petopan   10 #289 Posted January 7, 2010 JOBEE...Just an awesome quote. It summarises it all for me. Thank you..Pete. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Smithster   10 #290 Posted January 7, 2010 Allow me to propose a hypothetical situation...  Imagine that human civilisation was wiped out in its entirity with the sole exception of one young fertile couple who had never been exposed to religion in their lives. All literature and computer data was destroyed, all churches and religious monuments flattened, every last copy of the bible, the Q'uran and all other holy scriptures destroyed; not one single reference to the religions of old remained.  Would the new civilisation that emerged from the offspring of the one surviving couple go on to adopt religion in the way that mankind has over the last few millenia? Would a new 'son of god' be sent to earth to spread the word? Would a new Muhammed be born and have the same revelations as did the Muhammed of modern-day Islam? Would a new Buddha be born who would then go on to achieve the same enlightenment?  If not, would that civilisation eventually come to the same conclusions as those in our society about the existence of god and the necessity for religious worship?  This is something I have thought about many times, and the inescapable conclusion I come to is that if any religion were to emerge in this new society, it would be completely different from those that are supported in the present day; thus meaning that god, the bible, jesus, allah and all of the things we associate with religion, are nothing but a construct of mankind - created from stories which have been exaggerated and mistranslated many times over, just like chinese whispers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Grahame   10 #291 Posted January 7, 2010 JOBEE...Just an awesome quote. It summarises it all for me. Thank you..Pete.  When the power of love overcomes the love of power, there will be peace.  That sums up Christianity.  . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Grahame   10 #292 Posted January 7, 2010 Allow me to propose a hypothetical situation... Imagine that human civilisation was wiped out in its entirity with the sole exception of one young fertile couple who had never been exposed to religion in their lives. All literature and computer data was destroyed, all churches and religious monuments flattened, every last copy of the bible, the Q'uran and all other holy scriptures destroyed; not one single reference to the religions of old remained.  Would the new civilisation that emerged from the offspring of the one surviving couple go on to adopt religion in the way that mankind has over the last few millenia? Would a new 'son of god' be sent to earth to spread the word? Would a new Muhammed be born and have the same revelations as did the Muhammed of modern-day Islam? Would a new Buddha be born who would then go on to achieve the same enlightenment?  If not, would that civilisation eventually come to the same conclusions as those in our society about the existence of god and the necessity for religious worship?  This is something I have thought about many times, and the inescapable conclusion I come to is that if any religion were to emerge in this new society, it would be completely different from those that are supported in the present day; thus meaning that god, the bible, jesus, allah and all of the things we associate with religion, are nothing but a construct of mankind - created from stories which have been exaggerated and mistranslated many times over, just like chinese whispers.  Are you saying people would not look at the wonder of nature and ask how it came about, and are you saying that people would not devise some sort of morality?  I think it is likely they would. . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
flamingjimmy   10 #293 Posted January 7, 2010 Are you saying people would not look at the wonder of nature and ask how it came about, and are you saying that people would not devise some sort of morality? No, that's not what he said at all, his post has gone over your head. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Smithster   10 #294 Posted January 7, 2010 (edited) Are you saying people would not look at the wonder of nature and ask how it came about, and are you saying that people would not devise some sort of morality? I think it is likely they would. .  Not saying that at all Grahame, quite the opposite in fact. I'm certain that they would wonder about the world and where it came from. But they would be free to do that without being spoon-fed some load of fiction about an all-seeing, all-loving sky goblin creating it all in six days then putting his feet up and having a cuppa on the seventh.  They would be free to make up their own minds about it, rather than being pressurised into believing in a certain explanation of events forced upon them from an early age by irrational people who have themselves been indoctrinated into a certain way of thinking.  It is possible that some of them would come to believe in an all-powerful being. But what I am questioning is if they would come to the conclusion that this 'god' is there to be worshipped or not, and if their religious dogma would in any way resemble that of christianity, judaism, islam, hinduism etc... I say it wouldn't.  That being the case, does it not follow that religion, as it exists now ,only exists because of the conclusions that our forefathers came to when experiencing that same wonder?  So in answer to the original point of this thread, there is no 'correct' one, because all religious beliefs began as a figment of the imaginations of our ancestors. Edited January 7, 2010 by Smithster Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Smithster   10 #295 Posted January 7, 2010 When the power of love overcomes the love of power, there will be peace.  That sums up Christianity.  .  Maybe it does. But one does not need to be a follower of jesus to appreciate the sentiment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
scallyboy   10 #296 Posted January 7, 2010 when was the last time you saw a war or human rights atrocities commited by an atheist Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
flamingjimmy   10 #297 Posted January 7, 2010 when was the last time you saw a war or human rights atrocities commited by an atheist  erm, quite recently. What's your point? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
Grahame   10 #298 Posted January 7, 2010 Not saying that at all Grahame, quite the opposite in fact. I'm certain that they would wonder about the world and where it came from. But they would be free to do that without being spoon-fed some load of fiction about an all-seeing, all-loving sky goblin creating it all in six days then putting his feet up and having a cuppa on the seventh.  They would be free to make up their own minds about it, rather than being pressurised into believing in a certain explanation of events forced upon them from an early age by irrational people who have themselves been indoctrinated into a certain way of thinking.  It is possible that some of them would come to believe in an all-powerful being. But what I am questioning is if they would come to the conclusion that this 'god' is there to be worshipped or not, and if their religious dogma would in any way resemble that of christianity, judaism, islam, hinduism etc... I say it wouldn't.  That being the case, does it not follow that religion, as it exists now ,only exists because of the conclusions that our forefathers came to when experiencing that same wonder?  So in answer to the original point of this thread, there is no 'correct' one, because all religious beliefs began as a figment of the imaginations of our ancestors.  That has to be true of 99% of all religions and would be totally true if there is no God, but if there is............? . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
flamingjimmy   10 #299 Posted January 7, 2010 That has to be true of 99% of all religions and would be totally true if there is no God, but if there is............? .  Then I really doubt he visited earth to give cryptic messages to humans during the bronze age.  If there really as an architect that created the universe, he/she probably has no idea that we even exist, we're that small and young. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...
[Matt] Â Â 10 #300 Posted January 7, 2010 When the power of love overcomes the love of power, there will be peace. Â That sums up Christianity. Â . Its sums up your rose tinted glasses view of a religion that does more to divide and conquer than to spread freedom through love... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Share this content via...