Would a nice god allow bad things to happen?

[devil6 10]

An atheist professor of philosophy speaks to his class on the problem science has with God, The Almighty. He asks one of his new students to stand and…

 

Prof: So you believe in God??

 

Student: Absolutely, sir.

 

Prof: Is God good?

 

Student: Sure

 

Prof: Is God all-powerful?

 

Student: Yes.

 

Prof: My brother died of cancer even though he prayed to God to heal him. Most of us would attempt to help others who are ill. But God didn’t. How is this God good then?

Hmm?

 

(Student is silent)

 

Prof: You can’t answer, can you? Let’s start again, young fellow. Is God good?

 

Student: Yes

 

Prof: Is Satan good?

 

Student: No

 

Prof: Where does Satan come from?

 

Student: From…God

 

Prof: That’s right. Tell me son, is there evil in this world?

 

Student:Yes

 

Prof: Evil is everywhere, isn’t it? And God did make everything. Correct?

 

Student: Yes

 

Prof: So who created evil?

 

(Student does not answer)

 

Prof: Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things exist in the world, don’t they?

 

Student: Yes, sir

 

Prof: So who created them?

 

(Student has no answer)

 

Prof: Science says you have 5 senses you use to identify and observe the world around you.

Tell me, son…Have you ever seen God?

 

Student: No, sir.

 

Prof: Tell us you have ever heard your God?

 

Student: No ,sir.

 

Prof: Have you ever felt your God, tasted your God, smelt your God? Have you ever had any sensory perception of God for that matter?

 

Student: No, sir. I’m afraid I haven’t.

 

Prof: Yet you still believe in Him?

 

Student: Yes

 

Prof: According to empirical, testable, demonstrable protocol, science says your GOD doesn’t exist.

 

What do you say to that, son?

 

Student: Nothing. I only have my faith.

 

Prof: Yes, Faith. And that is the problem science has.

 

Student: Professor, is there such a thing as heat?

 

Prof: Yes.

 

Student: And is there such thing as cold?

 

Prof: Yes

 

(The lecture theatre becomes very quiet with this turn of events.)

 

Student: Sir, you can have lots of heat, even more heat, superheat, megaheat, white heat , a little heat or no heat. But we don’t have anything called cold. We can hit 458 degrees below zero which is no heat , but we cant go any further after that. There is no such thing as cold. Cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat .We cannot measure cold. Heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat , sir, just the absence of it.

 

(There is a pin-drop silence in the lecture theatre)

 

Student: What about darkness, Professor? Is there such a thing as darkness?

 

Prof: Yes. What is night if there isn’t darkness?

 

 

Student: You’re wrong again, sir. Darkness is the absence of something .You can have low light, normal light, bright light , flashing light…But if you have no light constantly , you have nothing and its called darkness, isn’t it? In reality, darkness isn’t. If it were, you would be able to make darkness darker, wouldn’t you?

 

Prof: So what is the point you’re making, young man?'

 

Student: Sir, my point is your philosophical premise is flawed.

 

Prof: Flawed? Can you explain how?

 

Student: Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is life and then there is death, a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, science can’t even explain a thought. It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one. To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life: Just the absence of it.

Now tell me, Professor. Do you teach your student that they evolved from monkey?

 

Prof: If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, yes, of course , I do.

 

Student: Have you ever observed evolution with your OWN eyes, sir?

 

(The Professor shakes his head with a smile, beginning to realize where the argument is going)

 

Student: Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavor, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you not a scientist but a preacher?

 

(The class is in uproar)

 

Student: Is there anyone in this class who has ever seen the Professor’s brain?

 

(The class breaks out into laughter)

 

Student: Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor’s brain, felt it, touched or smelt it? No one appears to have done so .So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol , science says that you have no brain, sir.

With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?

 

(The room is silent. The professor stares at the student, his face unfathomable.)

 

Prof:I guess you’ll have to take them on faith, son.

 

Student: That is it sir…The link between man & God is FAITH. That is all that keeps us moving & alive.

 

Since the whole point of this made up religious brainwashing, wishy washy crap-invented by a religious person hangs on the following comment [i thought i'd chip in];

 

Darkness is the absence of something .You can have low light, normal light, bright light , flashing light…But if you have no light constantly , you have nothing and its called darkness

 

 

Darkness exists without light. Without light darkness still exists, so the whole metaphore for your ridiculous argument fails. The "student" in question must have never read a phsyics book aimed at 11 year olds, had they done so they may have stumbled accross photons. Go on-google it.

