Is Sheffield Council about to sell off bits of Graves Park YET AGAIN?

[999tigger 10]

I'm not surprised by labour. I tried to contact my mp over this, they never returned my call, instead I got a letter without them even asking me my question. The trustees shouldn't have done this, it's wrong, using the excuse of it's too expensive to repair is pathetic. They should concentrate on tighter management and governance of their resources, rather than selling off part of the park.

 

Perhaps you should look at the accounts and then youd see the sale is part of managing their resources. Facts are the Council have had massive cuts and cant afford to subsidise the Park as much as previously. Theres only so much belt tightening you can do. The alternative at some stage is to close one of the parks completely. Ar least they have done it lhaving cleared it with the CC this time.

 

---------- Post added 26-01-2016 at 20:06 ----------

 

I don't hold out much hope but apparently The Friends of Graves Park are still working with their barrister to prove that the sale was illegal - just like it was proven that the sale of Chantery Cottage was..

 

Surely if it was applicable they would use the same argument in Chantrey again? the fact they cleared it with CC makes it a pretty steep hurdle to get over.

[foxy lady 10]

I don't hold out much hope but apparently The Friends of Graves Park are still working with their barrister to prove that the sale was illegal - just like it was proven that the sale of Chantery Cottage was..

 

I don't think this will end well. The cottage and land belonged to the Graves Park Charity and the council were merely custodians required to manage it in the best interests of the charity. Instead they neglected it, let it fall into decay and sold it at a price that their neglect has cost the charity dear.

The charitable trust requires that the money be used to buy land of equal amenity value to the charity. But as there is no land available this is likely to fail the charity too.

If this does end up in court the councilors who act as trustees will have some rather awkward questions to answer.

I think this grubby little episode is only in its early stages.

 

---------- Post added 26-01-2016 at 20:11 ----------

 

 

Surely if it was applicable they would use the same argument in Chantrey again? the fact they cleared it with CC makes it a pretty steep hurdle to get over.

 

I'm not sure that that argument works here. The CC are an advisory body and make recomendations based on the information they are given by the trustees of the charities. All the council documents seem to claim that this cottage was outside the park. I'm not sure a court of law will be as quick to swallow that.

Edited January 26, 2016 by foxy lady

[999tigger 10]

The charitable trust requires that the money be used to buy land of equal amenity value to the charity. s.

 

Where does it say this? Its normal that the proceeds are just returned to the charity and need to be used in pursuing its charitable objectives. I have read nothing that binds them to buy further land.

 

---------- Post added 26-01-2016 at 20:17 ----------

 

 

I'm not sure that that argument works here. The CC are an advisory body and make recomendations based on the information they are given by the trustees of the charities. All the council documents seem to claim that this cottage was outside the park. I'm not sure a court of law will be as quick to swallow that.

 

They arent just an advisory body, they are the regulator. It works in the sense that it provides the Trustees with protection so any acts in accordance with what the CC said cna be laid back to them. It doesnt mean that the sale couldnt still be unlawful. but its highly unlikely.

 

The advice the council was given as explained was that the sale of the cottage was not of sufficient importance or size to prevent it from still carrying out its charitable objectives. its the charitable objectives which are important and the application of current charity law.

[remyrobson 10]

This is what the council themselves say about reinvestment of the proceeds. Link is in post #395.

What will happen to the money raised from the sale of the cottage?

 

We are legally bound to invest the money in improvements to the park. We expect to receive around £80,000 from the sale and the list of improvements includes play facilities, the animal farm, footpaths and improved sports facilities. Whilst clearly not all of these can be funded from the sale, the best options will be considered and investment of the receipt is guaranteed.

[Jonny5 10]

The money will be reinvested in running the park as incompetently as humanly possible. Plus now that the flood gates have opened they can look forward to neglecting the next park asset, rinse and repeat.

 

A terrible day for the people of Sheffield.

[999tigger 10]

The money will be reinvested in running the park as incompetently as humanly possible. Plus now that the flood gates have opened they can look forward to neglecting the next park asset, rinse and repeat.

 

A terrible day for the people of Sheffield.

It would depend on what basis those parks are held. is each park a separate charity?

If no then different rules apply. If they run out of money, then they will have to shut one down completely or start selling big chunks off.

[WarPig 78]

Were there any stipulations in the sale preventing it being knocked down?

[remyrobson 10]

Were there any stipulations in the sale preventing it being knocked down?

 

Yes, it also has to be restored within 2 years of sale.

[Blackbeard 10]

Were there any stipulations in the sale preventing it being knocked down?

 

This was the friends solutions http://sheffielddemocracy.moderngov.co.uk/documents/s18722/Cobnar%20Cottage%202.pdf

[foxy lady 10]

This was the friends solutions http://sheffielddemocracy.moderngov.co.uk/documents/s18722/Cobnar%20Cottage%202.pdf

 

Actually the friends solution was to let the cottage to a stone mason who would live there, restore the cottage and return it to the park trust as a rebuilt unit. It would appear that the council's solution was to allow a very pleasant well maintained cottage to fall into disrepair and become derelict whilst in their care, and sell it to a developer and be lost to the trust.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2016 at 09:28 ----------

 

Where does it say this? Its normal that the proceeds are just returned to the charity and need to be used in pursuing its charitable objectives. I have read nothing that binds them to buy further land.

 

Well in that case you clearly haven't read the charitable deeds that govern Graves Park and the condition of the gifting on the land to "The People of Sheffield".

[Dubaidani13 10]

Actually the friends solution was to let the cottage to a stone mason who would live there, restore the cottage and return it to the park trust as a rebuilt unit. It would appear that the council's solution was to allow a very pleasant well maintained cottage to fall into disrepair and become derelict whilst in their care, and sell it to a developer and be lost to the trust.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2016 at 09:28 ----------

 

 

Well in that case you clearly haven't read the charitable deeds that govern Graves Park and the condition of the gifting on the land to "The People of Sheffield".

 

its sold! get over it, the proposal for the stone mason was always going to to be a pie in the sky idea, now at least an eyesore will be properly done within a reasonable time without leeching from park funds:roll:

[Eric Arthur 10]

Does this mean that the Council allocate £150k less next year, or have they promised to keep their current budget in place? In other words, is this £150k extra for the park or is the sale of the cottage just paying for other council services?