Can a full service cause an ECU fuel pump problem?

[SnailyBoy 10]

It's an Audi 2.5Tdi Sports convertible. I understand that things fail - but fifteen minutes after picking it up from a service which could have resulted in air being put in the system and it dies? I must stress again that the car was running beautifully before it went into the garage. It only went in for a routine service.

 

 

 

My car died and wouldn't start again. It turned over but wouldn't fire. We had to be recovered from the motorway.

 

Apparently it's been diagnostically tested and it's coming up with the fuel pump. Issue now is...who should pay? The car is now with someone I don't know - as it was moved there by my garage. They're the ones that, I assume, will be completing the work. The people I have the issue with are the garage where it was first taken. I have reason to believe that they're the ones responsible for the problem.

 

I understand, the same thing happened to mine. It wouldn't start after cutting out. I'm trying (in a clumsy way) to reiterate the point that diagnostics don't always give the full truth. As the poster earlier said, fuel pumps don't tend to just 'go'. I'd be looking for possible alternatives before fighting to see who pays £2000 and the problem still being there.

 

Saying that though, if you really feel that the servicing garage is to blame then I would raise it directly with them. That's the only way you're going to get your car back without battering your bank balance.

[alchresearch 208]

Apparently it's been diagnostically tested and it's coming up with the fuel pump.

 

Get a second opinion. Like I said earlier, both a generic garage and the AA told a customer of mine that his Peugeot needed a new high pressure fuel pump because there was no fuel being fed to the injectors.

 

I realise they have limited knowledge of every single car and their faults and may rely on a code reader, but being a Peugeot expert I knew that it wouldn't need a new high pressure pump, and I was right.

[truman 10]

Get a second opinion. Like I said earlier, both a generic garage and the AA told a customer of mine that his Peugeot needed a new high pressure fuel pump because there was no fuel being fed to the injectors.

 

I realise they have limited knowledge of every single car and their faults and may rely on a code reader, but being a Peugeot expert I knew that it wouldn't need a new high pressure pump, and I was right.

 

Might be best in this instance to bite the bullet and let an Audi dealer have a look...? Although it may be difficult if the car is off the road I suppose...

[BigAl#13 10]

I can do a full system scan using the tool they use at the dealership called VAGCOM if you wish (however you'll have to pm me as I do it in my own time and that's in short supply at the moment), which "might" be able to give a better indication of what is going on.

 

I will hasten to add I am not a business/tuner/auto-electrician etc just an enthusiast who doesn't like to pay dealer prices for them plugging in a cable and reading an ECU log.

 

What year is the Audi? Knowing this would dictate either PD or CR systems on the vehicle.

 

Depending on type an air leak/fuel leak could cause the problem, but (again depending on fuel system type) it might not be noticeable if it is at the high pressure end (such high pressure that fuel vapourises and not noticeable to human eye).

 

Personally I would look at the system between the fuel lift pump and injector rail (if CR) or injectors (if PD) as if the system doesn't reach pressure it will not pump simply put and so shuts off the engine.

[alchresearch 208]

Does the VAGCOM do parameter measurements?

 

On Peugeots we have LEXIA3 and Diagbox which shows reference voltages, current and pressure and actual readings on the car, so its easy to see where the problem lies.

[tony2 10]

let a audi specalist have a look at it, they know a lot more then most dealer mechcanics, thats why i only take my car to a specialist and not we fix any car type of garage

[RootsBooster 24]

My Audi A4 2.5Tdi had been running absolutely fine with no problems whatsoever. A couple of weeks ago it went in to the garage for it's routine service (air filter, fuel filter, etc etc)

 

When I went to pick my car up on the Thursday, the mechanics asked me if I was going any long distance over the weekend. I replied that I wasn't. They told me to drive carefully and that if I smelled fuel or oil to go back there immediately. But in any case I should call back on Tuesday at my earliest convenience as they needed to check things over. Apparently something to do with a seal or something they'd changed. I agreed to go back on Tuesday morning (it was B/H weekend so couldn't go on Monday)

 

Anyway, fifteen minutes after collecting it from the service, driving down the motorway, I went to accelerate and the engine died on me. Only light on the dashboard was the glow plug system light (it looks like a little spring)

 

I got towed to the garage where I had it serviced. They had the car for several days, during which time I made several calls to try and find out what was happening. During one call, one of the mechanics said that they weren't sure what was happening - or if the problem was actually linked to work that they had done, so they were going to get an expert in.

