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The Green Deal scheme

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If the installer is the Assessors then he pays for every quote done.

If the provider is doing the Assessment then the cost will be added somewhere.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2013 at 17:53 ----------

 

The EPC thing needs to be paid for as well. Is it just a big con or will it work, only time will tell

 

True, there are costs involved in the assessment, in the same way that there are costs in notifying the installation of a new boiler with gas safe. When they introduced gas work notification, did this massively impact what was being charged for the install? No, because a few pounds is all this really costs.

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True, there are costs involved in the assessment, in the same way that there are costs in notifying the installation of a new boiler with gas safe. When they introduced gas work notification, did this massively impact what was being charged for the install? No, because a few pounds is all this really costs.

Maybe you do not understand, it costs £2 to reg a boiler with gas safe and this is on a completed job.

With the green deal you still have to pay this but also there is a cost involved in every quote ,say it costs £30 per quote and you sell 1 job in 4 then that means the customer that buys from you will have £120 added onto there job.

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So the poor pay for landlords to do there houses up, yep seems really fair to me.

 

As apposed to the poor making the energy companies rich because of the extra energy they are having to pay for just to try to keep their inefficient house warm.

 

The Green Deal is fantastic for landlords, because it will enable them to improve their property at no upfront cost. Your correct in that whoever pays the bill is paying for the improvements, but yet again it will be the savings made from the installed technologies that will pay for themselves. So the tenant will be no worse off as long as the golden rule has been met.

You could argue that the tenant will benefit from a more comfortable house. If the tennant is no worse off, but has greater comfort then that is only a positive thing.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2013 at 18:35 ----------

 

Maybe you do not understand, it costs £2 to reg a boiler with gas safe and this is on a completed job.

With the green deal you still have to pay this but also there is a cost involved in every quote ,say it costs £30 per quote and you sell 1 job in 4 then that means the customer that buys from you will have £120 added onto there job.

 

Ok. So when you go to do a quote, it costs you in time, fuel, insurance, paper, ink, phone calls. Lets say you win 1 in 4 quotes, does this mean the person who you do the job for picks up the bill for these fixed costs? Yes it does. But this isn't frowned upon is it?

 

I understand perfectly.

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As apposed to the poor making the energy companies rich because of the extra energy they are having to pay for just to try to keep their inefficient house warm.

 

The Green Deal is fantastic for landlords, because it will enable them to improve their property at no upfront cost. Your correct in that whoever pays the bill is paying for the improvements, but yet again it will be the savings made from the installed technologies that will pay for themselves. So the tenant will be no worse off as long as the golden rule has been met.

You could argue that the tenant will benefit from a more comfortable house. If the tennant is no worse off, but has greater comfort then that is only a positive thing.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2013 at 18:35 ----------

 

 

Ok. So when you go to do a quote, it costs you in time, fuel, insurance, paper, ink, phone calls. Lets say you win 1 in 4 quotes, does this mean the person who you do the job for picks up the bill for these fixed costs? Yes it does. But this isn't frowned upon is it?

 

I understand perfectly.

The £120 is on top of all the other costs you have said.

The landlord will do really well out of it, tenants paying to add valve to the landlords houses.

You have been sold it well but in my opinion it just does not seem as good as you say.

All the green deal jobs will be done at a much higher cost and then paid for by people that don't own the house. Is this something like the rich get richer and the poor pay for it.

Sounds like the bankers all over again.

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The £120 is on top of all the other costs you have said.

The landlord will do really well out of it, tenants paying to add valve to the landlords houses.

You have been sold it well but in my opinion it just does not seem as good as you say.

All the green deal jobs will be done at a much higher cost and then paid for by people that don't own the house. Is this something like the rich get richer and the poor pay for it.

Sounds like the bankers all over again.

 

Why will Green Deal jobs be done at higher costs? Why will it be paid for by people who don't own the house? Your forgetting that Green Deal is available to all, home owners and tenants.

 

I keep saying it.... the savings made are used to pay off the loan, i.e. it pays for itself.

 

Cost of replacing inefficient boiler with band A condensing boiler.... £1000

 

Annual energy savings from installing new boiler..... £300

 

Length of boiler guarantee.... 5 years

 

Therefore savings x guarantee (£300 x 5).......£1500

 

The interest on the loan at 6.9% over 5years.....£185

 

So total cost of repaying boiler via green Deal.... £1185

 

So the total savings over 5 years (£1500) minus the cost of Green Deal loan over 5 years (£1185)........£315

 

So lets say the average monthly gas bill at the property is £70 per month

 

the savings from installing the new boiler are (£300 divided by 12months)....£25 per month

 

The monthly Green Deal loan repayments are (£1185 divided by 60months).....£19.75 per month.

