Police request to produce driving documentaton

[truman 10]

My friend (not partner!) had to produce her driving licence, insurance, MOT cert and tax info when she went, and the police told her they would 'follow it up'. Given the legalities of the situation (which you kindly pointed out earlier), it would seem that this request was inappropriate, unless she was under suspicion of having done something wrong.

 

How do you think her wing mirror was broken off?

[whiteowl 54]

She is not under suspicion of anything, but as has been previously pointed out she was in charge of a motor vehicle which was on a public road when a RTC has taken place.

She has then reported the incident to police and has been asked to produce her documents at a police station just like you or I would have to if we had been in the same situation.

Bearing in mind the cost of a replacement mirror= cost of excess and future premiums I would not have reported it as there is now traceable record of that incident to link an RTC to that vehicle.

If she were to apply for insurance in the next 5 years and does not disclose the accident she could have her insurance made null and void or even accused of fraud.

 

My bold.

 

The car was parked up - she was not in charge of a motor vehicle at all. If you are in charge of a motor vehicle when it is parked up and you are nowhere near it, then anybody who parks on the road outside their house is guilty of being drunk in charge of a motor vehicle every time they come back from going to the pub.

[Obelix 11]

If the car has been involved in a RTC, eg. hit by another car, and she has reported it to the police, then she has to produce her docs as she is classed as being in charge of that vehicle, whether driving it or not. If its criminal damage, and someone has knocked it off with their hand or something, then that is not a RTC and she wouldn't be asked to produce her docs.

 

If it was vandalised, why would someone leave a number? Did anyone see it?

 

No she doesnt. It would be worth looking at the law, the relevant legislation is S164 of the road traffic act 1988.

 

164 Power of constables to require production of driving licence and in certain cases statement of date of birth.

 

(1)Any of the following persons— .

(a)a person driving a motor vehicle on a road, .

 

She wasn't driving it. Parked is not the same as driving.

 

(b)a person whom a constable [F1or vehicle examiner] has reasonable cause to believe to have been the driver of a motor vehicle at a time when an accident occurred owing to its presence on a road, .

 

There is no reasonable cause here to think she was driving

 

©a person whom a constable [F1or vehicle examiner] has reasonable cause to believe to have committed an offence in relation to the use of a motor vehicle on a road, or .

 

Again, I doubt there is reasonable cause.

 

Also if there has been no other damage caused to third parties, and no injury there is no requirement to produce insurance details, not even to the other party.

[whiteowl 54]

As for reporting it - a crime has been committed and so it should be reported.

With the insurance, we don't know whether the person in question will claim or not and don't the insurers ask if you've had "any claims or convictions" in the last x years ? Not any accidents. Could be wrong on that though

[Timmmy 10]

The people that a constable may require to produce documents are:

 

• someone driving
  
• someone that they have reasonable cause to believe was driving when an accident occurred
  
• someone that they have reasonable cause to believe has committed an offence with regard to the use of a motor vehicle
  

 

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/165/enacted

 

That list won't be exhaustive though, if the police ask you to produce your docs then you have to do that.

[msmouse 10]

How do you think her wing mirror was broken off?

 

And this is relevant how? All I know is what she told me about the incident, and I have no reason to disbelieve her.

 

She is not under suspicion of anything, but as has been previously pointed out she was in charge of a motor vehicle which was on a public road when a RTC has taken place.

She has then reported the incident to police and has been asked to produce her documents at a police station just like you or I would have to if we had been in the same situation.

Bearing in mind the cost of a replacement mirror= cost of excess and future premiums I would not have reported it as there is now traceable record of that incident to link an RTC to that vehicle.

If she were to apply for insurance in the next 5 years and does not disclose the accident she could have her insurance made null and void or even accused of fraud.

 

As was pointed out in a previous post, if you have a vehicle parked on a public road, then you are 'considered to be in charge of it'. Does that preclude drinking, despite the fact you have no intention of subsequently driving? If so, then all those who don't have garages/driveways must remain teetotal at all times lest the 'feds' knock on your door.

 

Secondly, if she had contacted me before informing the police, I would have advised her not to persue the matter due to the likely impact on the cost of future insurance premiums vs the cost of the damage (quoted at approx £200).

 

If the car has been involved in a RTC, eg. hit by another car, and she has reported it to the police, then she has to produce her docs as she is classed as being in charge of that vehicle, whether driving it or not. If its criminal damage, and someone has knocked it off with their hand or something, then that is not a RTC and she wouldn't be asked to produce her docs.

 

If it was vandalised, why would someone leave a number? Did anyone see it?

 

No she doesnt. It would be worth looking at the law, the relevant legislation is S164 of the road traffic act 1988.

 

164 Power of constables to require production of driving licence and in certain cases statement of date of birth.

 

(1)Any of the following persons— .

(a)a person driving a motor vehicle on a road, .

 

She wasn't driving it. Parked is not the same as driving.

 

(b)a person whom a constable [F1or vehicle examiner] has reasonable cause to believe to have been the driver of a motor vehicle at a time when an accident occurred owing to its presence on a road, .

 

There is no reasonable cause here to think she was driving

 

©a person whom a constable [F1or vehicle examiner] has reasonable cause to believe to have committed an offence in relation to the use of a motor vehicle on a road, or .

 

Again, I doubt there is reasonable cause.

 

Also if there has been no other damage caused to third parties, and no injury there is no requirement to produce insurance details, not even to the other party.

 

In my OP I simply asked if my friend was required to produce documentation to the police following the incident as outlined. The above quoted response indicates that she was NOT.

 

As regards to making mountains out of molehills, and what constitutes a stressful situation, I was merely trying to help out a friend by finding out the facts. To some, molehills may look like mountains, and they may find things like this quite stressful (but to compare this to things such as a bereavement is a tad crass).

Edited May 10, 2013 by msmouse
Additional point added

[Timmmy 10]

You are actually none the wiser so why bother?

[Obelix 11]

That list won't be exhaustive though, if the police ask you to produce your docs then you have to do that.

 

Actually no, you really don't. The powers of a constable to require production of licence is strictly limited and is given in the circumstances above.

 

The ower of a vehicle is the person who would normally report criminal damage to it. What if they don't have a driving licence? There is no requirement for them to have one.

[truman 10]

The ower of a vehicle is the person who would normally report criminal damage to it..

 

Does that mean I'd have to inform the lease company and let them tell the police? I don't think so somehow.. I'd expect the person who was in charge of the vehicle at the time the damage happened to be the one who reported it..

Edited May 10, 2013 by truman

[Timmmy 10]

Actually no, you really don't. The powers of a constable to require production of licence is strictly limited and is given in the circumstances above.

 

The ower of a vehicle is the person who would normally report criminal damage to it. What if they don't have a driving licence? There is no requirement for them to have one.

 

Oh why doesn't he take the police to court then for asking for a producer illegally ! See how far they get with that one.

[Obelix 11]

Oh why doesn't he take the police to court then for asking for a producer illegally ! See how far they get with that one.

 

Your strawman makes no real sense I'm afraid. I'm glad however to see you conceded that the licence demand was illegal.

 

---------- Post added 10-05-2013 at 14:58 ----------

 

Does that mean I'd have to inform the lease company and let them tell the police? I don't think so somehow.. I'd expect the person who was in charge of the vehicle at the time the damage happened to be the one who reported it..

 

That's why I said *normally*.....

[Timmmy 10]

Your strawman makes no real sense I'm afraid. I'm glad however to see you conceded that the licence demand was illegal.

 

---------- Post added 10-05-2013 at 14:58 ----------

 

 

That's why I said *normally*.....

 

I think you are clutching at straws