 

You could choose to continue this debate with me if you feel confident?

Edited November 6, 2009 by devil6

[devil6 10]

Student: Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is life and then there is death, a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, science can’t even explain a thought. It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one. To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life: Just the absence of it.

Now tell me, Professor. Do you teach your student that they evolved from monkey?

 

Ignorance is bliss. Of course we [iE me and you] are not descended from monkey, but our ancestors have gradually evolved from APES [not monkey] over 100's of thousands of years and with 100's of thousands of gradual variations. We are not direct descendants of monkeys and if you read a book or 2 aimed at over fives you would see that. READ A BOOK!!! other than the bible!!!! A typical naive interpretation of something you have no idea of.

[devil6 10]

Maybe it is equally possible you don't understand religious beliefs?

 

I wont bother with the rest as we all know where this thread is going to end up.... [/quote

 

I understand belief alright. I believe in SWFC, but i also know about FACTS

[devil6 10]

I agree with much of what you say, however the animal (or insect) kingdom is not cruel. Cruelty is to cause suffering deliberately for the sake of it.

I think one can be both a theist and evolutionist, but not necessarily accepting the mainstream religious texts.

 

 

Bingo-Cruelty is to cause suffering deliberately for the sake of it. An omniscient god would see the pain would he/she not?

[devil6 10]

Everyone has observed the process of evolution at work. Not necessarily by natural selection, as nobody has been alive for long enough, but evolution itself? Certainly. Contrary to the Christian claim, evolution isn't "just a theory", it's 100% proven, blindingly obvious and visible every day. Natural selection isn't proven, but widely accepted, but that isn't the statement made in the above quote.

 

When an interracial couple have a child with a skin tone at a midway shade, that is evolution at its most basic. Most breeds of dog, varied as they are, are man-made through artificial evolution. If you read the news you will see designer pets, dogs and cats bred to look like tigers, orange with black stripes. Ten years ago, such a breed didn't exist. But by selectively breeding enough times, over time you can change pretty much anything into anything else. And that is evolution, making one species from another, and we do it at will with all domesticated and farm animals to best adapt them for our needs.

 

-----------------

 

Can i add here the catholic church mad the biggest u-turn in history and accepted evolution as fact [it is undoubtedly fact, 100% proven, and undeniable fact]. This after 20'000 years of brainwashing people against it!!!!!!!!!!!!

[True_Brit 10]

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Can i add here the catholic church mad the biggest u-turn in history and accepted evolution as fact [it is undoubtedly fact, 100% proven, and undeniable fact]. This after 20'000 years of brainwashing people against it!!!!!!!!!!!!

Less than 2,000 years.

 

Careful what you put down in writing devil6, there are those on here that will crucify you if you're wrong...

 

http://www.experiencefestival.com/history_of_the_roman_catholic_church_-_early_catholic_church_34_ad__313_ad

[Karis 11]

Since the whole point of this made up religious brainwashing, wishy washy crap-invented by a religious person hangs on the following comment [i thought i'd chip in];

 

Darkness is the absence of something .You can have low light, normal light, bright light , flashing light…But if you have no light constantly , you have nothing and its called darkness

 

 

Darkness exists without light. Without light darkness still exists, so the whole metaphore for your ridiculous argument fails. The "student" in question must have never read a phsyics book aimed at 11 year olds, had they done so they may have stumbled accross photons. Go on-google it.

 

You could choose to continue this debate with me if you feel confident?

 

Absolutely. There are different kinds of faith. Faith in something real, such as faith in electricity, and then there's the faith in a divine being. Which has absolutely no basis - or grounding - in reality, and absolutely cannot be proven.

[Grahame 10]

Absolutely. There are different kinds of faith. Faith in something real, such as faith in electricity, and then there's the faith in a divine being. Which has absolutely no basis - or grounding - in reality, and absolutely cannot be proven.

 

Bad illustration there Karis. Even if we do not know how electricity is generated we know it is there when we see the results of its work and it is just the same with God.

 

The trouble with atheists is that they are like birds sitting on a High Tension pylon and if you told them there were 15,000 volts flowing through the bare cable they would not believe you and in their ignorance they would laugh at you .