 

So lets compare the gas bill before Green Deal.... £70

 

With the gas bill after Green Deal, once the savings and loan repayments are being made..... £70, minus £25, plus £19.75 = £64.75

 

So as you can see, new boiler under Green Deal is paying for itself, and the gas bill is still £5.25 per month cheaper than it was. This is because it meets the golden rule and the savings made are greater than the cost of installing the boiler, plus interest on the loan, over the length of the warranty.

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Why will Green Deal jobs be done at higher costs? Why will it be paid for by people who don't own the house? Your forgetting that Green Deal is available to all, home owners and tenants.

 

I keep saying it.... the savings made are used to pay off the loan, i.e. it pays for itself.

 

Cost of replacing inefficient boiler with band A condensing boiler.... £1000

 

Annual energy savings from installing new boiler..... £300

 

Length of boiler guarantee.... 5 years

 

Therefore savings x guarantee (£300 x 5).......£1500

 

The interest on the loan at 6.9% over 5years.....£185

 

So total cost of repaying boiler via green Deal.... £1185

 

So the total savings over 5 years (£1500) minus the cost of Green Deal loan over 5 years (£1185)........£315

 

So lets say the average monthly gas bill at the property is £70 per month

 

the savings from installing the new boiler are (£300 divided by 12months)....£25 per month

 

The monthly Green Deal loan repayments are (£1185 divided by 60months).....£19.75 per month.

 

So lets compare the gas bill before Green Deal.... £70

 

With the gas bill after Green Deal, once the savings and loan repayments are being made..... £70, minus £25, plus £19.75 = £64.75

 

So as you can see, new boiler under Green Deal is paying for itself, and the gas bill is still £5.25 per month cheaper than it was. This is because it meets the golden rule and the savings made are greater than the cost of installing the boiler, plus interest on the loan, over the length of the warranty.

 

We all have our opinions and mine is that the biggest take up will be the poor that cannot get credit etc or those in rented houses,

In both cases this makes the rich richer and the poor pay the bill.

People that have the money or can get a loan would not want this as it will cost more in the long term and will be some hassle if selling etc, my i went on the course the trainers told us this.

The golden rule is a joke as its just a scam to get all them EPC done again ( at a cost )

Much cheaper to ring 3/4 plumbers and get a quote.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2013 at 22:47 ----------

 

Also your figure do not stack up, or are very different to the ones we where show on the training.

It was clear that they were saying demand will be high and this in turn will help your margin, this is what we where told.

I can see you have invested big in this and you do not want my comments but there the truth as I see it from the training I had.

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We all have our opinions and mine is that the biggest take up will be the poor that cannot get credit etc or those in rented houses,

In both cases this makes the rich richer and the poor pay the bill.

People that have the money or can get a loan would not want this as it will cost more in the long term and will be some hassle if selling etc, my i went on the course the trainers told us this.

The golden rule is a joke as its just a scam to get all them EPC done again ( at a cost )

Much cheaper to ring 3/4 plumbers and get a quote.

 

---------- Post added 27-01-2013 at 22:47 ----------

 

Also your figure do not stack up, or are very different to the ones we where show on the training.

It was clear that they were saying demand will be high and this in turn will help your margin, this is what we where told.

I can see you have invested big in this and you do not want my comments but there the truth as I see it from the training I had.

 

What a stupid statement to make.

 

Prove the figures don't stack up and give reasons why!

 

I recon the training you've had is the biggest load of old rubbish and a complete waste of your time. If someone has told you that Green Deal is a cash cow and you should start rubbing your hands together, then I would seriously question their ethics.

 

Your quite right, I have invested big in this, but not financially. I have taken alot of time to read the facts, and obtain the right information from the right sources. What I haven't done is take the advice from an unreliable, inaccurate, single source of information like you have done.

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What a stupid statement to make.

 

Prove the figures don't stack up and give reasons why!

 

I recon the training you've had is the biggest load of old rubbish and a complete waste of your time. If someone has told you that Green Deal is a cash cow and you should start rubbing your hands together, then I would seriously question their ethics.

