Is University Worth It?

[this_life 10]

It could also be that they are professions where people are paid little extra for a high level of management responsibility for which they have little/no training or support, being expected to perform well beyond the resources they are given.

 

I suspect in any case that the draw of power will not be sufficient to persuade people to take on ~£40k of debt.

 

So what is it that motivates people to choose and stay in these careers???

 

Young people choosing them may not understand the impact of earning less than 40K per year, over a life-time. When you're 18 a salary of 20K seems like unbelievable riches. Many people go into these careers later in life. And/or choose to stay in these careers. There is much widespread discontent in these careers about pay, conditions, stress etc. Why stay??? As with other threads on the Forum today, why stay in a low paid, high stressful area, feeling distressed.

 

Many people report that they do not feel cared for/supported as the patients/children/public (nursing/teaching/police). If it is not money, good working conditions, 'client' satisfaction. What is the draw???

[biotechpete 10]

Quote:

 

Originally Posted by biotechpete

 

It could also be that they are professions where people are paid little extra for a high level of management responsibility for which they have little/no training or support, being expected to perform well beyond the resources they are given.

 

I suspect in any case that the draw of power will not be sufficient to persuade people to take on ~£40k of debt.

 

So what is it that motivates people to choose and stay in these careers???

 

Young people choosing them may not understand the impact of earning less than 40K per year, over a life-time. When you're 18 a salary of 20K seems like unbelievable riches. Many people go into these careers later in life. And/or choose to stay in these careers. There is much widespread discontent in these careers about pay, conditions, stress etc. Why stay??? As with other threads on the Forum today, why stay in a low paid, high stressful area, feeling distressed.

 

Many people report that they do not feel cared for/supported as the patients/children/public (nursing/teaching/police). If it is not money, good working conditions, 'client' satisfaction. What is the draw???

 

Well some people, for sure, see it as a public service, a duty. Many others just feel trapped. The skills you learn and use on a day to day basis are not obviously transferable and largely not valued by employers in other sectors. I know of a few people who have left scientific and NHS careers to take a job working on the checkout at a supermarket.

 

 

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[L00b 441]

It would, and to be fair wages in some places did increase.

By and large, very far from being in any proportion to expectations, which was -and still is- the main problem.

 

I have MSc and PhD guys (and gals ) who have never been out of academia, attending a job interview for a Sheffield-based trainee position with us, with starting salary expectations corresponding to a London-based, part-qualified professional (at least 3 years into the job, more usually double)

 

Welcome to the real world

I just wonder if they will do the same again to meet the needs of todays University leavers.

Wrong way round: it's never been up to employers to meet the needs of University leavers, but always been up to Universities to prepare their students for employers'needs.

[this_life 10]

'He who pays the piper calls the tune'!!!

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 12:55 ----------

 

It depends on how much you 'need' the big house, big car, holidays, etc to what you are prepared to do for it!!! Having children shifts your view on this. Wanting things for your children affects your view on what you will tolerate for money.

 

Intrinsic motivation is a different thing. If your work is intrinsically motivating, that must be a good thing. I wonder how many people have that. Some people will tolerate an awful lot of 'pain' for a big salary.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 12:58 ----------

 

And then there is the quest for POWER and CONTROL. For being the 'BIG MAN', who RULES THE WORLD.

[geared 319]

It is not a debt!

 

Think of it more like a tax.

 

Does it accrue interest like the student loan does?

[biotechpete 10]

Wrong way round: it's never been up to employers to meet the needs of University leavers, but always been up to Universities to prepare their students for employers'needs.

 

Surely this depends on the supply of graduates. If there are far fewer graduates and you need graduates you will have to compete with what other companies are willing to pay.

 

The marketisation of education will ultimately mean that either those who are independently wealthy will get all the graduate jobs, or employers will have to start to meet the cost of training their workforce, be it through higher wages or lower expectations of qualifications.

 

 

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[Clown Shoes 10]

I had an amazing time at UNI

 

Id got back tomorrow if i didnt have a student loan to pay off already!

