Virgin Trains to take legal action

[Mecky 10]

I reckon a few of you have been following the West Coast Mainline saga and the decision to not award the franchise to Virgin Trains. Now there's a new twist. So what do you people think?

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19402133

[tinfoilhat 11]

I don't think I've been on a train since privatisation but from what I've read virgin seemed to do an ok job, considering the infrastructure they have to work with. First don't seem to have much of a reputation (did they have a franchise taken off them ?) so can't see why they won it. That said I think it's the publics reaction to first winning it that has spurred Branson to appeal.

 

But with Dave saying no to third runway at heathrow, whilst not saying yes to anything else there needs to a long overdue conversation about transport in this country.

[Jeffrey Shaw 90]

Or is it just Mr Branson's obessive self-belief, that nothing adverse is ever allowed to happen to Virgin-branded enterprises?

[Mecky 10]

I know Branson has been wrangling with the government for quite a while on this and other things, now it looks like it comes to a head. Whether there's any corruption in the deal I doubt it, we might never know, but politics aside I think there's more to this than meets the eye. It seems a personal battle between Branson and the government, it's not as though Branson needs the money. I reckon he considers himself to be the Peoples' Champion.

[tinfoilhat 11]

I know Branson has been wrangling with the government for quite a while on this and other things, now it looks like it comes to a head. Whether there's any corruption in the deal I doubt it, we might never know, but politics aside I think there's more to this than meets the eye. It seems a personal battle between Branson and the government, it's not as though Branson needs the money. I reckon he considers himself to be the Peoples' Champion.

 

Maybe, maybe not but 150,000 signed the petition mentioned in the article so is he giving the people what they want ? First also said they were going to pay Dave a hefty 5.5bn (kerchingggggg !) and cut fairs by 15% and add a further 12000 sears in less than four years ? Bransons argument is that his bid was more deliverable. After the g4s farce I can believe that.

[dosxuk 10]

I don't think I've been on a train since privatisation but from what I've read virgin seemed to do an ok job, considering the infrastructure they have to work with.

 

Most of the infrastructure is publically funded, and organised and managed by organisations other than Virgin. e.g. the upgrade of the line was run by Railtrack & Network Rail.

 

The trains were bought by and owned by a rolling stock operater, leased to Virgin (contract for which ends on the same day as the current franchise), and most permenant staff (other than senior managment) will transfer under the TUPE procedures to the new franchise holder.

 

First don't seem to have much of a reputation (did they have a franchise taken off them ?)

 

No they haven't.

 

They also score higher in the punctuality and performance tables than Virgin, and Virgin's one franchise has had more complaints logged against it than all four of First's franchises put together in the last 12 months.

 

And contrary to the other big First rumour, they are not an American company.

 

There's an awful lot of FUD being stirred up by Virgin and others over this. A big bit being that every operator which has paid lots of money back to the Government has failed. So far two franchises have been handed back. One (GNER) because their parent company (shipping) collapsed, the second (NXEC) because they over bid. Branson has failed to mention that both his west coast and cross country franchises were basically failed for several years, being controlled by the DfT with Virgin on a management contract doing the DfT's bidding.

 

I preferred Virgin to First as operators until last week when Branson decided to throw his toys out of his pram. As whatever her name is (minister for transport) said this morning on the radio, the only time Virgin started complaining about the franchising and tendering system used was when it became clear they hadn't won.

[Jeffrey Shaw 90]

the only time Virgin started complaining about the franchising and tendering system used was when it became clear they hadn't won.

Yes, as I opined in post #3. Does Mr Branson complain much when the boot's on the other foot?

[Lexikia 10]

Having used the Virgin service a couple of times, the trains and carriages are excellent.

[Mecky 10]

Maybe, maybe not but 150,000 signed the petition mentioned in the article so is he giving the people what they want ? First also said they were going to pay Dave a hefty 5.5bn (kerchingggggg !) and cut fairs by 15% and add a further 12000 sears in less than four years ? Bransons argument is that his bid was more deliverable. After the g4s farce I can believe that.

 

Possibly but just because people don't sign a peition or whatever it doesn't they don't support him. Whether public opinion can force the government to change their minds or a least a reconsideration, I doubt it, but we'll just have to wait and see.

[dosxuk 10]

Having used the Virgin service a couple of times, the trains and carriages are excellent.

 

And won't be changing when First take over.

[Mecky 10]

And won't be changing when First take over.

 

It will be interesting to see which rolling stock First use and how much their increase prices to pay for their bid.

[dosxuk 10]

It will be interesting to see which rolling stock First use and how much their increase prices to pay for their bid.

 

They will be using exactly the same Pendolinos and Voyagers as currently used by Virgin.

 

The 11 additional new trains are rumoured to be additional Pendolinos, and were offered to all the bidders for the franchise.