 

Your quite right, I have invested big in this, but not financially. I have taken alot of time to read the facts, and obtain the right information from the right sources. What I haven't done is take the advice from an unreliable, inaccurate, single source of information like you have done.

 

 

 

I have also research this as well, always looking at ways to bring business in.

Please tell me which points are inaccurate or unreliable ?

Seems to me you have just taken all the positives and not read the negitives.

Time will tell,

Regards.

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You can upgrade heating systems, insulate better etc etc to your hearts content but until our attitudes to energy use change then it will be the same old story.

We waste so much energy in our homes through laziness and bad habits. I'd hazard a guess that you can make a huge dent in your bills by simply using your energy more sparingly and efficiently.

 

What if there aren't any savings? How is the loan paid for then? There's no guarantee that a householder will see those figures quoted below. Your annual energy savings are based on exact energy usage with new boiler and haven't taken into account the inevitable energy price increases that would all but wipe it out or the attitude of said homeowner. What if its a particularly cold winter???

 

The figures stack up nicely on a fact sheet but I suspect reality will differ

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I have also research this as well, always looking at ways to bring business in.

Please tell me which points are inaccurate or unreliable ?

Seems to me you have just taken all the positives and not read the negitives.

Time will tell,

Regards.

 

I have read the negatives! If you read through my previous posts I have stated what they are.

 

The Green Deal wont suit everyone.

 

It is important not to lose sight of the key points of Green Deal which are...

 

* Its purpose is to reduce the UK's carbon emmissions.

 

*It is a frame work to enable people to upgrade their property to a more energy efficient standard without having to put in the capital up front themselves.

 

*Under ECO (Energy Company Obligation), people who meet certain criteria i.e. are in receipt of certain benefits, or live in a difficult to treat property (solid wall / narrow cavity), can have access to grant funding to enable them to install the identified improvement measures free of charge.

 

*Under the golden rule criteria of Green Deal, the energy cost savings produced by the installed measures, have to be equal to or greater than the cost of repaying the Green Deal loan (including the interest).

 

*In simple terms, the technology will pay for itself.

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I'm really sceptical about the Green Deal. Last year my tenant had free additional loft insualtion put in on a government scheme. I think it is causing a problem with condensation and mould, it's almost as if the house can't breathe anymore. I would be very reluctant to have the gable end wall insulated externally (cost £10K) on the Green Deal, not just because it would take so long to recoup the outlay, but I'm not sure that it wouldn't cause me more problems. I have had some considerable correspondence with the Government department on this matter. They do not realise that many terraced houses built in the early 20th century do not have cavity walls, and the cost of insulating them set against the benefits/possible damage is not easily calculated. I'm a good landlord, and I would do anything to help my tenant have lower fuel bills, any suggestions/experiences would be most welcome.

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I'm really sceptical about the Green Deal. Last year my tenant had free additional loft insualtion put in on a government scheme. I think it is causing a problem with condensation and mould, it's almost as if the house can't breathe anymore. I would be very reluctant to have the gable end wall insulated externally (cost £10K) on the Green Deal, not just because it would take so long to recoup the outlay, but I'm not sure that it wouldn't cause me more problems. I have had some considerable correspondence with the Government department on this matter. They do not realise that many terraced houses built in the early 20th century do not have cavity walls, and the cost of insulating them set against the benefits/possible damage is not easily calculated. I'm a good landlord, and I would do anything to help my tenant have lower fuel bills, any suggestions/experiences would be most welcome.

 

Low energy light bulbs, water saving measures to name but 2.

It's all about education...we're a wasteful society and that includes our energy usage.

 

If you took out a loan under the Green Deal scheme for improvements would you load that additional outlay onto the tenant in the way of higher rent? If you didn't, I'd bet the majority of landlords will.

A new tenant won't be there long enough to gain any significant benefit...you'd have upgraded your property and adjusted the rent to suit, therefore not out of pocket but with a more marketable property.

 

Look what happened with the solar feed in tariff system. A system that seemed to work well and was providing work to companies/individuals to install but offering an immediate and substantial benefit to the consumer...what do the government do??..withdraw the subsidy...and now we have the Green Deal scheme.

 

The figures quoted by another forum poster are fine on paper but in reality the calculations are based on estimates of average use and future energy prices. There is also a penalty for early repayment, you may have to pay up to £150 for an initial assessment and undergo a credit check. Suppliers can also decide to pass on further setup and operating charges if they so wish....and there are early repayment charges.

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