Does God Exist?

[Anna B 1,414]

5 hours ago, CaptainSwing said:

The answer to most questions of that kind is either "We don't know (yet)" or "There is no answer to that question because it is a meaningless question".

 

The best entry point for the latter point of view is still Language, Truth and Logic, which I recommend to you.  Don't be daunted, it's a much easier read than most philosophy books.

 

[Incidentally, you know you're a philosophy geek if your first thought on seeing Nigella Lawson is "That's A.J. Ayer's stepdaughter".]

I don't think they're meaningless questions. They are the sort of questions that drive us on. 

[Anna B 1,414]

On 18/04/2020 at 20:55, CaptainSwing said:

Why would a benevolent God not interfere?  Why would He give us free will knowing that it would lead to Auschwitz?

 

Given the choice between Auschwitz and not having free will, I'd choose option 2.

If we don't have free will we become more robot than human. I'd say it was one of the defining characteristics of being human, to be able to make our own choices, ultimately between good and bad. But having  been given that freedom to make our own choices we have no right to expect God, benevolent or otherwise, to bale us out when we screw up.  

 

Sadly Auschwitz in not an exception, there have been plenty of other examples of man's inhumanity to man, both large and small, but also many exceptional and wonderful examples of bravery, altruism, kindness and love. We just have to decide which side we're on.

[Guest makapaka]

25 minutes ago, Anna B said:

If we don't have free will we become more robot than human. I'd say it was one of the defining characteristics of being human, to be able to make our own choices, ultimately between good and bad. But having  been given that freedom to make our own choices we have no right to expect God, benevolent or otherwise, to bale us out when we screw up.  

 

Sadly Auschwitz in not an exception, there have been plenty of other examples of man's inhumanity to man, both large and small, but also many exceptional and wonderful examples of bravery, altruism, kindness and love. We just have to decide which side we're on.

Maybe we are just capable of that as a species.

 

why would a god say - im in charge - but do what you want?

 

i don’t know the answer - and id never run down anyone who believes in god because sometimes when I’ve been in a bad way I still say “help me out god” so I suppose something inside me hopes there’s someone who can do something is listening. 

I suppose everyone wants to know there’s something - because it’s impossible to explain otherwise - maybe we’re just lucky.

 

maybe we’re just a conscious being in a big wave of weirdness thats going on and have somehow managed to think about it a bit but never understand it and maybe in millions of years someone else or some other species will.

 

it would be really weird if in the small

amount of time we have been on the planet we’d all found a different god that was the true god.

[Annie Bynnol 612]

11 hours ago, Anna B said:

I don't think they're meaningless questions. They are the sort of questions that drive us on. 

Religion and philosophy have answered those questions over and over again and in many ways and with certainty.

There are many  churches, chapels, websites, TV and Radio channels etc. that can give you the truth.

 

If you are not happy with the answers provided you could look elsewhere for alternatives and there are plenty with loads of views.

 

You might find one that is based on a accumulation of observations and explanations over many thousands of years  which fit  in with other many other sets of observations and explanations to create a picture of what is known.

If an explanation doesn't fit in with the rest then it must be investigated and resolved and it may be that other explanations have to change.

The picture becomes clearer, brighter and deeper and indicates where to look next and the need for "faith" and "belief" will continue to recede.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 20, 2020 by Annie Bynnol

[Justin Smith 10]

Nobody knows for certain whether God exists, nobody has proved he doesn't for sure. But, as I said to an agnostic friend of mine, surely it's wise not to annoy him too much just to be on the safe side ! 

[Annie Bynnol 612]

6 hours ago, Justin Smith said:

Nobody knows for certain whether God exists, nobody has proved he doesn't for sure. But, as I said to an agnostic friend of mine, surely it's wise not to annoy him too much just to be on the safe side ! 

This argument is called 'Pascal's wager'.

As it is impossible to prove something doesn't exist, there always remains the tiniest chance/possibility that a god might give you a hard Being a hypocrite and accepting a god reduces your chance of no change or the suffering the wrath of the vengeful god from 50/50 to 1 in 4.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Baron99 795]

Does God exist? 

 

Slightly different angle to the question? 

 

1. Does it REALLY matter if God exists or not, except to the individual?  

 

2. If God exists in the individual, why the need for organised religion? 

 

3. Why in the 21st century, do some feel the need for a God or to believe in a God? 

 

Edited April 25, 2020 by Baron99

[apelike 10]

2 hours ago, Baron99 said:

3. Why in the 21st century, do some feel the need for a God or to believe in a God? 

 Insecurity and the lack of belief and confidence in oneself.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Baron99 said:

Does God exist? 

 

Slightly different angle to the question? 

 

1. Does it REALLY matter if God exists or not, except to the individual?  

 

2. If God exists in the individual, why the need for organised religion? 

 

3. Why in the 21st century, do some feel the need for a God or to believe in a God? 

 

You think technological improvements and modernization reduces the spiritual need of God?

 

Think again.

[Waldo 96]

What I don’t understand, is how can we ask such a question (does god exist) without first fully understanding the quantities we refer to as ‘god’ and ‘exist’.

 

Also, the limitations and scope of the tools we have at our disposal to comprehend such quantities, are a significant consider here...

 

For example, without considering what we mean by god, just looking at the ‘exist’ side of the question; how do we know that this god thing is limited to a state of existing OR not existing. Can both be true? Certainly, I think our minds have a hard time contemplating such a state of affairs, but is reality bound by the limitations of our capacity to define it?

 

 

Edited April 26, 2020 by Waldo

[Annie Bynnol 612]

4 hours ago, Mr Fisk said:

You think technological improvements and modernization reduces the spiritual need of God?

 

Think again.

All religious people and their religious organizations have used "...technological improvements and modernization..." throughout history.

 

Chapels, churches, cathedrals,

Paintings, statues, icons, murals and stained glass,

First bible printed and distributed  in 1454.

1920's BBC religion on radio.

1950'sTV advertising

1980's Digital copies online with interactive explanation/translations/interpretations.

Pope live from Rome via satellite.

Every"...technological improvements and modernization..." has been used to advertise religions.

 

Also I do not understand what "...the spiritual need of God?"  means or implies after 10 year of state funded indoctrination, so the question is a) false, b) can only be answered by people who do a religion.

 

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, Annie Bynnol said:

All religious people and their religious organizations have used "...technological improvements and modernization..." throughout history.

 

Chapels, churches, cathedrals,

Paintings, statues, icons, murals and stained glass,

First bible printed and distributed  in 1454.

1920's BBC religion on radio.

1950'sTV advertising

1980's Digital copies online with interactive explanation/translations/interpretations.

Pope live from Rome via satellite.

Every"...technological improvements and modernization..." has been used to advertise religions.

 

Also I do not understand what "...the spiritual need of God?"  means or implies after 10 year of state funded indoctrination, so the question is a) false, b) can only be answered by people who do a religion.

 

The need to have some meaning, being spritual exists in all of us.

I accept some may not (and do not) subscribe to a particular religion, as I agree this can be quite a loaded point.

 

But I do hold the view that by our innate disposition, we seek meaning, we need to worship something- for some this may be even a materialistic thing (that they make their 'god').

 

Atheism in itself cannot explain this natural state of humans- if it were true (that atheism is the default position as some claim) how does it explain the nature of God. There are people who have had no religious upbringing  but then find a spritual meaning/answer that is not materialistic.

 

Also to answer earlier point made by Baron99, religion/belief in God exists even in atheist states like China and former sovient union.

Despite state controlled atheism, people naturally find their innate belief that there exists something far more greater and intelligent then anything else.