Sad Border Terrier

[mrswentworth 10]

Our border terrier, Archie is eight, and unable to be walked off a lead as he suffers from nervous aggression and would attack another dog if off it. He's a wonderful dog and family pet and is very much loved! We just want to enjoy our walks with him and at the moment it is near on impossible. Any help or advice for socializing a dog of this age would be most welcome! He has been neutered and it's not made any difference.

Kathy x

[Antone 10]

My border terrier is worse on the lead. I think that's because dogs need a fair bit of space for their body language to work; like they need to be able to circle around each other at a good distance etc. So, when he's on a lead and on a pavement or path and there's not much room, that's when he kicks off.

 

What can you do about it? Show him you're the leader; put yourself between him and the threat. Perhaps also if you can find an open space to let him off the lead and where he may meet other dogs and get to socialise without feeling threatend that may help.

 

But at the end of the day BTs are potentially little fighters. They were bred to flush foxes from undergrowth so it's no surprise they can be aggressive, IMO

[teeny 10]

We walk one called Archie too , he suffers from the same, his owners took him to Katie patmore , he now walks off lead with no problems after a few months of input , he is 9 years old now.

[ccit 10]

This is a difficult problem, especially at 8 years old. Have you tried one to one sessions with a behaviourist? If not, someone on here may be able to recommend one.

The breed-specific forum is Border Terrier World and perhaps they might be able to help.

[H_Hounds 10]

We used to walk Skye late at night (9 or 10pm) cos she was really aggressive to other dogs, so it minimised the number of dogs we'd see on a walk. You could try this for a while, while you find a way to sort it out, while it is still light in the evening. It isn't nice to do this in winter when it's pitch black, though.

 

Do you use a flexi? This may also help initially, while you find a way to overcome this as he may not feel so threatened if he has more length of lead. It is true that they can be worse when on a short lead.

 

I have always found it is better to ignore nervous behaviour. Many people make the mistake of giving extra attention to a timid/nervous dog in attempt to make it feel more secure, but this will achieve the opposite.

 

It is important that you try a behaviourist/trainer, as we can easily misinterpret body language of our own dogs so you could be using the wrong methods and achieving nothing or even making the problem worse.

 

Good luck with this. It will take time and lots of patience but it is so rewarding when you get there.

 

We've had Skye for three years now and she is four. She gets calmer and calmer over time. Walks are enjoyable with her now but she will never be trusted or allowed to make her own decisions.

[Elizabeth13 10]

Evei would possibly be a good help here - you could always PM her.

She has/had a dog that was very reactive and aggressive to other dogs. With a lot of hardwork and patience she has turned him right around.

 

I would muzzle him if i were you. If you have an aggressive dog, on or off lead it is responsible to muzzle it. You could then let him off lead in areas, as long as you make sure there is no seeable dogs in the vicinity and feel confident in your dog returning to you should you tell him to.

[H_Hounds 10]

Evei would possibly be a good help here - you could always PM her.

She has/had a dog that was very reactive and aggressive to other dogs. With a lot of hardwork and patience she has turned him right around.

 

I would muzzle him if i were you. If you have an aggressive dog, on or off lead it is responsible to muzzle it. You could then let him off lead in areas, as long as you make sure there is no seeable dogs in the vicinity and feel confident in your dog returning to you should you tell him to.

 

I'm not sure about muzzling a nervous-aggressive dog (if it is due to fear) as this would make him worse. As long as you have him on a secure lead and aren't in crowded areas, I think that is best, personally.

 

But if he is extremely aggressive and unpredictable then, yes, muzzling would be sensible.

[bogwoppit 10]

Hi Mrs Wentworth! I adopted Gruffler at around the same age who we believe to probably be some sort of staffy/border terrier mix. He had exactly the same problem but was also pretty much completely deaf with no recall into the mix. Two years after adopting him, I can now walk him off lead and he is great with most dogs but I recall him and pop him on lead as soon as I see another dog just to be safe.

Evei was a great help to me and I would advise as many group dog walks as you can! I managed to pin down that Gruffler was only aggressive upon meeting dogs but would walk fine with them provided he had a good introduction. He was clearly frightened so I did everything I could to make his meetings with dogs into a positive experience rather than a negative. As soon as we saw another dog I would instruct him to sit (with a hand signal rather than voice) and reward him for doing so. I would continue to give him treats whilst he was calm and sitting until the other dog passed or, if we were walking together, we carried on our walk. If he got in anyway aggressive or worked up, I would do my best to calmly keep walking but the treats went away, no tellings off.

I should mention that he was muzzled and I cut a hole in the muzzle to feed him treats. It has taken nearly two years and I went through a longline stage, then a drag line for quite a long time before we were ready for off lead, and still I kept the muzzle for some time when he went off lead. Let me know if you ever want a walk together and I'll try and tell you more - I don't want to go too in depth, as every dog is different. As mentioned, Evei is brilliant and has done wonders with D. Again his problems were very different but I picked up loads of handy hints from walking with her and D. Good luck - I will say though, if his problems are fear based, it is important not to make his interactions with other dogs any more negative and there needs to be lots of rewards for good behaviour rather than tellings off for bad.

[bogwoppit 10]

The muzzle was a necessity to us - in the on lead stage because he would potentially get so worked up that he would bite myself or my partner and in the later stages of training just in case a dog popped up out of no where. I think a muzzle is a must in order to be able to work through it. Get a baskerville muzzle and cut a hole in it so you can easily feed treats (an Evei top tip!). They can still drink and do everything so it's not a punishment but if a dog does pop up out of nowhere, the risk is lessened. It's also quite handy in some respects when you're in the early stages of training as people will see the muzzle and often stop their dogs bounding into you.

