Ultimately, a child's education is more important than a holiday

[FrannyR 10]

As a trainee teacher I feel that one week a year does not dramatically effect a child's education. Yet the cultures, experiences and bonding then receive on these trips is invaluable. Learning isn't just about being sat in a classroom but learning about the life around them. As long as they aren't excessively absent I think it's perfectly justified. Children aren't children forever. And for the sake off five days school, a childhood worth of memories is made.

[Doctor Drew 10]

As a kid I was taken out of school for a holiday and missed the start of my maths teacher covering calculus and my physics teacher covering boolean logic. I've since got to grips with it (I'm a research physicist ) but I felt this had a very detrimental effect on my education and confidence and it seemed a very long time (well into my A levels and in some respects even later) before I felt I'd caught up. I know of similar stories with friends and colleagues.

It's not even just academia that can suffer. A friend missed an end of year disco that ended up being the place where a great many new friendships were formed and felt this affected her for the rest of her time at school. She never really felt fully included.

Taking a child out of school for a holiday is a selfish exercise and the effects can be enormous.

[irenewilde 10]

I've voted Yes, because I can agree with the statement.

Now hear my rebuttal, my eldest daughter went 3 years without a holiday because we could only afford to take one in term time.

On the fourth year she once again was willing to miss a weeks holiday and carry on with her education, but I refused to leave her behind again.

Every child deserves a holiday at some point, should a child really have to rob themselves of a break for no other reason than affordability.

 

I had 3 holidays in my first 16 years because my parents couldn't afford the cost of holidaying at peak time. I didn't feel "robbed" or that I was suffering. It was just a fact of life, we didn't have the money so it didn't happen. People feel so entitled to everything these days.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:29 ----------

 

No, I don't. If education was fit for purpose I might agree but it isn't.

 

Frankly, in Sheffield, some schools are so bad that kids will learn more on a holiday than they will in school. Some schools would benefit from having certain kids out of school during term time.

 

Head teachers are turning out generations of kids barely able to read and write. I think they should have better things to worry about.

 

Education is just another one of those broken public services that costs the earth, delivers nightsoil and is one way traffic as far as changing the rules is concerned. How about the head teachers making it a rule that they make sure everyone who comes out of school can read and write and add up?

 

What a ridiculous generalisation.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:32 ----------

 

my children will be took out of school for there holidays simple as.they are aged 4 and 9 .will this really have an effect on their life ,i think not.i work like a donkey to do the best i can for my family and to have a headmaster to say no i cant take them out of school can go and sit on it.if it was gcse time then no but at that age come on get a grip.

 

 

And you'll be the first whining on here if you get a fine as a result. Looks like you might have had a few holidays in term time.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:38 ----------

 

Just because pupils are not in school does not mean they are not learning a week in another countries culture can be far more engaging and educational, instead of doing algebra again which by the way i have never used to this day.

 

I wonder what you do for a living.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:41 ----------

 

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/49640

 

please sign and share Emma needs 100'000 signatures by August 2013

 

You must be joking!

Edited June 3, 2013 by irenewilde

[honeyb35 10]

I notice a lot of attention has been paid to the cost of school holidays, but what about other reasons? There are many industries, such as farming, amongst others, where parents aren't able to holiday at certain times of the year, or are only allowed set holidays which may not co-incide with school ones. Families with a disabled member - there may be reasons they can't holiday during the busiest or hottest months, and a term time holiday is the only solution.

It's been mentioned about staggering holidays - in reality that just affects those who wish to holiday with others from a different LEA. In my personal experience, I like to holiday with a friend from Lincolnshire as she's a single parent with a disabled child and struggles on her own, but looking at school holiday times for next year, very few of them are at the same time which makes it impossible with this ruling, and that's not looking for a week away, perhaps just over a long weekend.

I understand what they are trying to do - we all know families who think nothing of booking several weeks away every year, never ask for catch up homework and teachers end up devoting time to them. But in trying to stop this and make it impossible for everyone, means it penalises those who don't take the mick, who believe in the importance of family time, combined with education and ensures at least part of the break is educational, or requests and ensures homework is taken and completed. It's also quite scary how little confidence the government has in citizens raising their own children, and using their common sense about the best interests of each child.

[Digsy 10]

I had 3 holidays in my first 16 years because my parents couldn't afford the cost of holidaying at peak time. I didn't feel "robbed" or that I was suffering. It was just a fact of life, we didn't have the money so it didn't happen. People feel so entitled to everything these days.

 

Cheeky bint, since when does wanting the best for your child equate to feeling entitled to everything, it doesn't.

My daughter is currently partaking in college redoing the GCSE's she wasn't adequately taught in school and working until late in a chip shop.

