Why do we have to pay for AV software?

[wizzardofODD 10]

ANY software is free , if you know where to look & how to apply the cracks heehee

[waddler8 10]

I spend all my cash on a laptop with Microsoft Windows XP or Vista or some other brand name, only to find that I am not fully protected from the terrors of the internet! Shouldn't Microsoft put full security systems in place before selling us their products? I have spent a small fortune over the years fighting of worms, trojans and the likes via outside AV software, as the supplied software was not up to the task!

 

There's more vendors than just microsoft with software thats vulnerable to exploits.

 

There is plenty of free software that will adequately protect your pc.

 

Shouldn't house builders make it so burglars can't break in?

[dosxuk 10]

The vast majority of current viri and other malware rely on social engineering to work, rather than problems in the underlying OS. If you can convince someone to run your code, you can do what you like to that machine regardless of the OS.

 

The only reason you can get viruses on Windows is because Microsoft ignored established security principles when they wrote it. It's a design flaw in Windows, a massive one.

 

Which established security principles relevant to a home user in 1983 did MS ignore when creating Windows?

 

That's completely untrue. Mac users are a really big target, they tend to be wealthier than PC users, but there are no Mac viruses or worms 'in the wild', not one.

 

If there isn't one virus or worm in the wild which can infect Macs, why does antivirus, anti-malware, firewall etc software exist for the platform? This website - http://www.securemac.com/ - lists a large number of active and possible exploits, along with links to protect and/or fix the problems.

[PC Brigade 10]

 

 

If there isn't one virus or worm in the wild which can infect Macs, why does antivirus, anti-malware, firewall etc software exist for the platform? This website - http://www.securemac.com/ - lists a large number of active and possible exploits, along with links to protect and/or fix the problems.

 

A firewall serves a totally different purpose to AV software, and you should use one OSX and Linux as well as Windows.

 

The site you linked to is designed to sell securemac's own product - called MacScan. It is in their interest to make you think there is a significant threat and that you need to buy their software - there isn't, and anyone familiar with OSX will tell you to avoid MacScan - its generally regarded as a scareware.

 

You also say 'IF there isn't one virus or worm in the wild which can infect Macs' - there is no 'IF' about it - they simply do not exist for OSX.

 

A couple of TROJANs do exist for OSX - but these require the user to download pirated software, install it, and give it their admin password. The latest version of OSX detects these anyway, so you would have to be incredibly stupid to get caught out by these.

 

So the answer to your question is simple - they exist because AV companies can make money by selling them to gullible idiots.

[waddler8 10]

Interesting reading?

 

http://www.viruslist.com/en/analysis?pubid=204791925

 

Truly new malware is rare in the *nix world, in spite of the fact that just as many vulnerabilities are found in Unix and Linux applications and kernels as are found in Windows. As long as the relatively limited popularity of such systems keeps cyber criminals focused on other operating systems, Unix users can sleep relatively peacefully.

 

In November 2006 the Month of Kernel Bugs (MoKB) project was launched (http://projects.info-pull.com/mokb/). The aim of this project was to detect and disclose kernel vulnerabilities in various operating systems. This study showed that Linux ranked number one in terms of the number of vulnerabilities found (11), followed closely by OS X (10). The list also included FreeBSD, Sun OS, Microsoft and driver manufacturers.

 

The number of problems identified in both the Linux kernel itself and in Linux applications shows that virus writers are offered plenty of security loopholes to exploit using malicious code. It’s clear that in the future, Linux could face the same security issues as Windows.

[anywebsite 10]

Which established security principles relevant to a home user in 1983 did MS ignore when creating Windows?

 

File Permissions. They've been trying to play catchup ever since & still haven't got there. If they had a sensible user & file permissions system, like the one Unix had been using for over 10 years at that point, Windows viruses would never have existed.

[anywebsite 10]

Interesting reading?

 

http://www.viruslist.com/en/analysis?pubid=204791925

 

Not at all. Over 50% of the internet's web servers are running some Unix variant, it's a huge target, unix has been around for longer than windows too, it was the dominant computer os at one point, it still didn't get viruses.

 

You can't just count the number of exploits, it's not even worth arguing against that.

 

You can find articles to support any viewpoint on the internet, obviously an anti-virus company is going to write whatever it can to try to sell their product, but they're getting pretty desperate with that.

[anywebsite 10]

Not true - while humans are using their computers there will always be the opportunity for viruses to be on the system. UNIX based systems, while much more secure, are not immune to viruses.

 

There are currently several AV's available for linux, for example.

 

Did you even read the rest of the thread?

 

Name a popular Unix virus.

 

AV systems on Unix systems are used to scan for Windows viruses in files they may pass on to Windows systems, if the Unix server is running as a file or email server, for example.

[anywebsite 10]

I'm not entirely sure you know what a virus is anywebsite - it doesn't have to alter system files to be a virus, and if an unknowing user allows it to run, then the system must assume that it is authorised, else it would have to block everything.

 

I agree with Wikipedia & every other reasonable source I can find about what a virus is.

 

A computer virus is a computer program that can copy itself and infect a computer.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_virus

 

Unix like systems stop any program from infecting them without user authorisation. It blocks alterations to any system files that would allow it to infect the computer.

Edited March 14, 2010 by anywebsite

[Ghozer 112]

Of course they should produce a more secure system that doesn't need antivirus, like every other modern desktop computer operating system. Antivirus software wouldn't exist if Microsoft did their job properly.

 

I think your incorrect in this, because there are viruses for mac OSX, and Linux, there's even viruses for mobile phones... ANYTHING can get a virus, its just that windows is the most mainstream OS so its the more viable target, if linux was the main OS then there'd be more viruses for that instead...

[VideoPro 10]

I think your incorrect in this, because there are viruses for mac OSX,...

 

Name just one single Mac OS X virus please.

[waddler8 10]

Name just one single Mac OS X virus please.

 

What are we defining a "virus" as?

 

Macintosh Malware

 

 

Other interesting reading:

 

http://www.securityfocus.com/infocus/1695

I'm Safe from Viruses Because...

 

...I Don't Use Windows

 

Linux and other variations on the Unix theme are not generally overwhelmed with viruses, though some of the early research of Fred Cohen, whose work practically defined the anti-virus field, was carried out in Unix environments. But they are far from free of malicious software. Indeed, some of the earliest worms (notably the infamous Morris worm of the late 1980s) were Unix-specific. While Linux file-infectors have so far been more proof-of-concept than in-the-wild, there have been enough subsequent Linux worms (and indeed the occasional Solaris-specific slitherer) to constitute a significant problem.

 

 

The evangelical Linux view of Unix as being immune to malware because of its intrinsic security is based more on wishful thinking than on fact.

 

...There are no Mac Viruses

 

Just as some of the earliest worms targeted Unix, some of the earliest viruses targeted Mac users

 

 

http://research.swtch.com/2008/02/unix-viruses.html

Most Linux and OS X users have a frustratingly smug attitude of “we're immune to viruses, because we use Unix.” This is obviously false: the original Internet worm ran on Unix. The simple security mechanisms in Unix-based systems do raise the virus-writing bar slightly, but a more likely explanation of the lack of viruses on Unix-based systems is their lack of current market share: Windows users are simply a much bigger and therefore more attractive target.

 

Especially for these smug Unix users, it should be sobering to read Tom Duff's 1987 technical report “Viral Attacks on UNIX® System Security,” which describes a simple, benign disk-based virus targeted at Unix executables. Even working under the constraints of the Unix permission bits, Duff managed to infect 466 files across 46 systems over a period of a few months, including an experimental “secure” version of Unix