry. It was all Sieg Heil. Hitler only became the bad guy to the Germans when it was clear that Germany was going to lose the war

 

Because the civilian population believed what their government was telling them.

 

The irony is actually quite numbing.