I haven't taught my child that she's entitled to everything, I've taught her to continually better herself and to earn her way.

She currently gets a 3hr break for five days of the week and works 6.

 

The difference being she can now book a cheap week from work/college and take that option without penalty.

Also throughout the whole of her schooling she only had that one year without a 100% attendance.

And to top it all off, home schooled children have the right to cheap holidays without the penalty of a fine, state schooled children aren't allowed to be treated equally?

 

I think your attitude stinks, what does it matter what anybody does for a living.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Digsy

[irenewilde 10]

Cheeky bint, since when does wanting the best for your child equate to feeling entitled to everything, it doesn't.

My daughter is currently partaking in college redoing the GCSE's she wasn't adequately taught in school and working until late in a chip shop.

I haven't taught my child that she's entitled to everything, I've taught her to continually better herself and to earn her way.

She currently gets a 3hr break for five days of the week and works 6.

 

The difference being she can now book a cheap week from work/college and take that option without penalty.

Also throughout the whole of her schooling she only had that one year without a 100% attendance.

And to top it all off, home schooled children have the right to cheap holidays without the penalty of a fine, state schooled children aren't allowed to be treated equally?

 

I think your attitude stinks, what does it matter what anybody does for a living.

 

It was your choice of words really - "should a child really have to rob themselves of a holiday", "every child deserves a holiday". It seemed a dramatic way of describing something that is a luxury to be bought if you can afford it. It's not life saving medical treatment. At no point did I say anything about what people do for a living (that would be silly seeing as I've already pointed out that we were quite poor when I was growing up). I'm sorry if having a differing opinion to yours makes me a "cheeky bint" with a stinking attitude.

[Alien52 10]

As a trainee teacher I feel that one week a year does not dramatically effect a child's education. Yet the cultures, experiences and bonding then receive on these trips is invaluable. Learning isn't just about being sat in a classroom but learning about the life around them. As long as they aren't excessively absent I think it's perfectly justified. Children aren't children forever. And for the sake off five days school, a childhood worth of memories is made.

 

As a retired teacher with 30+ years experience in Sheffield I can tell you that you are wrong.One example that comes to mind is that of a boy who was taken on holiday during his first two weeks at secondary school.His education never recovered and he did not form any friendships,perhaps he did have a "childhood worth of memories" but it really did not do him any good in educational terms.

This is just one of many examples of parental selfishness getting in the way of children's education I witnessed.

[donkey 10]

The Department For Education is proposing a ban on taking the children out of school in term time. Headteachers will no longer be able to authorise absence.

 

"Ultimately, a child's education is more important than a holiday" says the general secretary of the National Association of Headteachers in today's Times.

 

Do you agree?

 

What about the educational benefits of trips to other countries and regions? One of the smartest guys I know was brought up on the road and had no formal schooling. He speaks three languages fluently, produces excellent music, built his own house (very well) and generally seems to be able to turn his hand to anything.

 

Conversely, our education system turns its fair share of joyless, unimaginative drones, who never missed a class.

 

Unfortunately it is a system which is the product of a long line of dull minded, know-alls and control freaks in grey suits - Gove being the latest - who ignore all research and arrogantly steamroller their egocentric ideologically driven reforms over the wishes and advice of people working in the system who might possibly have some idea of what they are talking about.

 

If we had a system which took into consideration the huge body of research which now indicates that different personality types learn in different ways, your question might have more relevance, but as things stand, a lot of people are likely to find going on holiday a more useful learning experience than going to school for another week or two among hundreds.

[Digsy 10]

As a retired teacher with 30+ years experience in Sheffield I can tell you that you are wrong.One example that comes to mind is that of a boy who was taken on holiday during his first two weeks at secondary school.His education never recovered and he did not form any friendships,perhaps he did have a "childhood worth of memories" but it really did not do him any good in educational terms.

This is just one of many examples of parental selfishness getting in the way of children's education I witnessed.

 

Well you've shown me that 30+ years experience is worthless if you expect people to believe that his education never recovered from a couple of weeks at the beginning of term.

How preposterous to excuse a schools failures on a couple of weeks.

 

I have aspergers, I never had friends, still don't, and don't need any either.

I signed myself out of the education system at 15 and have never needed any bits of bonded paper nor regretted my choice.

As I have already stated home schooled children have the right to cheap holidays, state schooled children should be allowed the same.

 

And why is it any different when schools arrange holidays to france, Thornbridge Hall etc in term time.

 

This is nothing more than another Tory nail in their own coffin, a money making scheme to hit the already deprived folk.

Whilst damaging the UK's off-peak tourism industry.