 

But as soon as soon as the circuit is completed, in this case to earth and the power flowed through them they would be left in no doubt either about its existence or its power. In their ignorance they are dead in both body and in spirit.

 

The trouble with you and others like you is that you have no knowledge of God because you have cut yourself off and in your ignorance you have separated yourself from Him.

 

.

Edited November 7, 2009 by Grahame

[Karis 11]

Bad illustration there Karis. Even if we do not know how electricity is generated we know it is there when we see the results of its work and it is just the same with God.

.

 

Given a thousand years you would not be able to prove to me the existence of any divine being. However, I *can* certainly show you direct evidence of electricty.

 

I'll be happy to give you a demonstration. All you'll have to do is lick these cables. *grins*

 

To summarise: while *you* may *believe* there is a God. It's simply a delusion. It has absolutely nothing to do with your judgement that I've some how cut myself off from God. That's nonsense - the truth is that there is absolutely no evidence of any supernatural being, because the most logical option is that one does NOT exist.

 

You can believe in something that isn't real all you like (the Tooth Fairy), but, unlike electricity, it does NOT make it real.

[Grahame 10]

Given a thousand years you would not be able to prove to me the existence of any divine being. However, I *can* certainly show you direct evidence of electricty.

 

I'll be happy to give you a demonstration. All you'll have to do is lick these cables. *grins*

 

To summarise: while *you* may *believe* there is a God. It's simply a delusion. It has absolutely nothing to do with your judgement that I've some how cut myself off from God. That's nonsense - the truth is that there is absolutely no evidence of any supernatural being, because the most logical option is that one does NOT exist.

 

You can believe in something that isn't real all you like (the Tooth Fairy), but, unlike electricity, it does NOT make it real.

 

Talking about the tooth fairy shows the paucity of your argument. I do not believe the tooth fairy created the world but I do believe there are forces that did which I call God and what He did requires intelligence.

 

If you believe it all happened by chance then you must also believe in fairies and Father Christmas.

.

[BettyBooHoo! 10]

The trouble with you and others like you is that you have no knowledge of God because you have cut yourself off and in your ignorance you have separated yourself from Him.

 

.

 

How do you ''cut yourself off'' from something that doesn't exist???

[Tipex 10]

Create worms?

 

Make ants that kill other nests in order to steal their eggs to breed slaves?

 

Allow mantis to eat the father of thier child and sometimes the body after pro-creating?

 

Allow certain parasitic wasps paralise their grub victims by stinging, only to lay eggs in its body that eat them-alive-from the inside!

 

See the point in letting whales spend 100's of thousands of years moving to land only to dictate it has to go back to sea with lungs.

 

And that's the unconscious creatures of god acting almost as if he didn't exist at all and just doing whatever it takes-just to survive. Once we start with conscious minds we enter all new realms of god supervised evil.

 

My point here really says that anyone who claims to believe in evolution and god must enjoy the cruelty god insists most unconscious animals inflict on one another.

 

You can't truly understand evolution if you believe in god. The two can't go hand in hand. Evolution contradicts ALL religious [man made] scripture.

 

MAN HAS EXISTED FOR LESS THAN 1% OF OUR PLANETS LIFE. WITHOUT MAN THERE IS NO GOD. GOD HAS EXISTED FOR LESS THAN 250,000 YEARS, OUR PLANET HAS EXISTED FOR MORE THAN 4500 MILLION YEARS.

 

The concept of god goes against all scientific facts that we know. The threats of hell and the promise of heaven are strong pulls on our human psychology, but we don't have a scrap of evidence to support. All we have is some crappy man made documents, written over several hundred years and adapted, translated and doctored over a a 1000 year period. This is in what could be described as modern times, relative to the age of man. What did they believe in for the 230-240 thousand years before this tosh? Clue-probably more tosh long since forgotten!

 

The old testament lasted for around 15,000 years before being almost completely dismissed as nonsense Jesus. he decided to make up his own **** and bull version of life, and many people still prescribe to the biggest con that ever lived. Jesus conned and cons you all.

 

What god allows adults to touch children? What sort of god can't do anything about it? What sort of god do you believe in?

 

Why should god help you or me? we are given 2 paths and it's upto you which one you go down.

 

Life is full of emotions 'good and bad' which is why it's wonderful.