[this_life 10]

So what is it that motivates people to choose and stay in these careers???

 

Young people choosing them may not understand the impact of earning less than 40K per year, over a life-time. When you're 18 a salary of 20K seems like unbelievable riches. Many people go into these careers later in life. And/or choose to stay in these careers. There is much widespread discontent in these careers about pay, conditions, stress etc. Why stay??? As with other threads on the Forum today, why stay in a low paid, high stressful area, feeling distressed.

 

Many people report that they do not feel cared for/supported as the patients/children/public (nursing/teaching/police). If it is not money, good working conditions, 'client' satisfaction. What is the draw???

 

Perhaps it is that this group of people have a strong preference for 'downward social comparison', that it makes them feel superior to spend their time with people with much worse lives than themselves.

 

Perhaps it makes them feel like the 'superior race'/social group/chosen ones/special, and that their lives are great compared to the people they work with. Perhaps unconsciously they need these people to have awful lives to feel good about themselves and the phrase 'there but for the grace of god...' is felt in a literal sense, and on some level they feel special to be healthy, have relationships, jobs, salaries, and superior cognitive skills to the people they work with.

 

If so then unconsciously/consciously they will on some level not really want their clients to 'succeed' because it will make them feel bad. As opposed to what all patients/students/clients want which is the people responsible for them to thrive on each and every step forward and success.

 

Think of all the thin people who like to have a fat friend to make themselves feel attractive...

[Sid Umpley 10]

i didnt go to Uni at all. i took an apprenticeship and a LOAD of travelling, a lifelong autodidact.

i had am amazing time as well. the money i earnt working allowed me to take a load of fascinating trips around the world.

 

the proudest moment for me was when my son at 16 said to me "dad i wont want to go to Uni. i want to train as a joiner"

it showed he had not been brainwashed by the schools to think uni was the only route.

 

he got to 20. was making 30k, considering starting his own business and had zero debt.

 

Society has convinced everyone that university is the path to riches. for a few thats true. for the rest its a lifetime of debt (or tax) to earn less than a decent bricklayer!

[this_life 10]

i didnt go to Uni at all. i took an apprenticeship and a LOAD of travelling, a lifelong autodidact.

i had am amazing time as well. the money i earnt working allowed me to take a load of fascinating trips around the world.

 

the proudest moment for me was when my son at 16 said to me "dad i wont want to go to Uni. i want to train as a joiner"

it showed he had not been brainwashed by the schools to think uni was the only route.

 

he got to 20. was making 30k, considering starting his own business and had zero debt.

 

Society has convinced everyone that university is the path to riches. for a few thats true. for the rest its a lifetime of debt (or tax) to earn less than a decent bricklayer!

 

That sounds good. I agree.

[chem1st 10]

I'm not sure it is, financially at least, you lose out on earnings for a few years and get into debt (basically in the form of a 9% graduate tax). Even people with good degrees in STEM can struggle to find work and the wages aren't very good (but currently that is the general trend across the entire economy unless you are born into land or marry into it).

 

If your going to do it for financial reasons, it might be worthwhile to get a load of loans and credit cards to pay for your studies privately and then go bankrupt. If female, it might be best concentrating on your looks and trying to marry into land, instead of trying to earn an honest crust, work does not pay.

 

If your doing it because you are generally interested in something, it might be worth it, but it might also be worth going onto the dole for a few years and studying online, you can access a wealth of information, legally/illegally.

 

If you want a certain career because you are passionate about something, and you need the piece of paper, do it, study hard, and follow your dream.

[lubylou12 10]

It really depends on what course you decide to do. I am a Student Nurse and pay nothing at all, I recieve a bursery enough for me and 3 children, and my tuition fees are payed. Most health and wellbeing courses are free to study but places are hard to get.

 

So yes I think it is worth going to uni depending on what you chose to do, without uni I would only be able to get a minimum/low wage job as I would have no skills to get anything better. So uni is my way of making sure I have a career and can build towards a better future for my children. It is a long haul but it will be worth it in the end.