[H_Hounds 10]

The muzzle was a necessity to us - in the on lead stage because he would potentially get so worked up that he would bite myself or my partner and in the later stages of training just in case a dog popped up out of no where. I think a muzzle is a must in order to be able to work through it. Get a baskerville muzzle and cut a hole in it so you can easily feed treats (an Evei top tip!). They can still drink and do everything so it's not a punishment but if a dog does pop up out of nowhere, the risk is lessened. It's also quite handy in some respects when you're in the early stages of training as people will see the muzzle and often stop their dogs bounding into you.

 

That's a fair comment and sound advice

 

I try not to muzzle dogs that I groom that can be aggressive, if I can avoid it as it makes grooming them very hard work and normally makes them more stressed so I really only do it if absolutely necessary (which is rare). That was the reason for my opinion on muzzling, but there's just me and the dog concerned there though, isn't there, and grooming added to it. so I guess it's totally different.

Edited June 28, 2012 by H_Hounds
added punctuation :)

[Evei 10]

It is hard work when they are so aggressive to other dogs, it really does take the enjoyment at of taking them out and normally they are such lovely dogs at home!

 

If you have not already, go and see a trainer that is used to working with dog on dog aggression. They will teach you some techniques and for the majority of dogs this does work. Even if it does not work at this stage you will use the techniques later on when the dog is able to respond to them. My dog would do anything to get to another dog to try and attack it, he would body slam the ground and be completely in a 'rage'. I had dog trainers give up on us, their techniques were good but he was very bad! I am not a trainer so I my views are my own, however I have spent a fair amount of time and money on seminars, dog trainers, classes, agility, group walks, rally o to try and understand how my dog works and what makes him happy.

 

For tougher cases it is a case of sticking at it and making sure your dog and others are safe when you are training. There is no quick fix. Do not avoid other dogs completely but keep at distance, once your dog is calm enough to be near other dogs (without getting too close or having any interactions with them, for us this was about 30 feet away!) get them to fun group training sessions that are very controlled and understanding with aggressive dogs. In my opinion it is all about making your dog feel comfortable in the same vicinity of other dogs and enjoying it. Some dogs may never get further than here but just the fact that they are calm near dogs makes life easier! I used a muzzle as he would have still attacked at the start if a dog had jumped on him or got too close. We did this for about 2 years gong to different training sessions / trainers so he was seeing lots of under control dogs. I was not too fussed what they were teaching us, for me it was all about getting him around other dogs that were controlled and that he was having fun when there! If your dog is not enjoying it you have moved too fast and it is a case of taking a step back and sticking at it then trying again a few weeks later.

 

Meanwhile I started to go on group dog walks, starting on lead with calm dogs then letting off the good dogs and then eventually mine (muzzled and with drag lines) Yes he did need telling sometimes but he was on a line and muzzled and was with dogs all bigger than himself. He also would get told off by other dogs that were 'nice' but had enough about them to warn him clearly it was not acceptable to be rude. He soon started to work out how to behave and the fact that other dogs did not want to hurt him. Watching him play bow to start play for the first time was the nicest feeling We then started agility, again a step up from slow moving dogs in classes to dogs running around and in an excited state, this worked wonders you choose where to stand and how close you get to other dogs. Again you must tell the trainer and be honest they need to know the risk your dog poses.

 

Some dogs will never get to the 'end' point, mixing with other dogs is just not for them. I know his 'flash' points so we avoid the situations, basically other male dogs that have that stiff odd body language and he can get over excited with some very fast dogs and I can see a 'prey' chase kick in so call him away to be on the safe side. He knows that he does not have to react back and the best feeling is seeing a dog tell him to go away nicely and him listening and waking off, this as been repeated time and time again and is now an embedded reaction.

 

This is his first summer muzzle free in the 4 summers we have had him Yes he will always have that side to him and I have no doubt if pushed to a point he would revert, but I hope I am a good enough dog owner to ensure he is not put in a position that he would feel he has to react.

 

Good luck, we are always happy to help if you need a dog to sit calmly when you train or walk on lead alongside you. I remember meeting someone off here who kindly did the same for us at the start of our journey. She got it spot on, she said it would take 3-4 years!

Edited June 28, 2012 by Evei
spelling spelling spelling!

[Evei 10]

That's a fair comment and sound advice

 

I try not to muzzle dogs that I groom that can be aggressive, if I can avoid it as it makes grooming them very hard work and normally makes them more stressed so I really only do it if absolutely necessary (which is rare). That was the reason for my opinion on muzzling, but there's just me and the dog concerned there though, isn't there, and grooming added to it. so I guess it's totally different.

 

You have to train them to wear a muzzle happily, it takes about 1-2 weeks. If you go slow and repeat often with lots of peanut butter and treats they accept it quite happily I think most dogs unused to wearing a muzzle would be very upset if suddenly introduced to one and it is where a lot of owners go wrong and stress the dog even more.

 

I can understand why you would have to do this as a groomer though! It really is down to the owner to train the dog to be used to a muzzle if they know that their dog is reactive at vets/ groomers so it lessens the stress for the dog. I know a groomer that also has a dog called Skye too! Sounds like you have put lots of hard work into her. Have you got any more tips for the op?

Edited June 29, 2012 by Evei