 

---------- Post added 04-06-2013 at 16:22 ----------

 

It was your choice of words really - "should a child really have to rob themselves of a holiday", "every child deserves a holiday". It seemed a dramatic way of describing something that is a luxury to be bought if you can afford it. It's not life saving medical treatment. At no point did I say anything about what people do for a living (that would be silly seeing as I've already pointed out that we were quite poor when I was growing up). I'm sorry if having a differing opinion to yours makes me a "cheeky bint" with a stinking attitude.

 

Children that deny themselves a holiday on the grounds of education are robbing themselves in my opinion, they have a lifetime of educating, the good moments are becoming more frequently scarce.

 

Tell me were any of these three holidays you had as a child out of season or in term time as they like to call it.

 

And being a "cheeky bint" isn't anything to do with having a differing opinion and more having an attitude that wrongfully assumes someone with a differing opinion to your own is in some way believing their entitled to everything, extremely patronizing and slanderous.

 

bint (bnt)

n. Chiefly British & Offensive

A woman or girl.

[Arabic, daughter; see bn in Semitic roots.]

de·rog·a·to·ry

/diˈrägəˌtôrē/

Adjective

Showing a critical or disrespectful attitude.

 

And no I don't have any respect for your opinions they ended the second you slandered me.

Edited June 4, 2013 by Digsy

[irenewilde 10]

And being a "cheeky bint" isn't anything to do with having a differing opinion and more having an attitude that wrongfully assumes someone with a differing opinion to your own is in some way believing their entitled to everything, extremely patronizing and slanderous.

 

And no I don't have any respect for your opinions they ended the second you slandered me.

 

Wow. That's possibly the biggest over reaction I've ever seen on here. Well done.

[Digsy 10]

Wow. That's possibly the biggest over reaction I've ever seen on here. Well done.

 

And still with a patronizing attitude you retort.

 

Would you mind addressing my question, were any of your three holidays off peak?

 

I think the biggest over reaction on this thread is the fact people will be charged £60 for a weeks holiday by the education department, and £120 if not payed within x amount of time.

 

That to me sounds like the biggest over reaction here.

[Cyclone 10]

As a kid I was taken out of school for a holiday and missed the start of my maths teacher covering calculus and my physics teacher covering boolean logic. I've since got to grips with it (I'm a research physicist ) but I felt this had a very detrimental effect on my education and confidence and it seemed a very long time (well into my A levels and in some respects even later) before I felt I'd caught up. I know of similar stories with friends and colleagues.

It's not even just academia that can suffer. A friend missed an end of year disco that ended up being the place where a great many new friendships were formed and felt this affected her for the rest of her time at school. She never really felt fully included.

Taking a child out of school for a holiday is a selfish exercise and the effects can be enormous.

 

You missed the first week of starting your GCSEs? Now that would seem to be a little foolish, and who wants to go on holiday in September anyway? (Actually I do, but I can go whenever I like).

 

On the other hand, at the end of the school year, nothing new is being taught, at best the last week is revising things already covered and cementing that knowledge, at worst it's wind down week where they teachers do little and the children less.

Can't comment too much on the disco, but it seems odd, if they've been in school together for a year or years then it's hardly going to be an event where many new friendships are suddenly formed.

 

---------- Post added 04-06-2013 at 18:28 ----------

 

I had 3 holidays in my first 16 years because my parents couldn't afford the cost of holidaying at peak time. I didn't feel "robbed" or that I was suffering. It was just a fact of life, we didn't have the money so it didn't happen. People feel so entitled to everything these days.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:29 ----------

 

 

What a ridiculous generalisation.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:32 ----------

 

 

 

And you'll be the first whining on here if you get a fine as a result. Looks like you might have had a few holidays in term time.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:38 ----------

 

 

I wonder what you do for a living.

 

---------- Post added 03-06-2013 at 23:41 ----------

 

 

You must be joking!

 

I had a few holidays in term time Irene, from memory it was probably between 3 and 5.

I don't think it had any detrimental effect though, I've still got a degree, a career and a successful business.

 

---------- Post added 04-06-2013 at 18:30 ----------

 

As a retired teacher with 30+ years experience in Sheffield I can tell you that you are wrong.One example that comes to mind is that of a boy who was taken on holiday during his first two weeks at secondary school.His education never recovered and he did not form any friendships,perhaps he did have a "childhood worth of memories" but it really did not do him any good in educational terms.

This is just one of many examples of parental selfishness getting in the way of children's education I witnessed.

 

On the other hand, loosing the last 2 weeks of his time at Junior school would most likely have had no measurable affect at all.

So maybe the rule should be no term time holidays at the start of term...