 

Expert came in with diagnostic tools. Apparently these mobile ones weren't sophisticated enough so the car was then moved to the expert's base in Conisborough. I've just called my regular garage today (for the umpteenth time this last ten days) to be told that apparently the expert has diagnosed fuel pump ECU.

 

My question is: Is there any chance that the work done at the service could potentially have been linked to the problem I'm now having? (the fuel filter was changed as part of the service). Or are they completely and totally seperate and the problem would have happened regardless? It just seems very coincidental that the car was running perfectly and then as soon as it went into the garage, it suddenly developed a problem.

 

Also, if it is the garage's fault, I don't see why I should have to pay for the work to be carried out. Had I not taken the car in for a service then it would still be fine. But because they've had the car transported to the expert's base, it would seem that I have to pay the expert directly for any work that is completed and therefore the garage can essentially just wriggle out of accepting any responsibility.

 

Thanks in advance for any help you may be able to give me.

 

I'd say that's your starting point right there. They've told you there might be something wrong (after they've fiddled with it) with a seal in the fuel system. If this seal is leaking, it can affect your fuel pressure. This will lead to an error code being stored in the ECU, which may be interpreted as the fuel pump.

It does not mean the fault lies in the fuel pump.

 

I'd contact trading standards immediately, make them aware of your situation and ask their advice before you go any further.

 

(It's also worth noting that some VAG TDi engines suffer problems with the injectors and wiring loom)

[neeeeeeeeeek 10]

Different car, but GF's Ibiza had a warning light on. Garage computer read the error as the ABS pump they quoted big bucks to replace it. Spoke to a small independent about it who said pop it in as he thought he knew what it might be. Turns out there was another set of fuses in the housing for the battery of all places. The ABS fuse had blown, 25p plus a tenner to clear the code.

 

This chap has seen the main dealer charge a grand to replace the pump for another customer when the fault was a 25p fuse.

 

As said above, don't let this garage replace the fuel pump, get advise, get it looked at independently before doing anything esle.

[Shogun 10]

They should not have touched the car if they did not have the proper Audi diagnostic OBD kit,a lot of modern diesel cars have very complicated electronics and you have to pre program the ECU before you do any work on the fuel system,I would suggest that they have changed the diesel fuel filter without programing it to let the ECU know the work is going to be done,they have had problems getting it going after and have probably been disconnecting injector pipes and things,that is why with some of these modern expensive cars you are better off taking it to the main dealers.

[tony2 10]

They should not have touched the car if they did not have the proper Audi diagnostic OBD kit,a lot of modern diesel cars have very complicated electronics and you have to pre program the ECU before you do any work on the fuel system,I would suggest that they have changed the diesel fuel filter without programing it to let the ECU know the work is going to be done,they have had problems getting it going after and have probably been disconnecting injector pipes and things,that is why with some of these modern expensive cars you are better off taking it to the main dealers.

 

How many small garage who think they can fix any car have the proper audi OBD kit, thats why i always said avoid we fix any car type garage

[RootsBooster 24]

How many small garage who think they can fix any car have the proper audi OBD kit, thats why i always said avoid we fix any car type garage

 

Many small garages have an OBD device (EOBD to use the proper name), that's the problem, OBD isn't the "proper Audi" diagnostic equipment. Not only that, most don't know how to use OBD properly, will just read what it says on the screen and (at the cost of the customer) replace any part mentioned on the screen. OBD is a basic, universal system, designed to help diagnose emissions related faults. It's better than nothing but only if you understand what you're doing.

 

VAG equipment is required for Audi diagnosis.

 

EDIT: There are some small garages with a good reputation for diagnosing and fixing all makes, just as many of the main franchise dealerships have a bad reputation for not being able to diagnose/fix correctly the brand they specialise in!

Edited April 11, 2013 by RootsBooster

[AngryDog 10]

VCDS is the only equipment to use on VAG cars (Used to be Vagcom) if you dont mind paying the money for it.

 

It does alsorts. It can do datalogging, allow you to change settings on the convenience module (speed locking, one door unlock, etc) amongst other things. Its a really good piece of kit.

 

Other car manufacturers have their own, and they all do much the same, but then they would as they're dealer level.